jim
538 posts
Dec 14, 2010
1:38 AM
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Nope, I don't work for seydel
Yes, I support them because I like them
Nope, they don't pay me
Yes, I'm interested in you on my forum
Nope, not for income
Yes, it's an independent forum
Nope, Leonid didn't lie. Gonna be interesting stuff there.
And chromaticblues has just spelled out what I was saying before. Let me take a snapshot of the thread...
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www.truechromatic.com
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Chinaski
148 posts
Dec 14, 2010
3:16 AM
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Having been a customer of both Brian and Joe, I can be among many to vouch for their products and customer service being first rate. I'm not sure who is supposedly selling 'quickly tweaked' $300 harps.
It's pretty clear who has come out of this thread with dignity and where I will continue going for outstanding products.
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Myspace
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Leonid
112 posts
Dec 14, 2010
4:32 AM
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Guys explain to me what exactly caused so much anger towards me and Jim. I trying to be as polite as Russian person can possibly be :) I am not insulting anyone (unless I have been unresonably insulted first).
All I am saying is that there is a resourse with lots of information which can benefit you tremendously and it is free.
You behave like a sect who doesn't want to know that the earth is a sphere or anything else outside your comfort zone.
I have mentioned previously that I owned/repaired/tried many custom harps from many top customozers. They all nice but doesn't mean you cannot do it youself and you have to convert to buddism .
In fact, the only person who can make a perfect instrument for you is YOU!!! Nobody knows your playing style better, articulation etc.
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clamsharpplayer
28 posts
Dec 14, 2010
5:17 AM
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@Leonid How do you make money?
Nothing is free. Another question.
@jim Why are you interested in me going to your forum? How do pay for your website?
I get the feeling jim is trying to make money off his website. Am I wrong?
Profiting by giving away the schematics of some small business mans creation is F**cked Up
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never too late to start all over again
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HarpNinja
840 posts
Dec 14, 2010
5:43 AM
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@Leonid,
That isn't what you said about customs earlier. You stated that there are people selling $300 harps that are quickly setup. Even when not trying to infere your meaning, you literally said what you said, which was different than your last post.
While I don't totally agree that the only person who can make a perfect harp is yourself, there is definitely some wisdom in that post.
If anyone can make a Buddha Harp or Joe Spiers Stage III that actually plays like said harps, I'd love to try one. I am not the world's best player or anything, but my style is technically demanding and I OB a lot. The harps I have from those guys are perfect, IMO.
I don't think I've made any judgements about the posting of the pics public on this forum or anything, but this thread is depressing.
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Mike
VHT Special 6 Amp for Harp Blog
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GermanHarpist
1917 posts
Dec 14, 2010
6:08 AM
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Yup, I agree with HarpNinja. I don't know what to do with this thread... If only Nacoran was here with his wise words.
What about...
What's been said was said. What's been posted was posted. It would probably be best to keep further comments and judgments to ourselves and let this thread die.
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The MBH thread-thread thread!
Last Edited by on Dec 14, 2010 6:14 AM
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BigBlindRay
32 posts
Dec 14, 2010
6:09 AM
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Now im curious to know if Mozart was a Piano Player or Piano Maker?
Big Blind Ray's YouTube Channel
Mavis and her China Pigs
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jim
539 posts
Dec 14, 2010
6:24 AM
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@clamsharpplayer:
I pay with my money for hosting my 4 websites and 2 forums. Why am I interested in you going to my forum? Why aren't you interested in that yourself? You can't even attach a picture here. Not speaking about finding anything older than 3 days.
I used to have the seydel affiliate program on the website but it was cancelled when I changed my collaboration with them. Forum is independent, their logo is up there because of my own liking of that brand.
Harmonica is my hobby, and how Leonid or I pay for this and that is frankly speaking none of your business.
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www.truechromatic.com
Last Edited by on Dec 14, 2010 6:25 AM
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jim
540 posts
Dec 14, 2010
6:33 AM
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By the way...
@BigBlindRay:
just looked at your youtube channel. Good stuff, have you thought on making teach-yourself videos on basic technique? I mean breathing, bending and stuff.
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www.truechromatic.com
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MJ
237 posts
Dec 14, 2010
8:13 AM
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They were sitting around the campfire when someone said, "Tell us a story John" John began.....
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sorin
215 posts
Dec 14, 2010
8:28 AM
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All this reminds me of :
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Free video harp tabs and backing tracks
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captainbliss
311 posts
Dec 14, 2010
8:55 AM
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@sorin: Thank you! You made me laugh. And laugh.
