Philosofy
619 posts
Nov 21, 2014
2:21 PM
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I noticed the other day when playing that I felt the wind from my blow notes coming out of the right end of the harp, not the front like I would have thought. So, thinking about this a little more, it makes sense. When the reeds vibrate, the air has more room to come out the sides of the reeds, not the tip. So the air motion would be side to side. I wonder if the sound waves act the same: more sound would come out the sides, rather than the back. In that case, wouldn't it make more sense to have a cover plate that is side vented, rather than opening the backs of the cover plates?
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nacoran
8131 posts
Nov 21, 2014
3:24 PM
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Interesting thought. The first problem would be that people's hands often block the sides, but you could design something that let people hold it differently. It wouldn't be too hard to test some of the variables. A piece of duct tape on the back of a side vented harp compared to an open backed, non-side vented harp?
Of course, it might be more complicated than that depending on exactly how the sound is being generated. There are some harps with top vents.
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Nate
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First Post- May 8, 2009
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isaacullah
2885 posts
Nov 21, 2014
5:14 PM
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Dave Payne posted some of his thoughts on this topic some years back. Can't remember all the details now, but remember it making sense the way he ezplained it. Whatever it does to the sound, however, I have recently come to the conclusion that I don't like it for the sound I'm trying to achieve. I've been experenting with covering them up (using metallic tape used to repair air ducts), and I find that I like the tone of my marine bands much better that way. I think that's also the reason ice been drawn more towards my special 20's these last several months. Not only is the tone more focused and "pure" (to my ears), the harps are much more responsive to my hand techniques. Interestingly, I dont notice any change in volume before and after plugging up the vents.
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20REEDS
15 posts
Nov 21, 2014
5:57 PM
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I use Crossovers- I use hot glue to plug the side vents. The end result is great but application is tricky and in all honesty, a little painful
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WinslowYerxa
723 posts
Nov 21, 2014
6:35 PM
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Side vents allow more high-frequency sounds to be heard, making the overall sound brighter and more complex.
Side vents also prevent the player from channeling all the air flow through his/her hands. This can be a good thing if you don't want to hear the high blow notes start to sound when you play a chord of the low draw notes, which will happen on a non-vented harp that is tightly cupped. This phenomenon, known as air recirculation, happens because the only place the air can come from when a non-vented harp is tightly cupped is through the high holes, thereby activating the blow reeds in those holes. (You can also get air recirculation going with low blow/high draw, and you can play the high end of the harp and get air recirculating through the low reeds as well.)
Some people prefer the brighter vented sound, some prefer the darker unvented sound. And some actually play around with the sound of air recirculation.
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Last Edited by WinslowYerxa on Nov 21, 2014 6:51 PM
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nacoran
8132 posts
Nov 21, 2014
8:07 PM
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I do the recirculation trick on my LLF sometimes. I'm not sure how useful it is for everyday use, at least until Brendan Power comes up with a special tuning to take advantage of it. :)
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Nate
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walterharp
1558 posts
Nov 21, 2014
8:26 PM
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most of this discussion revolves around what the player hears.. and that really means almost nothing because so much of the sound is channeled through the body to the ears.. the instrument vibrates against the body and the ear hears that in part. That is why if you play with earplugs and a loud band, you can year yourself even if your amp is not working.
in my mind all these discussions, side vents, combs, etc can only be solved by recording the sound that is heard by the audience.
the problem is recording it under exactly the same conditions, except with one variable changed. in this case side vents or not on the same harp. and each harp will vary each key of each harp will vary.
so basically all these discussions are pretty much up to personal taste of the player which may or may not transfer to the actual sound being produced for the listener.
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Kaining
63 posts
Nov 22, 2014
7:36 AM
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"This phenomenon, known as air recirculation, happens because the only place the air can come from when a non-vented harp is tightly cupped is through the high holes, thereby activating the blow reeds in those holes. (You can also get air recirculation going with low blow/high draw, and you can play the high end of the harp and get air recirculating through the low reeds as well.)"
And when you start playing with that phenomenon, you can actually control what notes will come out and get some impossible chords that need both blow and draw reeds to do.
+1+2+3;-7, a I7 is the most easy one to do.
That's why a harp with vents is a deal breaker to me. There is just so much potential with this technique that i want the possibility to experiment with it.
Last Edited by Kaining on Nov 22, 2014 7:37 AM
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mlefree
229 posts
Nov 22, 2014
9:52 AM
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I think that it is unarguable that a vented harp can be cupped as completely as a vented one. It is very difficult to impossible for me to fully cup a Marine Band with my size hands (not big, not small). Maybe Rice Miller could, but not me. I am able to cup my SP20s far more effectively because they lack the vents on their covers. I honestly don't see how the Filisko's and Dermody's get such great cupped tone with their Marine Bands. I love their size and tone but I wish I could cup my set of 1970's restored MB's like I can my Special 20s. That and the rising prices are making me like Special 20s more all the time.
Michelle
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Last Edited by mlefree on Nov 22, 2014 9:55 AM
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