Hey Diggs, we don't know one another or anything. But if you are revering to Adam's post in the thread about Mitch Kashmar.. That wasn't malintended at all as I read it. Obviously you hit an open nerve with Adam - the guy is under a lot of stress from organizing the whole HCH thing. Your remarks/feelings of not being recognized and his stress just met with a bad timing. I see how it can be a little harsh, but really, that doesn't seem personal at all! Adam is an Aries. That's how they roll, they get fired up sometimes.
Your a kick-ass player. If you want more recognition, you can just head out and play for people no? That's what I intend to do when I get that good. Hit jams and stuff and blow the crowds away. Why not take this as a challenge? One festival won't have you. So what.
BTW, I'm sure this thread will provide you with all the recognition one might need for a whole year. Don't rest on it, but conquer the world! And stop saying things like you want to leave. How are we expected to talk harp without one of our main chrom-accounts. You cut it out right there mister!
Last Edited by on May 14, 2012 2:38 AM
Based on the undercurrents that were starting to divert the stream that exists on this list into muddy waters, I feel Diggs is making the right decision at this time.
It's a big ol' world out there, enough room for everyone to find what they need. ---------- The Iceman
This is a mean old world, try and live it by yourself. This is a mean old world, try and live it by yourself. Can't get the one you love, have to use somebody else.
I've got the blues, gonna pack my things and go. I've got the blues, gonna pack my things and go. Guess you don't love me, babe, loving mister so-and-so.
Sometimes I wonder why can your love be so cold? Sometimes I wonder why can your love be so cold? I guess you don't love me, gonna pack my things and go.
Diggs, You one of the good guys - Tomorrows another day!
Turning Pebbles Into Pearls
Into the shell of an oyster a tiny foreign body—such as a tiny parasite—finds its way into the soft oyster body.
"The intruder, though microscopic, is a source of irritation and pain to the soft body of the oyster. Unable to rid itself of the unwelcome 'guest,' the oyster seeks to reduce the irritation by coating it with layers of soft, iridescent mother-of-pearl material from its own shell. Over time, the oyster transforms a painful irritation into a beautiful pearl of great value."
Most of us have "tiny parasites" or annoying "pebbles" that come into our life on a regular basis … many of which can be very frustrating and even painful.
But every one of these annoyances gives us a chance to grow and mature. Some will require great patience, others tough love.
Some will require our turning the other cheek, some confrontation, and some kindness and understanding. For example, addicts need to be treated with tough love.
Bullies require us to maintain healthy boundaries. Cheaters need to be confronted. Manipulators need to be managed. Control freaks need to be resisted, guilt throwers need to be challenged, and toxic people may need to be avoided, and so on.
We can turn every one of these annoying pebbles into pearls or we can allow them to make us bitter. For it's not what happens to us that matters, but how we react to what happens.
What we do about it is what matters—and that's a choice we make either consciously or unconsciously. And remember, "The bumps are what we climb on."
Just to be make sure: you aren't referring to my comment in any way are you? I was just trying to mediate what seemed to me to be an innocent difference of opinion in another thread between Diggs and Adam, as I think it's a shame if Diggs feels offended. He seems like a cool guy!
If I muddled with things that are beyond me, I apologize unreservedly.
Still hope Diggs isn't offended/won't leave just because of this.
I am not referring to your comment in any way. You have absolutely nothing to apologize for.
My opinion is that if Diggs feels he needs to move on from this list at this time, he should.
People come and go and come back to these lists, based on their emotional attachment and/or make up.
Sometimes people need a self imposed time out to work on some personal issues and come back later with more clarity and less personal attachment to outcomes.
(Quite often when someone says they are leaving a list, the reality is that they just stop posting, remaining as "lurkers").
---------- The Iceman
Last Edited by on May 14, 2012 5:51 AM
You are damn right you have nothing to offer! You are running out after a TINY little fit between you and Adam?! WTF man? Nobody here thinks you are less of a person or player because of ANYTHING you or Adam has stated in the past.
Your contributions ARE appreciated. But, I don't appreciate anything with that attitude.
Don't know you Diggs, and maybe should I pipe down, but as a novice on this forum, I feel you as a kind of a pillar of the forum. If you leave now with the reason you mention, it means you have no reason to quit. I agree with Miles. Shit.