@everyone: RE /quickly tweaked./ I wonder whether Leonid means that these customs are so well set up that all he has to give 'em is a quick tweak to suit his playing style (rather than hours of customisation on an OOTB)? Maybe it's meant as a compliment?
EDIT: @Kingley: /I'd also add that if you are playing at volume levels like those mentioned by Leonid in the average sized British pub then you are simply playing TOO DAMN LOUD!!!!/ Amen, amen and amen again.
xxx
Last Edited by on Dec 14, 2010 9:08 AM
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ZackPomerleau
1345 posts
Dec 14, 2010
9:27 AM
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I think you posting schematics of the HarpGear 50 is none of your business. I own expensive harmonicas and anyone who says they are quickly tweaked and overpriced probably broke theirs when they got them because they blow too hard.
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chromaticblues
397 posts
Dec 14, 2010
9:46 AM
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PLEASE LOCK THIS THREAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The thing that bothers me the most about this is what Brian said about getting rewarded for his hard work!
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Learning Harp
26 posts
Dec 14, 2010
9:55 AM
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"I think you posting schematics of the HarpGear 50 is none of your business."
I didn't see any schematics just photos. If there was I doubt you would find anything you have not seen already in terms of modifications to guitar amps to convert them for harp use? I'm pretty sure the people who would build an amp such as this would not be the said manufacturer's clientele to begin with, meaning no loss in revenue for them.
Last Edited by on Dec 14, 2010 9:56 AM
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KeithE
137 posts
Dec 14, 2010
10:03 AM
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I looked at the pictures early on. There were no schematics posted. There was no bill of materials posted. The amplifier was not disassembled as far as I can tell. It was just pictures taken from various angles. There was nothing in the thread indicating that anyone was going to make an attempt to clone the amplifier, or otherwise enter the business.
Maybe people would be o.k. with the pictures if Leonid blurred some of the component markings? And then if people object to this censoring they can buy alternate amplifiers? Similar to how some people will only run software licensed under the GNU license. (A license that Jim doesn't use for his software as far as I know.)
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MP
1130 posts
Dec 14, 2010
10:38 AM
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why are people upset? no harm has been done. as KeithE pointed out, there are no schematics or loss of revenue to anyone.
i suggest the combatants exchange e-mail info.
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MP
hibachi cook for the yakuza
doctor of semiotics
superhero emeritus
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HarpNinja
846 posts
Dec 14, 2010
10:45 AM
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I clicked on the link today to see if anyone had posted on that forum about this topic. There were some interesting comments on general design that had nothing to do with the actual circuit as unique to this amp's design. I haven't seen the pics nor do I know anything about electrical design or how to build a harp amp, but there was some interesting feedback none the less.
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Mike
VHT Special 6 Amp for Harp Blog
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ZackPomerleau
1346 posts
Dec 14, 2010
11:19 AM
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Excuse me for my mistake, I MEANT to say "photos."
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jim
541 posts
Dec 14, 2010
11:48 AM
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KeithE,
Palm Heroes is licensed under Apache. It's the most open license (you can use/modify/free/or paid with attribution, and of course you can download our source code. We can't upload our most up-do-date source code (due to licensing with Apple), but that source is more than enough if you want to power-boost the beginning of your game project.
P.S. I think this thread is fine :D Neither me nor Leonid insulted anyone. As for some other guys... read the thread and see who is who.
@HarpNinja: thanks. We have 4 tech guys on forum who are good in circuits etc. I read what they write and don't understand a thing. George M gave Leonid some advice on modding the amp to reduce feedback AFAIK. Pity I have no skills in schematics... It has always seemed a world of endless possibilities to me.
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www.truechromatic.com
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toddg
3 posts
Dec 14, 2010
11:57 AM
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I really don't see why anyone would be upset just because someone took a picture of a amps Chassis .
I just Googled Amp Chassis and there were tons of pics . Most guitar amp builders don't care and a lot put the pictures on their own sites to show you the quality of their work !!
here's the google link
http://www.google.com/images?hl=en&rlz=1G1TSNA_ENUS363&q=amp%20chassis&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&biw=1310&bih=521
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HarpNinja
848 posts
Dec 14, 2010
12:00 PM
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I used to be on thegearpage.net a lot and there were always gut shots. In fact, when buying/selling amps, they were almost always posted right in the thread if not private messaged to anyone interested.
I am not judging right or wrong, just sharing that this isn't an uncommon practice.
