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Dirty-South Blues Harp forum: wail on! >
Building a new mic and want some input...
Building a new mic and want some input...
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jaymcc28
283 posts
Jun 07, 2010
8:28 AM
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I’m working on building a new mic and I want to get some feedback and advice from you all. I’m working on a wooden shell that will be cone shaped, similar to a bullet mic. So far it’s coming out great. I have the shell shaped and sanded down to how I want it to look and feel. I still need to wire an element and jack, apply the finish and poly to the wood, insert the hardware and put a screen/cover on the front of the mic. So, there’s still plenty to do.
Here are some of my questions and calls for input. Keep in mind that I don’t play out at all, only for my own enjoyment so I don’t need anything totally killer, HOWEVER I would like it to come out nice and be something to be proud of:
1. I don’t currently have an element so I need to purchase/find one. I don’t want to spend too much on one (in the $20 range) but I want one that’s going to be decent. I want to eventually be able to get the overdriven, dirty sound and I know that the element isn’t the ONLY thing involved with that sound but it certainly is part of it. Any suggestions?
2. I’m not currently planning on hooking up a pot. I don’t want to drill more holes than needed in my casing. Is that a mistake? Is there an ‘in line’ type of pot I could install rather than placing it right on the casing?
3. I’m not sure what to do for the front cover. I can’t really find anything that will fit over it nice and clean and, frankly, I’m not overly creative and handy. Right now I can think of two options but would love to hear other thoughts:
a. I could cut another piece of wood, disc shaped, from the same stock. I could sand it and finish it like the case and cut some grooves in it. Then I could apply some screen on the inside of the disc and attach it to the face of the mic casing over the hole where the element will be placed using Liquid Nails. If I did that right it could look pretty sweet but cutting the grooves will be the tough part with my limited tools (I live by the adage: “If all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail”).
b. I found a piece of gold metal (aluminum maybe?) that is used as an insert for a handle on a sliding closet door. It almost fits perfectly over the casing. I would need to cut grooves into it, sand down the edges so it’s not sharp and then find a way to attach it to the casing.
I have taken some pictures of the work I’ve done on the casing so far and I’ll post them later when I get home from work (I thought I had them on my cell phone with me but they are on my camera at home).
Thanks in advance…
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"Take out your false teeth, momma, I want to suck on your gums."-P. Wolf
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Old Dog
59 posts
Jun 07, 2010
9:26 AM
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If you go with the wood cover, you can drill a bunch of holes in a cool pattern instead of slots.
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I used to be young and foolish. Now I'm not so young.
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isaacullah
997 posts
Jun 07, 2010
10:45 AM
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RE: Element choice. For that price range I would recommend you to use a dynamic element scavenged from any decent(ish) vocal mic. If you have time, scour the thrift stores, and you are likely to find a decent mic someone gave away. When I made my mic, I found an AudioTechnica ATR 30 mic for $3 at Savers to scavenge the element out of. It sounds great with all my amps. Also, you will need a gasket. If you've seen my video or instructable, you'll know that I use the rubber cups that people put under table legs to keep them from scratching the floor. These are perfect gaskets, just cut the center out, pop in the element, and squish it all in the housing.
RE: no pot. No pot is fine, but realize that you will need to be more proactive about feedback. You'll have to plan ahead, and dial back on your amp, as you will have no recourse at your mic. Down the line, you can add a volume pedal or inline volume control, so IMO, it's no big deal to leave a volume control out of your mic. Personally, I kind of like just having an on/off switch (ie. just cut it dead when I'm not playing), and use an external pedal for volume control.
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The magnificent YouTube channel of the internet user known as "isaacullah"
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jaymcc28
284 posts
Jun 07, 2010
1:39 PM
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@Old Dog: Yes, I was thinking that I would probably be best just drilling a series of holes even if I use the piece of metal I'm considering just because it would be a little easier and less likely to totally screw up the handiwork. I'd love to get my hands on one of those screens that Greg puts on his wooden mics, those are sweet!
@Isaac: You know, I've been keeping my eye out for an old used mic. Now that the summer is here there will be more yardsales and flea markets in my area so maybe I'll come up with something. So you think dynamic is the way to go considering my price range? Would deeper pockets get me into something considerable better? Would it make that much of a difference?
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"Take out your false teeth, momma, I want to suck on your gums."-P. Wolf
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pharpo
306 posts
Jun 07, 2010
2:11 PM
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jaymcc28- If you know any "HAM"s ask them when the next /nearest hamfest is ...you can pick up a mic cheap there.
Paul
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Music is your own experience, your own thoughts, your wisdom. If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn. They teach you there's a boundary line to music. But, man, there's no boundary line to art. - Charlie Parker
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isaacullah
998 posts
Jun 07, 2010
3:04 PM
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For your price range, there is no other alternative than dynamic. Cheap crystal elements sound, well, they sound cheap. You could go with an electret condenser type mic, but you'd need to power it with a battery, and it won't distort like a "normal" harp mic. Yup. Dynamic is the way to go.
If you've got the $$$, you can buy a TESTED and GUARANTEED vintage CM or CR element of e-bay. Personally, I don't think that, for dudes like us, those vintage elements are worth the money. You will get great tone from a good quality dynamic mic element. As a rule of thumb, any mic that costs more than about $30 will have a decent element in it. Brand recognition will also help ensure you get a good element (eg. audiotechnica, Shure, Unidyne, ect.). Fo example, the Audiotechnica element is hotter than all the other various no-name elements I've pulled out of other thrift store finds.
