As I am starting to experiment halved (=half-valved) diatonics, I'd like to know what has been your experiences of it if compared to OB'ing. Especially interesting would be to know the opinions of people who play both the OB & halved harp.
What are the advantages & disadvantages between these two approaches to fully chromatic harp playing?
I am OB player myself, I'm not very fluent with all the holes yet but getting there. Depending on the harp at least holes 4 & 6 are becoming pretty fluent for me. Other holes haven't been very important yet with the positions and songs that I've been practicing. At least one thing that I have noticed is that sometimes I miss some bending elements on some holes like 7 draw to get some colour on the playing - I guess halved diatonic would make a difference there.
There are some articles I have been reading about this where Brendan Powers said that the disadvantage of halved bends is that at least he finds those notes impossible to maintain accurately, whereas with OB's you can do it. Another thing is that halving changes the sound colour (which is a subjective thing whether you like it or not). Do you agree with these statements and are there some other aspects you'd like to mention too?
I guess this would be important question for many harpists that wish to expand the diatonic playing to full chromatics...which way to go? Or could you learn the both without sacrificing either one?
Hey apskarp! You are on a quest for chromaticism, eh? Do you currently overblow? Back when I couldn't overblow consistently, I too also experimented with half valving harps (you can find several posts by me in the archives here). The two techniques are vastly different, in my opinion, but that is not to say that one MUST choose one over the other. In fact, there are several ways to incorporate the techniques in ONE harp.
What do I mean by this? Well, if one half valves only a few, carefully selected holes, leaving others completely unvalved, you can get the best of both worlds. Which holes to valve depends upon your overblow abilities. I can OB the 4, 5, and 6, and can overdraw the 7. I can do this on almost any key (aside from very low keys where I can't do the 4, or very high keys where I can't do any overdraws). So for me, the perfect solution is to just valve the 1 and 2 blow slots, and (optionally) the 9 and 10 draw notes. In this scenario, the 2 valved blow-bend gives you the same note that you would get from a 1 overblow (which I find impossible to do), and the 9 and 10 valved bend gives you the equivelent of the 8 and 9 overdraws. The valve on 1 blow is totally optional, but it lets you get a little bendy-ness on the one blow.
I've only done this to a couple of harps so far, and the vast majority of my harps are totally unvalved. My plan is to valve at least the 2 blow on all of them, as I've found that to be the most useful valved note to have.
The technique of valved bending is not that difficult to learn. I picked it up in an afternoon of trying, and found it much easier to acquire than overblowing. It takes time to perfect it though, just like anything. ---------- ------------------ View my videos on YouTube!"
why wouldn't you valve the 3 blow? i imagine it might interfere with the draw bends. am i right? ---------- MP hibachi cook for the yakuza doctor of semiotics superhero emeritus
Thank's Isaac, that partial valving (=palving ;) is actually something well worth considering and experimenting. I do overblow currently. I have two good harps which I've set-up for OB's and which I can manage to get all the OB's & OD's. The keys are C & Bb. However, I rarely have needed other OB's than 4 & 6 and thus those are the only ones I am pretty fluent with. From time to time I've also used OB 1 & OD 9 with some Indian music abut not very often. OD 9 is actually very easy to achieve for me too.
If thinking about the palving (only from purely technical perspective as I haven't actually tried it out in practice), at least 2, 3 & 8 could be valved with any OB harp as those are the holes you don't OB in any case - and actually if you do that then you could valve also 7 & 1 as you could get those OB notes from the valved bends of 2 & 8. Of course you could do the whole harp with half-valving by following that logic, but I think what matters here are two things: 1) Which one is easier to get for you? 2) Which one brings more advantages musically For me the 7 OD hasn't been very important and at least on my harps it is pretty weak tone in any case. On the other hand I have came up with tunes that would gain musicality if I could color regular 7 draw with some bending - which isn't possible with unvalved harp. So I might consider valving also the 7 blow which would mean I lost the overdraw on that hole but gain bending abilities instead - and as said, I could get the C# from valved 8 draw bend so I wouldn't sacrifice any notes.
Now I could also valve the 5 draw as I don't use that OB almost never, but then I'd lost that note for good as it would require valved 6 blow bend to replace it. And I don't want to lost my 6OB as I'm fluent it and use it a lot. I'm also pretty good with 4OB so I don't really need valved blow bends on the 5 hole for anything but to add some color - and for me the F# is still more important even tough I use it rarely.
So here's some thinking of mine about partial valving...
@MP: only draw holes 1-6 and blow holes 7-10 are valved with half-valved harps. This is because then the valving doesn't interfere the normal bends as drawing air through the harp just then opens the valve and it doesn't interfere the playing at all.
Re: "T... where Brendan Power said that the disadvantage of halved bends is that at least he finds those notes impossible to maintain accurately, whereas with OB's you can do it. Another thing is that halving changes the sound colour (which is a subjective thing whether you like it or not). Do you agree with these statements and are there some other aspects you'd like to mention too?