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Mike
VHT Special 6 Amp for Harp Blog
Last Edited by on Dec 14, 2010 12:08 PM
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rbeetsme
329 posts
Dec 14, 2010
12:00 PM
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That's why we keep buying more gear. The big amp won't break up at low volumes so we buy one of Gregs 'Zoos or Brians small amps. The twin 8's can't keep up with the drummer or guitar player so we buy a Sonny Jr. or a HarpKing. Or if you are Rod Piazza, 2 Harpking 6X10"s. As for tone, everyone seems to agree that tube amps sound best, but everyones' sound is (should be) different. We have a lot of choices now, enjoy! BTW: What was the purpose of this thread?
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5F6H
438 posts
Dec 14, 2010
12:05 PM
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Most guys who think that they can build amps, simply cannot from a photo, (or a schem, or a layout), like that posted by Jim & Leonid. Those that can, are busy doing their own thing. No one is aiming to undermine Brian (not even the Chinese & their speculated warehouse filled with Sonny Jrs, Harpkings, Meteors & HGs awaiting cloning...the Chinese want to get rich, cornering the harp amp market isn't going to do that, not in the fashion they expect anyway). If anyone wanted an amp like that they would go to Brian & buy it, because believe it or not, the HG50 is superb value for money...here in the UK I would struggle to gather together the parts for what Leonid paid for a completed amp. Brian deserves whatever rewards are coming his way, but he is not going to retire to his own private island, nor never going to need to worry about money again from sales of harp amps. He, Gary O & Scooter all do what they do because they love amplified harp tone & want to share the benefits/inspire players/offer harp players headache free solutions to everyday problems.
If I was Brian, having criticisms aired in public, before any attempt at dialogue with him was made, would be what would irk me most...posting of the pics in this scenario was not the best etiquette but Leonid felt, at that time, that his expectations had not been met...I am sure that they will be...but it was only a matter of time before this picture posting thing happened - it was always going to one day, during an e-bay auction or such like.
Sonny Jr & Meteor have had their circuits on display for years, I very much doubt that it has affected sales one iota.
I don't want to look like I need to have the last word on this, I will try not to post on this thread again if I can help it, but I do feel that anything that should be said was already said a while back. For sometime posts have just been perpetuated sniping...and not even between the main parties affected. If you are of the opinion that what has gone on here is wrong the best thing to do is stop posting and let the thread slip out of public conciousness...erm, like I should have just done!? ;-)
Last Edited by on Dec 14, 2010 12:14 PM
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jim
542 posts
Dec 14, 2010
12:33 PM
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KeithE,
strictly speaking, the Apple agreement prohibits this. I don't really give a F* about it, I just think that the source code for this little app is useless, as it already does everything it can/everything that is allowed by the SDK. You want to improve it?
By the way, we did this because I needed a good player capable to be used without looking at the screen.
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www.truechromatic.com
Last Edited by on Dec 14, 2010 12:33 PM
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BigBlindRay
33 posts
Dec 14, 2010
7:47 PM
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@Jim - thanks dude - I have thought about and i want to, just havent gotten around to it yet but i will!
Im loving this crazy-ass thread!
So i'll give my two cents.
If Oprah was here right now, she would probably say something deep and profound, two things I am rarely ever capable of doing so why don't we all just agree to disagree and go back to playing some killer harp yeah?
And if by any chance that posting images of the HG50's guts does negatively impact on Brian's business than we can start a good ol' fashioned lynchin!
But first, we need to save Assange.
Big Blind Ray's YouTube Channel
Mavis and her China Pigs
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Rev. Jim
42 posts
Dec 15, 2010
12:32 AM
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I say we all go over to the Junior Wells thread and give Junior more love.
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Leonid
113 posts
Dec 15, 2010
6:26 AM
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On that forum someone pointed out (with examples) that most of boutique amp builders publish pictures of their circuits themselfs simply becuase they are so proud of their work. I am thinking of creating a separate thread listing that other tech guys think about the amp. It is rather intresting.
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Learning Harp
28 posts
Dec 15, 2010
7:09 AM
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Most boutique builders don't publish photos of guts. Probably because most musicians could care less in seeing them Lol. I think more and more boutique builders are tightening up their builds these days. In this internet age and with everyone having a camera/video on their mobile phones as a manufacturer you should be prepared when the day comes because the day is gonna come.
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MJ
238 posts
Dec 15, 2010
8:13 AM
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Miles Dewar
522 posts
Dec 15, 2010
9:39 AM
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There is absolutely nothing wrong with posting the schematics or photos of inside the amp that you own and paid for. Nothing.
Would you that got angry be so if they only posted pictures of the outside of the harpgear? What's the difference? Does he have patents, and is Jim and leonid breaking patent laws? No.