It appears that no matter what the nature of a forum may be, the drama is rife. Whether its a gun forum, fitness forum, etc, people get ticked off, often times for the silliest of reasons.
I don't know what the argument is between you two( nor do I care quite frankly), but i am sure you both have bigger fish to fry.
This forum has shifted tone a few times in the last year or two - and I am assuming that has something to do with it and not just the previous thread, but don't let that weigh on you, Diggs!
Most musicians, or wanna be musicians, have a conflict with their ego that includes a strong desire for acceptance. That has always been an interesting dynamic on this board, IMO.
IMHO, that desire should not be met with peers on an internet forum, lol. I can list any number of reasons why, but it really comes down to who you want your audience to be...other harmonica players, other musicians, or fans of your type of music.
Here, and often on YouTube, the "stars" of the harmonica tend to be people trying to find a niche within the harmonica world - frequently removed from live performance. When your life is mostly playing live in front of audiences largely made up of non-harmonica players, I wouldn't expect the same reaction from sharing music here as if you were performing in front of a webcam or offering learning materials or playing straight blues.
Really, those people are not going after their peers either, come to think of it. They are attracting harmonica-playing fans of less current talent and ability through providing them with digestible materials that are practical to them. Sometimes, if they build enough blues cred, they then get a free pass in the blues world. Those who "get it" can often grow frustrated with their success in relation as they feel they can play at the same level.
The problem then becomes more about business than ability. I think Ronnie Shellist is a great example of this. Adam is another. They sought out to exploit the blues harmonica niche and used that leverage to gain access to other avenues. That isn't to say they can't play, as that is 100% untrue...it is just that they needed to find access to more potential fans in order to support their projects (they have more than earned their spot in the music world).
How many of Ronnie's investors from his Kickstarter campaign were harmonica players? Probably the overwhelming majority. Who is buying his album?
The harp world gave him access to resources, and now non-harmonica players, that he can make money from. It was a great way to find a place in the biz! He is now able to do many things that he wants to do in a way that represents who he is and wants to be! Awesome!
If you want other harmonica players to love you, my suggestion is to share as much blues playing and instruction as possible. Then be very accessible to communication with fans and find ways of presenting yourself as more important/successful than you really are in a polite and optimistic manner as possible. You'll gain some momentum by "dressing for the job you want" and hopefully have some cool things play out.
If you are not going to be a bluesman, the road is much harder as you have to probably find non-harmonica players to get going.
Iceman_ I was thinking that,but thought hard about not saying it! Good one!
Diggs- You've always displayed a good sense of humor on the forum. You seemed to have lost that in this instance. You're certainly have been around enough to know this is business and not personal. I would certainly miss your presence. Besides,any harp forum that has pages of text critiquing Kim Wilson's playing-you have to take with a grain of salt.
Diggs, you've always been a big part of this forum as long as I remember. I remember back in the bad old days when there would be a huge mess thread and you'd post some of the most serene tracks ever to get everyone to calm down. There were a few times when I was about set to walk away and your videos pulled me back from the brink. I've always seen you as a force that fights chaos in the name of calmness.
I hope this blows over. I don't happen to have perfect video handy. You would be missed.
As an aside, let's leave any syndromes out of the discussion. Ice, I know you are just joking, but as a favor, can you not stir that pot? The harp world is small enough so stuff like that gets back to people.
---------- Nate Facebook Thread Organizer (A list of all sorts of useful threads)
Last Edited by on May 14, 2012 12:32 PM
I don't read a lot of the silly stuff on here & don't post much anymore either. Maybe come back much less frequently after a short break to catch up your weekly What's Going On In a Small Slice of the Harmonica World news, it helps.
For the record, Adam's never asked me to do anything, either in any way, shape or form - something I could not possibly care less about. The world would be a much happier place if people were not so easily hurt and offended.
There was a time last year when I was having a hard time - it had nothing to do with MBH. I just left and I was gone almost a year. Didn't announce it, just one day, I was gone, youtube videos all down, stopped posting in all forums, even my own. For anybody in the future who thinks of bowing out and leaving some forum, if you just leave quietly, it makes it a lot easier to come back when you've got it together again. People usually won't know you're gone. People noticed the deleted Youtubes, but nobody noticed I was gone from MBH. It's just a forum.
