kudzurunner
4669 posts
May 05, 2014
11:20 AM
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I have the sense that the typical or standard retail price of a blues CD has gone down over the past ten years, even as inflation should have pushed the price in the other direction. Am I right?
10-15 years ago, the typical price was $15-17. Now I have the sense that $12-13 is more typical, at least when one is purchasing a CD in a store or from Amazon.
Feedback, please. For those of you who sell CDs at gigs, what price do you charge? Has that price remained steady over the past 10 years?
For those of you who sell CDs through the mail, what price to you charge?
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A440
149 posts
May 05, 2014
12:49 PM
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In Europe 10€, in UK 10£, in USA 10$ - seem to be most common prices for CDs sold at gigs. It makes dealing with cash easier, and is a reasonable/fair price.
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walterharp
1373 posts
May 05, 2014
1:03 PM
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yeah, $10, and it is getting harder and harder to sell them as most people do not want to pay for their music any more.
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kudzurunner
4671 posts
May 05, 2014
2:14 PM
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My personal feeling about the price at live gigs is that $15 remains fair. Most people who pay that price, especially to touring musicians, understand that they're helping in a small way to subsidize the band. Or at least that's my assumption.
I'd like to hear from people who have recently purchased CDs from touring blues acts. What does Dennis charge, for example? What about Kim, Rick Estrin, John Nemeth?
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bluemoose
972 posts
May 05, 2014
2:20 PM
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Out here in Vancouver Canada it's typically $20 CAN for a cd at a gig. I bought 4 from John Nemeth and got a bit of a volume break. I'm more than happy to pay that much to a gigging act.
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SuperBee
1950 posts
May 05, 2014
2:39 PM
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Often $20 in Australia. Sometimes $15, sometimes $25.
Ian Collard was asking $20 last time I saw him.
We sold our last album for $15. The EPs were less. A good EP is a wonderful thing. Often only available at gigs...
I resolved to always get the CD or the TShirt or the stubbie holder. Shirts are good value. But Stubbie holders were actually the best selling merch we had. I saw even buddy guy was selling them. His were polka-dotted of course. Ours had the album cover and a recipe for a cocktail named after the band. Humorous and cheap. Quality with a margin.
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jbone
1601 posts
May 05, 2014
3:51 PM
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We've been in the cd game for just a few years. The first was pretty raw and we didn't push too hard. The second was much better, all original and more focused and better quality all around.
Both went for $10 a pop. The second was all original from the first note to last, lyrics the same way. We even did the graphics. We had a friend record us and mix down, another friend to master. Total grass roots.
I've bought cd's from individuals for up to $15, and this influenced our decision to market at $10. A buck a song seems very reasonable when you start adding up the learning curve, writing, arranging, etc, etc, sweat equity and all.
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nacoran
7710 posts
May 05, 2014
4:13 PM
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When I go to a show I usually figure I'd like to spend $20 or less for something to take home with me. Most of the local bands charge about $10 per CD, but they'll bundle, offer 3 for $20. Of course, often they are home burned CDs, so the cost is only a few cents to produce them, so the marginal cost for selling you 3 CDs is only pennies more than selling you one. Sure, you don't make $60 on the rich guy in the room who would have bought all three at $20 a pop, but I think you probably make up for it in people who might not have bought at all.
The only band I've seen that was making a living at it though had lots of other memorabilia for sale. The lead singer had branded panties you could buy.
Bumper stickers and pins seem to be popular giveaways to get your music out there.
The other things that seems to be big are cards good for one free song giveaway. That gets them to go to your site and give you their email to get the song, and that builds your mailing list. Kickstarter campaigns also seem to be big. Several of the last few albums I bought were Kickstarters. It makes you feel like a superfan- the one catch is the rewards have to equal roughly the donation value. If someone gives you what the album costs, they should get the album. If they give you enough for an album and a autograph, you give them an album and an autograph. Nothing makes you grumpier than logging on to a Kickstarter and seeing that for $10 you get an early copy of the first song. :)
I wonder, adjusted for inflation, if the artists who are now self producing are getting as good a cut as they would have if they had a record deal.
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Cotton
21 posts
May 05, 2014
4:19 PM
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Been at a lot of festivals and shows in the last 2 years.