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The magnificent YouTube channel of the internet user known as "isaacullah"
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Nastyolddog
856 posts
Jun 07, 2010
3:17 PM
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Yo Bro www.mouser.com Dynamic element part#25LM032
and mini transformer to boost output #42TM117-RC:)
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JDH
144 posts
Jun 07, 2010
3:17 PM
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I know a guy that has a mic shell he built from plumbing parts. His grill is a shower drain cover.
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(:o
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MP
445 posts
Jun 07, 2010
5:44 PM
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jaymcc28,
if you are going through that much trouble to make a mic;a thing of beauty i would suspect, why, why, why, go cheap on an element??
i've made mics out of beer cans, and smaller diameter tea cans as a joke, but used NOS crystals.
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Nastyolddog
857 posts
Jun 07, 2010
6:18 PM
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Jay the element i offerd is used in a well known Blues Harp microphone,
Played by Pro's worldwide i won't diss close it's identity but it's up to the job check it out:)
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Greg Heumann
513 posts
Jun 07, 2010
6:44 PM
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NastyO - I have to respectfully disagree. That element may be in use in a well known blues harp mic, but it must not sound very good. Played by pro's worldwide? Like who? I seriously doubt it. I'm of the opinion that pretty much all of the mass-marketed bullet style mics available today are inferior to those with vintage elements.
The frequency response of the element you are talking about has no bass response (-10dB at 250Hz, -20dB at 175 hz - those frequencies are WELL WITHIN THE RANGE OF FUNDAMENTAL HARMONICA NOTES.) It also has extended high frequency response - nearly flat from 500-8000Hz, then a huge (+8 dB) peak at 17,000 Hz! Not my kind of harp element. Good elements tend to have good bass response down to 50 Hz, and lousy high frequency response - they should begin falling off by 5000 or 6000 Hz.
The data sheet can be found here: http://www.mouser.com:80/catalog/specsheets/KT-400027.pdf
By the way, Jay - congratulations for taking this on. It is a fun and rewarding project. I have to agree with MP - if you're going to all this work, don't waste it on a junk element. I have 99S556 dual impedance CM elements - from Shure 520D bullets - for $85. That element will be far superior to the ones in discussion here so far.
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/Greg
BlowsMeAway Productions
BlueState - my band
Bluestate on iTunes
Last Edited by on Jun 07, 2010 6:47 PM
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Nastyolddog
858 posts
Jun 07, 2010
6:51 PM
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NastyO - I have to respectfully disagree. That element may be in use in a well known blues harp mic, but it must not sound very good.
Thats cool Greg:)
Last Edited by on Jun 09, 2010 7:38 PM
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rharley5652
156 posts
Jun 08, 2010
4:51 PM
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@ Jay,.. Greg is right on point about the 99S556,..it was the element used in the 520D's greenbullet for years,.ya can't go wrong with that element as it's proven harp element an 85 bucks is a good price.
YA say :
I want to eventually be able to get the overdriven, dirty sound ,.YA won't get it with a dynamic element unless ya put some work into the element,..
Go with a CM,..
As my Ol'man always said ,.
"for a nickle more go first class"
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Simply Unique Kustom Mic's By Rharley
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MP
453 posts
Jun 08, 2010
6:12 PM
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there you go.......
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Nastyolddog
870 posts
Jun 09, 2010
5:36 AM
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@ Jay,.. Greg is right,
Rharley Greg wants to wipe his ass please remove your lips:)
$85 cool price:)
But you can win a 520D in Ebay land for 50 70 bucks:)
Then you can custom the shell:)
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jaymcc28
285 posts
Jun 09, 2010
7:28 AM
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Wow, been away for a couple days and was happy to see all the responses.
So, I agree that if I'm going to take the time to build something I think is nice I might want to spend some cash on the element. The analogy that I'm thinking of is why fix up the body of an old car but not work on the engine?
@Greg, I'll reach out to you soon to discuss that element. I'm going to be travelling next week so when I get back I'll look at my finances and see what I can afford.
@JDH: I looked at some shower drains and even some sink drain baskets (used to catch crap before it clogs up the sink). They are still on my list of possibilities.
@Nasty: You always make me laugh, Bro! But, you always have a solid opinion so thanks for that, too.
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"Take out your false teeth, momma, I want to suck on your gums."-P. Wolf
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jaymcc28
286 posts
Jun 09, 2010
7:40 AM
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Can anyone tell me how the Shure 99A405 stacks up?
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"Take out your false teeth, momma, I want to suck on your gums."-P. Wolf
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rharley5652
158 posts
Jun 09, 2010
3:01 PM
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@ nasty ,..
I don't need your comments here,.I'm here to help guys to build a quality harp mic only ,.not to get into a pissin match,. Kindly remove your comment .
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Simply Unique Kustom Mic's By Rharley
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Nastyolddog
873 posts
Jun 09, 2010
3:09 PM
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Not being NOD just Naughty:)
Rharley you missed my sarcarstic Humor:)
Last Edited by on Jun 10, 2010 7:14 AM
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