If they posted a Mcdonalds cheeseburger showing the lettuce, onions and mustard nobody would have a fit. Right?
He'll even Adam "Shows the inner workings and schematics" of copyrighted blues songs. Doesn't he? Is he outrageously breaking laws? Making him a bad person?
There's something wrong with in depth consumer reports?
Last Edited by on Dec 15, 2010 9:48 AM
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ZackPomerleau
1347 posts
Dec 15, 2010
9:56 AM
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Miles, what do you mean about Adam showing inner-workings? You do know that right now there are big fights and lawsuits going on about guitar tabs, with ASCAAP claiming it breaks copyright? Technically that is the same thing, so it may not actually be right.
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Miles Dewar
524 posts
Dec 15, 2010
10:12 AM
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Zach,
What I'm saying is that we seem to only be angry or overly-angry at the unknown people when they do something.
Not 1 person on this forum has asked Adam Gussow why he is sampling copyrighted material. Or called him a bad person for doing so.
I believe we don't because this is HIS site.
We also have something to gain from him "Bending copyright issues". Then so do other people gain from Jim posting what he/she did.
Are we all just afraid to confront the people who are held in high regard in our harmonica community?
Is it just easier to gang up on people who are not famous musicians?
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Buddha
2723 posts
Dec 15, 2010
10:18 AM
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it seems nobody is considering the intent behind Leonid and Jim's actions.
Leonid, doesn't like his hg50. So why take the time to post photos of it? Furthermore, even after Brian lamented that he is not thrilled with the photos being posted, why are they still there? The intent and the energy behind the thread on that forum is ill. And Jim's manipulative efforts get new subscribers is transparent.
I like how they try to twist what my deleted posts were about, if you want to know, you just read it. I was trying to remain neutral and not say anything but I can't help myself this time.
It's one thing to love an amp and attempt to dissect why it's good but it's another to hate an amp and put photos out there with the intent to harm another's business.
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"Music in the soul can be heard by the universe." - Lao Tzu
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ZackPomerleau
1348 posts
Dec 15, 2010
10:32 AM
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Buddha, I feel as if him opening it and going on here is detrimental either way, but that's personally just how I see it.
Miles, people have issues going against people of higher status. It's the way it is.
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Leonid
114 posts
Dec 15, 2010
2:11 PM
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I mentioned it already and I will say again I am realy puzzled why we are treated this way. I personally don't see any controversy here. What I see however is that Chris and his pathetic little sect are using this thread as another opportunity to insult anyone who they consider as ousider.
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5F6H
440 posts
Dec 15, 2010
3:35 PM
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Keith E - Copyright, tradmark, patent, writer's royalties, performing rights...none of these issues are faintly related to this thread. The legality of the issue has never been in question. It is simply a discussion about etiquette & who perceives whether that etiquette has been followed or not.
I can see it from both sides. But I say you open a boiled egg by slicing off the top with knife...a knife do you hear? Not a spoon...
Darn it, now look what you done, you made me perpetuate this bloody thread again....
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Jagrowler
41 posts
Dec 15, 2010
3:55 PM
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This thread has been very interesting for three main reasons:
1. It has caused me to consider the actual usefulness of technical photo's without detailed explanations.
2. I've also considered the responsibility we all have towards others on the forum, even though our relationships are largely through the internet.
3. Finally, I have realised how easy it is to appear (perhaps unfairly) extremely crass when wanting to promote ourselves or our work.
Leonid, everyone on the forum is allowed to have their own views, and many have been expressed in the thread. The fact that a large proportion vaguely agree with each other does not justify your accusation of everyone of being in a sect controlled by Chris (Chris can't always control himself, so how he'd manipulate dozens scattered around the world is a mystery to me!). There have been other voices aswell, symphetetic to your views. I'm puzzled why you feel so badly treated, unless of course you believe all forum members should always agree with each other. How boring would that be?
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toddg
4 posts
Dec 15, 2010
6:09 PM
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I'm on your side Leonid !!!
I know for a fact that most of these Harp Builders based their amps on a Fender amp .
Ever hear of Marshall amps ? His first amp was based on a Fender bassman . Victoria also has a whole line of Fender clones !! And pictures of Chassis are all over the web ! Even Sonny Jr has the back of his amp open ! look on Ebay most sellers show pics of the Chassis . So I really don't see what the problem is with what Leonid posted .
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Ray
281 posts
Dec 15, 2010
6:18 PM
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I believe the original Sonny Jr amps were based on a Masco. Western Electric was what was pasted on the inside of the cabs of the Masco combos, although I believed he used one of the pa amp circuits.