When cd are $20.00 not many people are buying. At $10 seems to be Lots of sales. $15 right in the middle. If you want to promote your music $10.00 is the ticket.
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arzajac
1360 posts
May 05, 2014
4:24 PM
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Most acts around here sell CDs for $20 each at gigs. Sometimes you will find an artist with a large inventory (usually some older albums) and will sell 2 for $30.
And yes, I will pay $20 at a live show in support of the artist. That's more than the "shelf" value of the CD.
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Last Edited by arzajac on May 05, 2014 4:24 PM
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Greg Heumann
2705 posts
May 05, 2014
5:18 PM
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We sell ours for $15.
I think $20 is for internationally known, have a record label pros - and $10 is too cheap for anyone. Just makes it sound like you don't think you're worth much....
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Last Edited by Greg Heumann on May 05, 2014 8:22 PM
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shadoe42
295 posts
May 05, 2014
7:15 PM
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Every act I know no matter the genre sells at Gigs for 15 a pop. Sometimes with a discount for multiple CDs. Online hard copy is also 15 and we eat the shipping. Download only is normally 10.
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Mirco
157 posts
May 05, 2014
8:13 PM
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Dennis Gruenling sold me two of his for $25. Aki Kumar charges $15. When I buy CD's from these guys in person, I know I'm supporting the act and encouraging the music.
I think $15 is very reasonable. True, many people don't want to pay for music anymore, but I think the typical blues listener is different from the typical popular music listener. It's a niche audience, and more likely to support musicians we like (I think).
Last Edited by Mirco on May 05, 2014 8:14 PM
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Shaganappi
115 posts
May 05, 2014
8:39 PM
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$10 is an easy sell but tends to cheapen you IMO. $20 is more than a lot of people will pay. More likely to sell 2 or 3 at $15 (3 for $40 maybe ok too) or else only one at $20 I think. I have bought a number at $20 but only if I really connect with the performer and accordingly want to contribute somewhat to the person. Music alone though, $15 is normally max.
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dougharps
608 posts
May 05, 2014
9:41 PM
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For most acts that tour, $15 for an actual CD, with a discount for more than one. A big name band touring could charge $20. Local bands with self burned CDRs go for $10 or less, depending on the band and number of tracks.
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Doug S.
Last Edited by dougharps on May 05, 2014 9:44 PM
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dougharps
609 posts
May 05, 2014
9:48 PM
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Disappearing post!
For real CDs, not CDRs:
Most touring bands, $15.
Some big name bands $20.
Sometimes a discount for buying more than one.
Locally burned CDRs may be from $5 to $10 depending on the band and number of tracks.
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Doug S.
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jbone
1602 posts
May 06, 2014
4:39 AM
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When the choice is sell for $10 or don't sell, it becomes the best choice. Considering that we had a lot of good inexpensive help producing our latest, and the repro cost is not much, we don't mind passing the deal along to someone who cares enough to put $10 out there. We DON'T make a living on cd sales or gigs. We want to defray the cost so we can keep playing out there.
If you look at pay-for-song download prices it's about $1 a song. To me a 10 song cd is worth $10 unless you have become well known.
In an age where people download free, legal or not, and the last concert I went to was full of people doing illegal video to share, and where we personally have information about eastern European thieves turning our music into ringtones, we feel good about a ten dollar bill.
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kudzurunner
4672 posts
May 06, 2014
4:52 AM
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I think what I've learned from this thread is that $15 on the gig remains a reasonable price. In the past, I haven't discounted for a pair of CDs--i.e., $25 for two--but I think I will start doing that. $40 for 3 is something I've certainly done, although 2 for $25 tends to undercut that.
But I hear jbone on this. A $10 in the hand is worth something.
So here's something else: When you sell CDs at gigs, what sort of display case do you use? Please post photos! CD Baby send out a very interesting email on this. They argued that many bands paid almost no attention to the sales-point for their gig CDs. They said you HAVE to have an attractive table, or box, or whatever you use. DON'T LET IT BE AN AFTERTHOUGHT: that was the gist of their little essay.
So how do you sell YOUR CD's? Do you actually bring along a little table? How do you showcase them? What sort of price-sign do you have? How do you keep those Sharpies from walking away?
