kudzurunner
4609 posts
Mar 18, 2014
4:46 AM
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Somebody posted this on Facebook, noting with exasperation that none of the artists were from Chicago. I thing there are other problems with the list, like the White-Folks-Rule! angle of the whole thing, but that's just quirkly ol' me. Please take a look and discuss:
http://noisefull.com/articles/thrill-now-30-1-contemporary-blues-artists-deserve-our-attention
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Komuso
288 posts
Mar 18, 2014
5:47 AM
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so white.
and so so wrong.
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Paul Cohen aka Komuso Tokugawa
HarpNinja - Your harmonica Mojo Dojo
Bringing the Boogie to the Bitstream
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The Iceman
1529 posts
Mar 18, 2014
5:49 AM
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Most artists of which I've never heard.
If anything, it is a vehicle in which to discover new music.
Best of blues? don't think so.
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The Iceman
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rbeetsme
1507 posts
Mar 18, 2014
5:56 AM
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Interesting list. Many new to me. Quite a few I wouldn't have listed as blues players. Was the author totally ignoring B B King, Sugar Blue, Keb Moe, Bobby Rush, James Cotton, Robert Cray, and many other living legends or is he just ignorant?
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Komuso
289 posts
Mar 18, 2014
6:00 AM
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I'd actually heard of most of them.
But then I've heard of a lot of others from across the rainbow as well!
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Paul Cohen aka Komuso Tokugawa
HarpNinja - Your harmonica Mojo Dojo
Bringing the Boogie to the Bitstream
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DukeBerryman
255 posts
Mar 18, 2014
6:01 AM
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Kinda hipster... but I guess the hipsters are here to stay.
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HarpNinja
3823 posts
Mar 18, 2014
6:18 AM
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Very hipster...but Sena and her dad are friends of mine, so no complaints there...and I am a huge Trucks fan...
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Mike
My Website
My Harmonica Effects Blog
Rock Harmonica Lessons
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Honkin On Bobo
1190 posts
Mar 18, 2014
6:43 AM
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Geez. Are we really going to go down this road again? Not enough black artists? Not enough Chicago artists?
This is just some schlubs personal favorites list. That's right, you too can become an "editor" on that site simply by sending in a name and an e-mail address.! (see the flashing box on the right side of the website).
In defense of the guy, he never says its a " best of the blues" list, just some current artists that are worth giving a listen to.
I haven't heard all of the list, but I have listened to quite a bit of material from Tedeschi, Trucks, Haynes, Kenny Wayne Sheperd, Seasick, Imelda May and The Black Keys.
All of them are fine musicians/artists, and definitely worth a listen.
I really don't see the point of a my list is better than yours debate. Haven't we argued the inclusion/ exclusion/ disrespect of/ stealing the music of black artists to death???
Edit: If you're new to the forum, disregard the above and have at it. Spoiler: The thread eventually gets locked.
Last Edited by Honkin On Bobo on Mar 18, 2014 12:40 PM
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Goldbrick
353 posts
Mar 18, 2014
7:19 AM
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I dislike lists of this type thing. But it does say contemporary and mentions that there are some great old bluesmen.
I love some of the artists like Imelda May , but she is a far cry from blues-her act is pure rockabilly-swing
Coulda had Gary Clark Jr. or some others on there- but its one internet dude's opinion so why let it bother you
I have to say the race thing on this board is pretty silly tho
If a white person complains it seems patronizing and when black folks complain it can be perceived as the race card.
I know I have a mixed racial family-many who are artists and musicians and we never discuss the color of anybody-just the quality of the work.
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Littoral
1049 posts
Mar 18, 2014
9:10 AM
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If you play harmonica you were probably in jail.
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Komuso
290 posts
Mar 18, 2014
9:15 AM
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>>I have to say the race thing on this board is pretty silly tho
It just depends who the poster follows.
Kind of weird to get 31 people though and all White euro or american. lol! There are other races out there that play music I'm sure!
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Paul Cohen aka Komuso Tokugawa
HarpNinja - Your harmonica Mojo Dojo
Bringing the Boogie to the Bitstream
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CWinter
140 posts
Mar 18, 2014
9:16 AM
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I think that list is quite worthy of Facebook, and all that that entails.