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KeithE
144 posts
Dec 15, 2010
6:41 PM
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5F6H - I know it's a stretch, but it apparently contradicts an assertion by Jim (at least in the U.S.), and it was interesting to see that it was a split decision:
"Leonid bought the amp and can do anything he wants to it. He can mod it. He can post pics of it. He can pour gasoline on it and burn it. It's his thing."
I never thought that copyright could apply to a physical object in this way.
I'll shut up now...
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Ev630
822 posts
Dec 15, 2010
10:20 PM
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I agree with Buddha.
Jim, harmonica may be your hobby, but building amps is how Brian puts bread on his table. He's told you he's not happy and that he thinks it will affect his business and you have blithely chosen to ignore that. Your behaviour is selfish, arrogant and disrespectful. You're basically a self-entitled man-child, and that is reinforced by the smug, tilty head shot you run on this forum.
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jim
559 posts
Dec 16, 2010
9:21 AM
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Ok. Those pics are on my forum. I'm fine with that because they:
a) don't violate any copyright
b) are not used as anti-advertising Brian's amps.
c) they can't harm Brian's business because they are insufficient to clone the amp.
d) Brian's reply was rather vague. If he told to remove them, they'd be gone the same minute.
On the good side:
a) it brought together several professionals (Learning Harp, George M, MWJB, jaybird). Maybe they have learned something that will inspire their own new ideas.
b) It made me finally decide to to open all harmonica knowledge I have.
c) maybe the community was waiting for a shake and it was an opportunity. I don't know. That was my impression.
Anyway, I kindly ask everyone not to post any more replies to this thread. Enough negative stuff here.
I think it will be fair to let Brian make the final post.
@Brian Purdy:
I apologize if anything in this thread was over the top or inappropriate. If you think the photos of HG50 should be deleted, I will immediately do so without asking any further questions.
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www.truechromatic.com
Last Edited by on Dec 16, 2010 9:25 AM
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Ev630
826 posts
Dec 16, 2010
9:32 AM
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Anyway, I kindly ask everyone not to post any more replies to this thread. Enough negative stuff here.
Clearly we can infer you don't include yourself in the category of perpetrators of negative acts...
@Brian Purdy:
I apologize if anything in this thread was over the top or inappropriate. If you think the photos of HG50 should be deleted, I will immediately do so without asking any further questions.
That's a little more encouraging. It's clear that Brian wasn't happy with your decision though he admitted that the realities of the internet make it impossible for him to stop it. Maybe you should just "Do the right thing"?
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Joe_L
906 posts
Dec 16, 2010
9:45 AM
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I own one of Brian's amps. It's a Double Trouble. It's a great sounding amp. While I didn't buy it directly from Brian, that has never stopped him from answering any of my questions.
Back when harmonicaspace.com had a chat room function, Brian was a regular. He was always very cordial and friendly. He was always very good about answering questions and sharing his knowledge.
A few years ago, there was a video on youtube featuring one of Brian's customers who was unhappy. Brian offered to make the situation, but the guy was hellbent on being a jerk. That didn't stop Brian from attempting to do the right thing.
Quite often in life, you run into people who are unwilling or refuse to work with people. It's difficult to deal with people like that. You can't pick your customers.
Brian is one of the good guys of the harmonica world.
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The Blues Photo Gallery
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HarpNinja
870 posts
Dec 16, 2010
12:03 PM
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There are a number of people here who are in business around harmonica. They make money off of harp related items. Brian continues to be someone I would support with my money.
Then there are an increasing number of participants on this forum who I wouldn't send a penny to no matter how great their stuff was. At least pretend to be in it for the right reasons and try and at least fake some class.
I don't care what country you are in, if you treat people kindly, you are much more likely to get their business.
While I understand that being vocal on a forum like this is free advertising, I am always shocked at how people obviously trying to make money off of selling to people on this forum handle themselves. That isn't unique to just sellers I've decided not to work with.
When you come off as arrogant, spiteful, and manipulative, people are going to be turned off and judge your work, in part, by how you handle yourself as a person.
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Mike
VHT Special 6 Amp for Harp Blog
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Joe_L
909 posts
Dec 16, 2010
12:27 PM
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You are so right! There are some people that I would never do business with that I've come across on forums.
I have actually sold items that I owned because I didn't want people thinking that I associate with/support a person's company.
Brian Purdy doesn't fall into that category. Neither does Gary Onofrio or Scott Berberian. In fact, I've found most of the amp manufacturers to be pretty decent guys.
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The Blues Photo Gallery
Last Edited by on Dec 16, 2010 12:28 PM
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