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Goldbrick
424 posts
May 06, 2014
5:04 AM
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Well in my younger years we had an attractive young lady in a thin tank top sell the cassettes..... we did pretty well
Now we just sell an ep( home made but attractively packaged) set out in a guitar case for $5.
Works well busking in the tourist area
So many people will shamelessly stand around and record from the phone anyway-better to selll something at the low price. If we sell 15 or so with a $3 profit margin -its still gas and food scratch
Last Edited by Goldbrick on May 06, 2014 8:00 AM
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nacoran
7714 posts
May 06, 2014
12:29 PM
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I wish I had a photo of the regional band where the singer sold branded panties. I wish I could remember their name. It's on the tip of my tongue. They had a giant cardboard cutout with different pieces of merch on it with the prices listed. Lots of bands set up a table.
Whether there was a door charge also affects what I'll pay. If I got in for free, I almost feel obligated to buy something. I'll also pay more if a portion goes to a good cause (I've been to a lot of shows lately supporting NPR, particularly related to some of Pete Seeger's causes).
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isaacullah
2751 posts
May 06, 2014
1:01 PM
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I see a lot of bands, of all types. IMO, $15-$20 might be the price point for the "PBS" crowd (which, argueably, does attend blues shows), but other crowds will not shell that out. Most indie bands sell their CD's for $10-$12 at shows and on their websites (e.g., through cd baby, etc.). That seems to be the price point for the "kids" who attend these shows (hipster youth). Usually the website is $8-10 for the digital, and $10-12 for the cd. Usually there is no price "advantage" for buying at the show, other than knowing (or at least feeling like) more of the money goes to the artist.
IMO $10 for 10-12 songs is reasonable and doesn't "cheapen" the product at all.
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atty1chgo
917 posts
May 06, 2014
1:18 PM
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Going rate by most artists in Chicago at the blues clubs is $20, sometimes $15, depends on the artist and the venue. Mostly I see $20.
Last Edited by atty1chgo on May 06, 2014 1:19 PM
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shadoe42
296 posts
May 06, 2014
3:45 PM
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This is from last year in KC...the box is a small Pirate chest for obvious reasons, my fiance does the selling, the leather journal is our sales log, now there are two CDs and on the inside of the top is both the Square sticker and my gotipit QR code so that people can tip if they wish and do not have cash.
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Last Edited by shadoe42 on May 06, 2014 3:45 PM
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Seven.Oh.Three.
280 posts
May 06, 2014
4:11 PM
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I paid $30 for Cottons cd when he played DC over this past winter. But he did sign it then and there..
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gutbucket
5 posts
May 07, 2014
6:49 AM
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Most guys around here (southeast Pennsylvania) sell a cd at a show for $15. And then when you hand over a $20 bill, every single one of them asks if you want change! That is a good strategy, no? Like Icepick James says, there's the show, and then there's the business...
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kudzurunner
4677 posts
May 07, 2014
9:50 AM
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Isaac's info is very interesting, as is atty1chgo's. I'm not surprised that the kids have established a lowball market; kids don't have much money.
Neither am I surprised that in a big city like Chicago, in clubs that attract a lot of tourists, including international tourists (who remain slightly fuzzy, because of exchange rates, about what things should cost in $$$), CDs would go for $20. Chicago, after all, has long been known for gangsterism. Some people (including a few blues players) dress like gangsters from the Roaring Twenties, with draped suits and sharp hats, and then of course there are the actual drug-selling gangsters. NYC doesn't have that, but it, too, has inflated big-city prices.
When I sell CDs for $15 at gigs, a certain number of people who give me $20s say "Keep the change." I certainly don't expect it, but I appreciate it. In some cases these are places that don't charge a cover, and so the gesture is clearly a way of saying "I'm happy to put a little extra money directly into your pocket."
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nacoran
7718 posts
May 07, 2014
11:53 AM
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I suspect a lot of the buskers already know this, and it's not quite about CD prices, but the 'keep the change' reminded me. If you have a tip jar, always make it see through and always seed it with a variety of bills. If everyone is tipping $1 everyone assumes that's the appropriate tip, even the people who could throw in $20. Learned that going door to door for charity. You leave a few of the neighbors checks on the clipboard (okay, this was back before identity theft was such a big issue) and the pier pressure sets in. One of our canvassers happened to stop by a big Italian wedding once and between the wine and high spirits everyone started trying to outdo everyone else. Each donation was bigger than the one before. :)
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Nate
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First Post- May 8, 2009
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Cotton
22 posts
May 07, 2014
12:25 PM
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To promote Sales --John Nemeth ends his first set with his "Buy a CD song" Has everyone laughing and seems to work wonders. If you want to keep a sharpie and not have anyone walk away with it. Just tape a cheap plastic flower to it. Most guys will never put that in their pocket.