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kudzurunner
4611 posts
Mar 18, 2014
9:32 AM
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This is a forum about blues harmonica and the blues. Blues IS the race thing. It's impossible, literally impossible, to talk about the history of the blues (harmonica), the meanings of the blues (songs sung by blues harp players), the greatest creative artists who have ever played the blues (harmonica), and the money made by those who have commercialized the (blues harmonica) music, without talking about race--which is to say, without talking about blacks and whites in America.
Anybody who says that "the race thing on this board is pretty silly," as though race is somehow entirely extrinsic to what we do as blues harmonica players, needs to get hip, quick. The race thing? There are some sorts of forums where "the race thing" might not be relevant. It is entirely relevant here.
Let me be even clearer than that. There are some people who would like the world of blues harmonica to be a pastoral retreat of sorts, one isolated from the political and cultural-political concerns of the larger world. Sort of like the musical version of go-karting or model railroads or scale-model helicopters with tiny two-stroke engines. These same people--and it trends heavily in the direction of a white-guys club--want to torpedo any discussion of race, want to insist that it's "too bad that young black people don't like the blues" (even though there are many younger black blues players), and want, at the same time, to hold up a dozen of the black greats as models for how real blues harmonica should be played.
I like talking shop as much as the next guy, but I also recognize the contradictions (and errors) in those who would settle comfortably into that white-guy stance. Talking race isn't always comfortable, but it's part of the deal. Needless to say, Big Walter and Little Walter lived race, so they didn't need to talk about it, but in any case they didn't have the luxury of ignoring it. Neither, I suggest, should we.
And of course I'm saying all these thing respectfully, goddammit, with nothing but warm mushy feelings for my fellow forumites. Because the creed IS the creed.
Last Edited by kudzurunner on Mar 18, 2014 9:43 AM
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CWinter
142 posts
Mar 18, 2014
9:42 AM
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Geeze, I dunno Adam. I thought we were all trying to take the race thing OUT of music. Actually, I thought we were, as a country, as a people, trying to take the race thing OUT of EVERYTHING.
To suggest that someone who doesn't think in terms of race, "needs to get hip quick".........
Man, I just don't get where you're coming from.
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kudzurunner
4612 posts
Mar 18, 2014
9:44 AM
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I've never said we're trying to take the race thing out of music. We're trying to have an honest conversation about the music. You can't do that if you insist on purging race, a priori, from the conversation.
There are many ways and many moments in which the blues can serve a healing function in matters of race. That doesn't mean that blues ALWAYS does that.
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CWinter
143 posts
Mar 18, 2014
9:54 AM
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Ok, what would you honestly like to talk about?
I seriously don't know....
"Let me be even clearer than that. There are some people who would like the world of blues harmonica to be a pastoral retreat of sorts, one isolated from the political and cultural-political concerns of the larger world. Sort of like the musical version of go-karting or model railroads or scale-model helicopters with tiny two-stroke engines. These same people--and it trends heavily in the direction of a white-guys club--want to torpedo any discussion of race, want to insist that it's "too bad that young black people don't like the blues" (even though there are many younger black blues players), and want, at the same time, to hold up a dozen of the black greats as models for how real blues harmonica should be played."
Who are these people who would like the world of blues harmonica to be like that? And more importantly, why have they taken up so much space in your head?
Last Edited by CWinter on Mar 18, 2014 9:59 AM
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isaacullah
2680 posts
Mar 18, 2014
10:23 AM
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Not white, not black. Come from a place that REALLY knows something about the Blues (Beirut, Lebanon). So where do these guys fit in the scheme of things? Is there room for brown in the black vs. white "Who owns the Blues" debate?
And yes, there is (good!) harp content too:
If you ask me, my friends, here is your modern blues scene. It's just going on way off your radar.
There's a lot more on their YouTube Channel.
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YouTube! Soundcloud!
Last Edited by isaacullah on Mar 18, 2014 10:24 AM
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Goldbrick
354 posts
Mar 18, 2014
10:24 AM
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I am just saying I listen to blues I like and dont care what color the people are playing it.
I guarantee I am double damn as " hip" to the race thing as any white person can be having lived my childhood in the inner city during the 60's and raising two young biracial kids as a single white parent after their black mother passed away
The only thing I hate to hear is someone like Clapton singing the line " pretty wimmens standing in line" or other dialectical stuff - other than that I don't care what color anybody is, as long as they are blue inside
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isaacullah
2681 posts
Mar 18, 2014
10:32 AM
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Also, here's a dude from Sweden. About as far away from Chicago or the Mississippi Delta as you can get. But listen to this song and tell me he doesn't have the Blues. I dare you.