"Really, those people are not going after their peers either, come to think of it. They are attracting harmonica-playing fans of less current talent and ability through providing them with digestible materials that are practical to them. Sometimes, if they build enough blues cred, they then get a free pass in the blues world. Those who "get it" can often grow frustrated with their success in relation as they feel they can play at the same level.
The problem then becomes more about business than ability. I think Ronnie Shellist is a great example of this. Adam is another. They sought out to exploit the blues harmonica niche and used that leverage to gain access to other avenues. That isn't to say they can't play, as that is 100% untrue...it is just that they needed to find access to more potential fans in order to support their projects (they have more than earned their spot in the music world)."
When I say a crock of shit, I am referring to your implication that somehow Adam sought out to exploit the blues harmonica niche, as you put it. It sounds insidious. Who gets a "free pass"? To even imply (correct me if I am reading what you wrote the wrong way) that Adam is "frequently removed from live performance" is ridiculous.
And I just don't buy the argument that Adam Gussow needed to put YouTube videos out there to get fans to support "projects". Adam put them out there for the love of the music, and because he is a teacher.
Maybe I'm reading what you wrote incorrectly, but that's my impression.
i think iceman is right. i once walked away from a forum i had been very active in after some things got ugly. it wasn't a conscious "take my ball and go home" thing. others had said things i didn't like, i had said some things i wished i hadn't. i just didn't feel comfortable being there anymore.
i didn't actually quit, just went dark for a while, intending to be back after i chilled out. but after a while, i realized i just wasn't interested in it anymore. it was just time to move on. never looked back.
i hope diggs stays, or goes, whichever is best for him right now. he'll be back or he won't. life goes on.
You're adding negative connotations to things that aren't meant to be negative. I am, in fact, being complementary to people like Adam and Ronnie that turned their passion into business.
They have wonderful things to say and play as they relate to harmonica. They have found ways of doing that while collecting social, monetary, and legacy creating ways.
It is a crock of shit to think people don't work hard and smart for their success. Exploiting isn't a bad thing at all in this instance...it is smart business. And they are frequently removed from live performances...Adam and Ronnie both have more views and videos of them in isolation teaching than playing.
Adam and Ronnie didn't become famous online by posting gig footage with bands. That doesn't take away from anything. I am just pointing to the fact that they have a good business model and at some point in time, whether originally designed to be or not, they realized that and chose to go for the throat.
That is bold, and I wouldn't have the balls to invest in it like that. The proof is in the pudding, who knew who Ronnie was before his lessons? Adam? How many gigs did they have and for what kind of money?
They offer things a large part of the harmonica world want. If you want the harp world to like you, you have to meet them part way.
What Adam and Ronnie have done is totally brilliant, and I am jealous I didn't think of it first. They are just as famous, at least in the blues harmonica world, as anybody, yet they don't have to gig 300 days a year (Adam has been booking a lot of shows late, somewhere in this thread I made it sound like he doesn't gig a lot, but he does...my bad), live in a van, or give up the comforts of a real life (well, sorta, I realize the amount of heart and work that has gone into their success).
Finally, by free pass, I mean the X factor. For some it is schtick, age, race, gender...for those guys, what gave them access to great blues community was their harmonica fan base. I am sorry, I really like Adam, and Ronnie seems like a cool guy, but I wouldn't have a clue who either was was it not for their efforts to establish themselves as PERSONALITIES online.
I can find any number of cool harp performance vids with bands, but if people (going back to the OP) think that putting a well played song on YouTube is going to help market them compared to offering something in demand, they are wrong!
***Like Adam previously stated, being good isn't good enough, you have a draw. To do that, you have to have a persona delivering to people what they want. Again, proof is in the pudding. Look at the HARMONICA events these guys are associated with. Hell, Adam has been around for decades kicking ass, yet he isn't playing and touring every weekend. They draw harmonica players...maybe millions of them. The con being they are scattered all over the world. Hence, the need to make a name/money from exploiting current technology.
I mean ZERO disrespect, but how many major blues festivals and packed houses are these guys playing? Blues harmonica is a small niche within a small niche...it can give you a ton of great things - see Adam's and Ronnie's success - but it isn't like being a great guitar player or something.