I guess this would be important question for many harpists that wish to expand the diatonic playing to full chromatics...which way to go? Or could you learn the both without sacrificing either one?".
Good questions.... However, there are some alternate approaches to consider too.
Regarding holding the pitch of half-valved bends, it is possible, but tricky. PT Gazell uses them very effectively, and I use them occasionally as bent notes in themselves too. However, I prefer the sound and expression of interactive reed bends (as on a stock diatonic). To bring more of these into play, I retune my diatonics (and chromatics, which are also half-valved) to allow extra chromaticism using normal bends.
The stock Richter tuning requires 7 overbends (or valved bends, if your harp is half-valved) in addition to the normal bends - but if you think outside the box and consider alternate tunings, these can be reduced or eliminated altogether.
You can go all the way by tuning a harp to Augmented or Diminished tunings (which have all chromatic notes as bends) or you can judiciously tune a harp so that 90% of the chromatic notes are available as bends and only a couple of less significant notes require overblows or valved bends. There is an infinite number of tuning possibilities, and you can choose to overblow or half valve on them all depending on your preference.
Here's an example of a tune played on an alternate tuned half-valved diatonic which allows easy key modulation:
Re. tonal differences, I like the tone and extra expression of half-valved harps. Without valves a harp feels half dead to me, as half the notes can't be pitch bend for soulful vibrato and subtle bent sliding effects. But it is a subjective choice, and many traditionalists can't get along with them at all.
As to whether you can use both overbend and valved-bending techniques - of course. You just need more harps in your box, that's all.
Brendan Power WEBSITE: http://www.brendan-power.com YOUTUBE: http://www.youtube.com/BrendanPowerMusic
Wow! Great post Brendan! Would you valve up your augmented or diminished harps too? I imagine that for you, not having the "bendyness" on the blow notes would be weird. In fact, and as an aside, that ability to bend into the blow notes that you get on a half valved harps is, IMO, the very best reason to half valve a harp. More so than trying to gain some missing notes. In fact, I would say that OB/OD is a better way to gain missing notes, but half valving is a better way to gain missing expressiveness. The only reason why I have been trying to find a compromise by "palving" (thanks apskarp, for the new term!) is because I am too poor to afford two whole sets of harps (one half valved and one set up for OB/OD),let alone all the natural minor and other alternative tuned harps that I know I need for the type of music I want to play! So for me, selectively "palving" a few choice holes and then selectively setting up OB/OD on other holes lets me gain expressiveness on certain blow notes I play a lot (eg. Blow 1, Blow 2), and let me have some missing notes I need frequently (eg. OB 4, 5, 6). Of the OD's, I only find myself using OD 7, and only on low harps (it sounds better and is more controllable for me), so why not give myself the ability to gain expressiveness on some of those high draw notes?
The one trade off is that palving the 1 and 2 means that you loose much of the "breathiness" in the chords down there. To me, that means that chordal vamps and train rythyms sound a "little" different on a half-valved harp versus a non half-valved. However, leaving the 3 un-valved (ie. a "palved" harp) helps keep a little of that breathiness. Also, since blow three is the same as the 2 draw, if I want expressiveness on that note, I just can play the 2 draw. And, MP, half vaveling does not interfere with any of the normal bends. ---------- ------------------ View my videos on YouTube!"
The one other thing about the 1/2 valved harps is that if the harps are tuned to ET tuning, the valves also act as a damper, especially in the upper harmonic overtones (harmonicas give off more overtones than any other instrument outside of a piano, but the majority of them are odd numbered, which tends to be harsh sounding to the human ear), and it also smooths out the sound of the ET tuned chord.
You can still do the chording vamps, but with valved harps, breath control is a very important issue because if you hit too hard, especially when bending, just like a chromatic, the note can quickly blank out on you. ---------- Sincerely, Barbeque Bob Maglinte Boston, MA http://www.barbequebob.com CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
sustaining a blow bend on 1-6 valved is no different than learning to sustain a 3 hole draw (pick your step) bend....breath force can vary slightly, but its all in the embouchure. IMO ---------- Kyzer's Travels Kyzer's Artwork
Last Edited by on Jul 11, 2010 1:05 PM
Thank's Brendan, you are right - if one is expanding the harp by mods, why to stop just to valving & OB's?
I earlier listed some things why it is easier to play richter tuned harp if you play (also) blues, but I realized I was actually wrong. There's no difference whether you are learning new positions on richter tuned harps vs. alternative tunings. It's just reminding your Mind about what key and position you are playing and the muscle memory takes care of the rest (if you have woodshedded it).
So it makes perfect sense to build your harps to the styles of music you play instead of just learning techniques to overcome the inconveniences coming from the "awkward" tuning you have there. Of course this is something that blues harpists have been doing forever by having different harps for different keys, but why to stop there if you play also other styles of music?
I will certainly start to study these alternative tuning systems too. I have some natural minor harps already and I'll think that I'll try out some valving with those too..
Last Edited by on Jul 11, 2010 1:05 PM