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YouTube! Soundcloud!
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isaacullah
2682 posts
Mar 18, 2014
10:39 AM
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PS, I think the biggest problem with the list in the OP isn't race or geography. It's that most of the people on that list don't actually play the Blues.
I'd keep the Black Diamond Heavys, the Black Keys, Seasick Steve, and Small Blues Trap on the list (and probably a couple of the others that I haven't heard of too), but at least 3/4 of the list doesn't play blues music.
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YouTube! Soundcloud!
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kudzurunner
4613 posts
Mar 18, 2014
10:50 AM
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@CWinter: I'm willing to believe that YOU are not like "those people." So talk race with me. In what way do you see race shaping the historical and contemporary world of blues, and blues harmonica?
In answer to your question, though: We had a young black member, talented, inquisitive, and brave, who dared to raise questions about race, and it bothered a lot of people around here. I don't know if he's still a member.
Last Edited by kudzurunner on Mar 18, 2014 10:52 AM
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Buzadero
1176 posts
Mar 18, 2014
10:55 AM
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Isaac,
The "Wanton Bishops". Nice. Thanks for the hipping.
Gracias.
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~Buzadero
Underwater Janitor, Patriot
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Honkin On Bobo
1192 posts
Mar 18, 2014
11:03 AM
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+1 for The Wanton Bishops
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CWinter
145 posts
Mar 18, 2014
11:09 AM
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How do I see race shaping the historical and contemporary world of blues and blues harmonica?
You don't really ask yes or no questions, do you?
I think race has already shaped the historical aspect of blues music. It was race, and oppression, and sharecropping, etc. that spawned this beautiful music. I see what you're saying about race being almost the definition of blues music, an integral part of it.
As far as race or anything else shaping the future of blues and/or blues harmonica..........I don't know. I don't think about these types of issues much....maybe I should.
How do YOU see race shaping the future of blues/blues harmonica?
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Shaganappi
98 posts
Mar 18, 2014
11:28 AM
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When you can see the actual people behind color, you know that the world is getting better. It's still a long ways off but someday maybe these discussions will not be necessary or at least they will be largely irrelevant. History, culture, tradition, etc. all have a use as to not repeating the past but they too often just keep wounds open for too long.
When are we going to let it go and spend our time looking to the future rather than to the past. The "black" problem. The "gay" problem. The "feminist" problem. The "aboriginal" problem. The "________" problem. (there are lots that I probably am not supposed to mention, maybe even including these, so fill it in as you want. As John Lennon said, "Imagine …" and then go there. Make the world a better place.
Anyone who has skin in the game of life has to recognize that they don't want this to go on forever. Some of us have a few genes on a chromosome or two that prevent us from getting sunburn. Some of us are defectively freckled. So what? Life awaits.
Good post isaacullah.
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JInx
758 posts
Mar 18, 2014
11:39 AM
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"Man, I just don't get where you're coming from." CW
Exercising inner demons.
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Sun, sun, sun
Burn, burn, burn
Soon, soon, soon
Moon, moon, moon
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nacoran
7622 posts
Mar 18, 2014
11:44 AM
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Isaac, did you link a link to this page inside this page? What sort of evil HTML magic is this? :)
edit- Statistically, the fact that 31 out of 31 are white seems to indicate that the post was in fact, not seeing the person behind the race.
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Nate
Facebook
Thread Organizer (A list of all sorts of useful threads)
Last Edited by nacoran on Mar 18, 2014 11:49 AM
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isaacullah
2683 posts
Mar 18, 2014
11:48 AM
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@nate: Huh? The link I posted goes to a youtube channel (just confirmed it in my browser). Perhaps something squirely is going on in your browser?
@Shagganappi: Thanks!
@Buz and Honkin: Glad to be of service! :)
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YouTube! Soundcloud!
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nacoran
7623 posts
Mar 18, 2014
11:56 AM
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Strange, it's working okay now, but the second window was showing a scroll view of the page. It kind of worked, in a meta kind of way. :)
I opened this tab up a while back, but didn't get to reading it. I notice you had edited the post. Maybe
I'd opened it before you fixed it? I was just curious if maybe we were having a meta post trend. The other day Frank made a post on how to post pictures in which his picture didn't post correctly. (I think that actually turned out to be an attempt to display HTML gone wrong.)