I dunno, they got GREAT things going and I think they do it in a very smart way. I've always thought it was more important to gain non-harmonica playing fans by doing other things well in local bands, but as a father and someone with a career, I realize that there is more than one way to find joy and gains while making music. My buddy Dave Owens is doing all the "right" things, but having a MUCH harder time than Adam or Ronnie. I think this is because he is trying to break in the singer/songwriter niche which is enormous. There are a dozen guys like him in every town.
There is probably only one harmonica player in that town and Adam or Ronnie would cut their heads if necessary. They are living the dream...they can focus on harp, harp, harp, whereas most of us are fighting guitar players, band leaders, and college girls wanting house music.
Typically people make a big deal out of "leaving" they get the "please don't go " posts and then come back. It has been my experience that if you are truly leaving, like Elk River...you just leave and don't tell anyone.
This forum seems to be a bit worse than other music forums i am on for the alpha egos. And no one ever seems to want to take it private if they have a disagreement.
For instance not to very long ago I got a little sideways in a conversation with Walter Tore.. I took exception to something he said as I felt he questioned my drive and devotion to my music. But I bowed out of the topic and took the conversation private. We got it cleared up and on we go.
Not trying to say I am better than anyone just saying that if you have a problem take it offline and away from the public eye so you can get a more neutral eye on the issue. Instead of keeping it public and escalating the problem more and more till everyone gets mad and then things get said that no one really means.
Mike - I beg to differ. I've shot video for bands and put it on YouTube for the express purpose of finding the artist gigs. They were told not to send a promo kit, but to email in link to a performance on YouTube. They got the gig.
I met Ronnie once when he was hosting the jam at Q's in Denver. I learned about his jam from the local Blues Society's web site. I didn't know anything about him or his YouTube channel. I didnt even know he was a harp player. It never hurts to market yourself in a variety of ways.
I notice that a lot of people here seem to be making an assumption that Diggs is leaving the forum because he and I have had some sort of disagreement. That's silly. His only post in this thread says nothing about me. He casts aspersions on himself and the degree to which who he is right now meshes or doesn't mesh with this forum. Buddhist speak about how the wise man "drives all blame into himself." Sometimes it might be a good idea if we took people at face value, rather than trying to read below the surface. If we did so, we might decide that Diggs is a wise man who knows what he wants and needs. We might even conclude that he's expressed himself in a pretty classy way.
Let go of the drama. ElkRiver and Iceman are both right, as far as I'm concerned. People are free to show up here and leave as they see fit. There are no club dues. The door is always open.
I tend to err, when I err, on the side of candor. In another thread, when Diggs made a show of complaining--or "complaining"; I really can't tell how serious it was--that I hadn't offered to bring him to Hill Country Harmonica, I did my best to state candidly why I hadn't. When somebody places me on the spot like that, I tend, as I say, to be candid. I didn't consider Diggs's personal dig to be in violation of the forum creed--I'm not THAT sensitive!--but I didn't particularly like it, given how hard I (and especially Jeff Silverman) have been busting ass trying conscientiously to make the event a memorable experience for registrants and teachers alike. I posted my original post in that thread about Mitch Kashmar out of the purest desire to celebrate a great player. Diggs found a way of taking that positive and turning it into a negative. He did so playfully--or not. Or both. Half-joking about something is a pretty good way of expressing aggression. Being aggressively candid is a pretty direct way of pushing back.
I'm from New York. People there, and especially bluesy folk, like to poke at you. I poked back. I was candid. I expressed my annoyance. But I remained civil, and I made a point, repeatedly, to praise Diggs as a person and as a player. I didn't fawn over him, however. I don't expect people to fawn over me. (That's never been a problem for the folks at Harp-L.)
I would prefer to see Diggs' post above not as a cry designed to provoke people to say "Stay! Stay! Stay!", but as an authentic gesture by a self-determined individual artist. People do as they do, finally. We can all learn to respect that.
Last Edited by on May 14, 2012 8:30 PM
Totally different context...and how many hundreds of thousands (millions) of views have they had? Global success? Invites to prestigious events showcasing their talents?
Regarding Ronnie, Joe, you are in the vast minority. How many hundreds of thousands of people have come to see him at that jam?
Guys like Adam and Ronnie are that top 3%. They may not tour the globe physically, but they have reached thousands and thousands of people who want to see what they are offering - and not having it forced fed like pop culture likes to do...and they even make people happy doing it!