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LSC
633 posts
May 07, 2014
4:55 PM
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I have to say there are some good tips in this thread. Keep those cards and letters coming folks.
Many years ago, long before crowd funding was invented, some friends of mine in Holland came up with a couple of wrinkles. They had a very popular local cover band. They didn't play often but when they did they would draw quite large crowds, especially during the summer town festivals. When they went to produce their first CD at every gig and every opportunity they would offer this deal to the crowd. Buy the CD in advance and get your name on the liner notes. They were asking $20 guilders the equivalent of about $15, the going rate at the time. They easily financed the project out of advance sales. They had a six page insert with pretty tiny font to get all the names in. They did them in alphabetical order so people could find theirs.
When they had the CD pressed and copies in hand they would send at least two people into the crowd with a box of CDs asking every single person if they would like to buy a copy. They would do this at the end of the set just before the encores which always came. With a real party atmosphere and plenty of beer down the necks of the punters by then the CDs flew. The impulse buy was pretty hard to resist. I'd see these girls selling empty a box of 50 within minutes. Guys buying for girl friends, people egging other people on to buy one too. I thought that a killer idea that I had never seen done before or since. It's like the difference in take between sitting a tip jar on the stage that people have to walk up to or sending someone round the room and presenting the opportunity.
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LSC
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nacoran
7720 posts
May 07, 2014
6:15 PM
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LCS, I had a variation on that as a cub scout. I'd go to tables where a guy and a girl were sitting together and offer to sell them a candybar. Chivalry is not dead. Without fail, every guy bought the girl the candybar, and half the time the girl would say she was on a diet and give it to me, which created a virtuous sugar induced cycle whereby I became a super speed candybar salesman. :)
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Nate
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First Post- May 8, 2009
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shadoe42
298 posts
May 07, 2014
8:40 PM
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grrr got CAPCHTA killed. lets try this again..be sure to copy this time before trying to post :)
Kickstarter is great but we have hit a saturation point and I am watching campaigns start to fail far more often. Timing is everything. And to often bands are Kickstarting or using Indiegogo for every project. I always thought you did that for the first one then managed your money and only went back to that well if absolutely needed or you had a huge project you wanted to do.
I did an Indiegogo for my first CD and it went wonderfully nearly doubling what I asked and that was after two other bands in my same genre had just run theirs.
But for the second I simply ran a preorder of $10 for digital download and $15 for Download + Disc for the pre sale. You got the download as fast as I got the paypal payment message. Those pre-orders paid for the duplication.
To keep the math simple I can get 100 discs, full color art, 4 page book, in a jewel case for around 300. I pay myself 5 bucks per CD and put 10 into the account. So for a box of 100 it takes 30 to pay for the current box, 30 to pay for the next box and leaves me 40 to put toward the next project duplication or profit. Along the way I am still getting 5 dollars a disc as salary so 500 per 100 discs.
Larger orders the math is different as the discs get cheaper up to a point. 1000 is usually the cheapest per unit cost.
I also stopped shrink wrapping discs. My band would shrink wrap and it adds a significant cost. almost 500 dollars for that same box of 100 discs when you add the wrap. And 98-99% of the time the shrink wrap was immediately stripped off so the disc could be signed. Some say wrap anyway cause it looks better. But I have folks every show thank me for not having to deal with it. But your mileage may vary.
We have drifted a bit from the original topic but this is a good discussion. To often musicians fail to look at the business side of music and that costs them in the end.
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Dr. Rev. Mr. Cheeks Miller
My Electronic Music World
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garry
514 posts
May 08, 2014
3:08 PM
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i've typically seen them for $15 at gigs. local bands more likely $10. bands who know me often try and give me them for free, but i insist on paying full price, a point of honor for me. the money doesn't matter much, it's about respect.
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Last Edited by garry on May 08, 2014 3:09 PM
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