I noticed yesterday that I'd my listening for the day had consisted of Chilean hip-hop, French hip-hop blues and Russian modern blues. I didn't understand much lyrical content, but it was all good stuff.
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Nate
Facebook
Thread Organizer (A list of all sorts of useful threads)
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Philosofy
526 posts
Mar 18, 2014
12:31 PM
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Sort of on topic, but I was just racking my brain to think of current blues artists under the age of 40 that are black. Brandon Bailey comes to mind, but not any others. However, I don't listen to a lot of contemporary blues, and I tend not to think about people as black or white.
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TheoBurke
609 posts
Mar 18, 2014
12:53 PM
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It's an inescapable fact that blues is an African American art form , as is jazz and, for that matter, rock and roll at its most vital, and that there are talented, brilliant and exciting black musicians who continue to play the music, innovate within its historical definitions and extend those definitions to keep the music contemporary, alive, and most important, relevant to the way people, players and listeners, live today.
It's my belief, inscribed deeply on the most fundamental set of moral convictions I have, that to ignore the plentitude of black talent, whether they are young, middle aged, or elderly, if you're a music editor, a record company executive, a promoter specializing in blues festivals, a club owner highlight blues and roots acts, is racism, clear and simple. It's a racism on a subtle level, but damaging all the same; a decision was made to exclude black musicians from this list. Compiling a list of the worthy is always problematic,fraught with all sorts of dangers because any number of readers can be offended for insular reasons no writer can predict. But what's offensive about this list is the laziness of the selection. I happen to like a number of the artists here and believe musicians like Black Keys, Joe Bonamassa, Susan Tedeschi and others are legitimate blues musicians.
Their skin color isn't their fault, and , to me,the quality of their chops and the authenticity of their feeling are "real". I will also give the writers credit for including a good number of women on the list.
Still, the lack of black musicians is inexcusable and reveals a conspicuous , egregious choice by the editors to remain loyal to their skin hue. Where was Sugar Blue? Lucky Peterson? The Eric Gale Band?Shemekia Copeland? Alvin Hart? Sapphire?Gary Clark Jr? Keb Mo? These players deserve wider recognition no less than the ones who made the list; I have a strong, strong suspicions that an inexcusable laziness directed the selection process, formed, no doubt, by a profound lack of curiosity on the part of the "critics" who, by the definition of their job, are supposed to knowledgeable and curious about things that fall outside their comfort zone. I suspect also that those making the selection were entirely white; as such,they stuck with the skin color they are most comfortable with.
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Ted Burke
http://www.youtube.com/user/TheoBurke?feature=mhee
http://ted-burke.com
tburke4@san.rr.coM
Last Edited by TheoBurke on Mar 18, 2014 1:08 PM
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kudzurunner
4614 posts
Mar 18, 2014
1:03 PM
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@Philsophy: Marquise Knox, Jarekus Singleton, Mr. Sipp, Annika Chambers, Chris Bell.
Plus Shemekia Copeland and Gary Clark, Jr., as Theo notes.
Those are just off the top of my head. I'll have more for you presently.
I don't know how old Roach, the lead singer of Cafe R&B, is, but she's amazing live.
Last Edited by kudzurunner on Mar 18, 2014 1:07 PM
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Philosofy
527 posts
Mar 18, 2014
1:24 PM
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Thanks Adam. I've never heard of any of them except for Shemekia, and for some reason I thought she was older.
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isaacullah
2684 posts
Mar 18, 2014
1:28 PM
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@kudzu: Don't forget Cedric Burnside.
By the way, if you are looking for different sort of list, complied by different editors, try this one: http://www.southernsoulrnb.com/top_chart.cfm. I will be among the first to admit that I really don't know much about any of the artists on that list, but they appear to be the "Top 100" contemporary black Blues musicians. I bet there's plenty of 'em under 30 too (wish I could still say that about myself!)
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YouTube! Soundcloud!
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blueswannabe
446 posts
Mar 18, 2014
2:39 PM
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I don't put much stock In a list like that. There are so many issues associated with this list and we can speculate all day. who is making the list? What is the musical predisposition of the author of he list? What is her or his understanding and depth of knowledge of the blues genre? Why is the list being created? For whom is the list created? And what are the criteria for this list.?. There are a lot of other white harp,players who could be on this list. There are clearly a lack of black players who could be on this list but aren't. How important is this list?.. I might find this list more significant if it were created by the wc handy society or some other highly regarded blues society
Last Edited by blueswannabe on Mar 18, 2014 5:15 PM
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jnorem
112 posts
Mar 18, 2014
2:39 PM
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Young Afro-Americans don't like blues, they're not interested. I live in a mostly black neighborhood, and it's almost 100% rap or hip hop or whatever it's called now.
So it's no surprise that you'll find the vast majority of blues players are white. White people are what's keeping blues music alive; if it had to subsist entirely on the input and endorsement of Afro-Americans, blues would be pretty much nonexistent.
Edit: I'm not at all impressed by this list, and I'm in no way suggesting that I'm in favor of excluding African-American blues artists from being recognized. I would have nothing but contempt for such an exclusion.
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Call me J
Last Edited by jnorem on Mar 18, 2014 2:44 PM
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kudzurunner
4616 posts
Mar 18, 2014
3:00 PM
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Here are some more young African Americans who love and perform blues. Jnorem, you need to get out more. There is a large black youth audience for blues, at least in Mississippi, Memphis, and other parts of the mid-South. This claim is based partly on recent field research--surveys--that one of my grad students has been doing. It ain't all about hip-hop. Here, in any case, are those names. More to come:
Selwyn Birchwood
Blind Boy Paxton
Valerie June
John Black
Eddie Cotton
JJ Thames
Cedric Burnside
Kent Burnside
Sharde Thomas
Lucious Spiller
Omar Coleman
Shawn Holt
Queen Emily
Ursula Ricks
Rhiannon Giddens
Dom Flemons
Hubby Jenkins
Leyla McCalla
Marcus "Mookie" Cartwright
Here's Mookie three years ago. He stopped by when the Blues Docs were playing the streets of Clarksdale last year during the juke joint festival and absolutely killed. People were running up and throwing money at him, literally.
Here's Leyla McCalla:
Shawn Holt:
J. J. Thames:
Sharde Thomas and her brothers: last exemplars of the North Mississippi fife & drums style:
Point made, I hope. Yes, the article that I posted at the beginning of this thread was, we might say, "just offering a list." But to anybody who actually knows the full spectrum of the music, it wasn't just an ignorant list, it was an insulting list. Un-rebutted, it helps consolidate a mistaken view that young black people don't play, or listen to, the blues. That IS a mistake, and it needs to be corrected.
Last Edited by kudzurunner on Mar 18, 2014 3:15 PM
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jnorem
113 posts
Mar 18, 2014
3:14 PM
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In that case I'm pleased to say that I stand corrected. And I'd like very much to get out more. It's just that getting out requires having money, and I don't have any money.
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Call me J
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MP
3126 posts
Mar 18, 2014
3:15 PM
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I counted eleven women artists. Of female MBH members;
I know of, none are visible at present. Thin Lizzy, Big Nancy (of the late? Sonny Rhodes Band) and Christelle. Three? Interesting.
Edit: Of course that 31 list is pretty bad, well really bad but at least it included a lot of women artists.
Just another way of looking at the topic at hand.
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Affordable Reed Replacement
Marks Harmonica Tune-up
Click user name MP for contact info
Last Edited by MP on Mar 18, 2014 3:34 PM
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kudzurunner
4617 posts
Mar 18, 2014
3:18 PM
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Fair enough. I should point out that I argue just as vigorously against those, such as Corey Harris, who make a crusade of insisting that "blues is black music." It is and it isn't. It's both things. I'm just trying to broaden the conversation. By any means necessary. :)
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CWinter
148 posts
Mar 18, 2014
5:05 PM
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I LOVE, Leyla McCalla. That is some real nice music.
It's great to hear that, in Mississippi and other places in the South, the blues is turning out new generations of practitioners. Up here in the Midwest though, I don't think kids care or even know much about real music, whatever their color or race.
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Goldbrick
356 posts
Mar 18, 2014
5:43 PM
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Last Edited by Goldbrick on Mar 18, 2014 5:47 PM
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Frank
4055 posts
Mar 18, 2014
7:15 PM
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Can't forget the old white guys, this is LIVE too :)
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kudzurunner
4618 posts
Mar 18, 2014
7:44 PM
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Here are some more:
Homemade Jamz
C.J. Walker (17-year old guitarist in KC, nephew of Ted Taylor)
Peterson Brothers Band
Davell Crawford
Alex Dixon
Dwayne Dopsie
Kirk Fletcher
Robert Randolph
Destini Rawls
Chris Ardoin
Chris Canas
Kee-Eso Pitchford (just turned 40)
Anthony Sherard
Christone "Kingfish" Ingram
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jnorem
114 posts
Mar 18, 2014
8:35 PM
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Homemade Jams. Kids, nice.
C.J. Walker. Couldn't find him anywhere.
Peterson Brothers Band. Awful. Need a lot of work.
Davell Crawford. I don't see how this is blues.
Alex Dixon. I don't see how this is blues.
Dwayne Dopsie is a zydeco accordion player. He's good.
Kirk Fletcher. Now you're taking!
Robert Randolph. Saw him on Austin City Limits ages ago. Not blues.
Destini Rawls. Not blues.
Chris Ardoin. Didn't hear anything that sounded anything like blues.
Chris Canas. Dreadful.
Kee-Eso Pitchford. Not really blues and not very good.
Anthony Sherard. Couldn't find him anywhere.
Christone "Kingfish" Ingram. Okay. He plays guitar.
Why are you putting this mediocrity up here, Adam? To prove what? Are we opposed to crap our pants for anyone and everyone who attempts to play something meaningful in or close to the blues genre?
Can we not at some point say, "This really isn't very good at all." Maybe I don't need to get out more, after all, if this is what awaits me.
Last Edited by jnorem on Mar 18, 2014 8:37 PM
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DoubleJ
53 posts
Mar 18, 2014
10:24 PM
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I am a student of an art form that sprang from racial strife. It always brought some catharsis, a bit of distraction and even a sense of comfort.
What a blessing that this origin can be discussed candidly and we can witness this music's healing power in the embryonic work of some young people...
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rosco1
35 posts
Mar 19, 2014
3:21 PM
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speaking of young blues artists, I don't get why Larry and Steve McCray don't get more attention. Larry (guitar, vocal) and Steve (Drums, vocal)are as good as it gets:
http://youtu.be/SBBY1aysmtg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-u7CIvaLsA4&list=PLFE9D10FA654DCCE6
Last Edited by rosco1 on Mar 19, 2014 3:22 PM
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jnorem
115 posts
Mar 19, 2014
3:27 PM
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I don't get why Larry Cray would be considered a blues artist. He's not really playing blues music in either of those videos, is he?
He's very good at what he does, great guitar player and there's a blues influence in there for sure, but it's not really blues, is it?
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Call me J
Last Edited by jnorem on Mar 19, 2014 3:29 PM
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kudzurunner
4620 posts
Mar 19, 2014
4:32 PM
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J: You're joking, right?
Davell Crawford. Louisiana blues pianist in the Dr. John mold. Here he's doing a blues classic by Percy Mayfield:
Alex Dixon: Willie Dixon's grandson, performing "Spoonful":
Destini Rawls, daughter of bluesman Johnny Rawls, singing that Etta James blues classic, "I'd Rather Go Blind."
Chris Canas. "Down Home Blues." He's not terrible.
Anthony "Big A" Sherrod. Sorry. Got that last name a little wrong:
You're free to draw the circle more and more tightly around your convictions. But I think that most members of this forum can be persuaded by evidence. I've posted 10 videos of young black blues players to go along with two dozen names. They may not all be Buddy Guy, but then again, we're not all Jason Ricci. The videos that I've posted, however, bespeak a broadly-based cultural fact. I'm glad you like Kirk Fletcher. But he has lots of company. There's a lot of good blues being made by younger black artists. That's my point.
Last Edited by kudzurunner on Mar 19, 2014 4:35 PM
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rosco1
36 posts
Mar 19, 2014
4:45 PM
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If Larry McCray isn't blues, nobody is. I couldn't really get the video imbed to do what I wanted, but Larry is all over youtube playing blues standards in addition to the EXTREMELY bluesy stuff I attempted to post. Why every blues fan doesn't know about him is a mystery to me.
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