I am not going to take the time to look it up or ask for the analytics of when their videos have peaked in popularity, but I bet in both instances, it was a foundation of non-gig videos that created enough buzz to make performance videos must-sees. Had either Adam or Ronnie started just posting gig videos, who is to say it would have taken off.
They always had the stuff - they just needed to expose people to it. Right now, someone who would kick the harmonica crap out of all of us is playing and we'll never hear it. ---------- Mike VHT Special 6 Mods Quicksilver Custom Harmonicas - When it needs to come from the soul...
12gagedan, especially money for nothing and chicks for free.
Addressing lessons vs. performance videos- lessons are much more generic to the instrument, less bound by genre. If you listen to music you can listen to millions upon millions of songs on YouTube. If you play guitar, even although there are tons of guitar lessons on YouTube it's still a tiny number compared to the number of general music videos. If you play harmonica, there are even fewer lessons. Lessons, at least good ones, take more effort than just putting up performance videos. The default setting for a musician is playing. Good general purpose lessons cut across genres. If you watch a basic harmonica lesson you might be a jazz player, a classical player, a rock player, a blues player, a harpboxer... it unpigeon-holes your music in some ways (although you do limit yourself to people interested in learning your instrument). Combine that with your regular videos and all of the sudden you've created a whole new audience. I don't mean to diminish creativity in music, but let's face it, for years payola was the name of the game because getting people to listen to your song multiple times gets it stuck in people's heads. It doesn't how you get them to listen to it (well, unless you are breaking the law with payola schemes!)
Of course, it is possible to get too many listens. The Macarena makes me want to puncture my eardrums. :)
That's really all I am saying. Those guys found a niche and attacked it and used those resources to support their careers. IMO, it is a very respectful and honorable way to do it.
I've been playing harp 10yrs...playing in bands 10yrs...playing blues music for 8yrs...I realize lots of people have more time in than I do, BUT I have just as much time and experience with the current music scene - which is way different than a generation ago.
The reality of it is you have to find a way to be a draw. Using the Internet and your peers is one way of doing that.
Back to the perceived that broke the camel's back, the evidence appears to show that being a popular harmonica draw with harmonica players can have a lot to do with working within that niche as a resource and performer. It also helps to be friends with other successful harmonica players.
If you are one of the very few who do this really well, you become enough of a draw or perceived draw to get similar attention from other blues fans.
Look at the contemporaries - no, not people who came up through a different reality like Rod Piazza, for example. Think of Jason Ricci, Dennis Gruenling, etc...A large part of their legend comes through direct support of the harmonica world. There are a ton of great contemporaries that can play just as well or maybe even better that don't get the same attention because nobody knows who they are.
90% or more of the harmonica world has an obsession with blues. If you are performing not-so-easily-accessible music that isn't blues, your harmonica peers are less likely to bite than if you played what they wanted to hear.
Heck, look at how people react to Howard Levy and John Popper. Most people dismiss them for reasons based on limited experience.
Harpninja, At least one person had heard of both those guys before their videos. I taught Ronnie how to bend a note and spent around three years playing "I call, you respond" with him and talking harp. Very few of these were formal lessons where money was exchanged, but the first gorup were. He was just a special student and we were friends and I wasn't trying to earn a living teaching, more by playing then.
Adam gave me two lessons when I lived in NY and let me sit in once. Satan and Adam had already been in a U2 video, Big River had toured and Adam had published Mr. Satan's Apprentice. To me, Ronnie's youtubes brought him recognition, Adam's were a step in the process.
Also, Ronnie's early youtube's were of him jamming only. He definitely has a vid with over a million hits, which I do not think he has while teaching.
YouTube virtually relaunched Adam's career...but regardless, their online personas are the key to their current success and that can't be debated...and if we had access to their accounts (which I am not suggesting we ask for) we could look at the analytics, and it would clearly show that 1.) the viewers are at least 80% male, 2.) over half will be 40 or older (probably), 3.) they are from all over the world, 4.) their performance videos spiked in views AFTER educational material was released, and 5.) any surge in popularity for being a skilled harp player on YT probably has declined over time (harder to prove, but I think you can find evidence).
Again, it is great that a half dozen, or a few dozen, or even a thousand of us were fans or knew of these people sans YouTube.
HOWEVER
Adam has 9 MILLION views on YouTube...9,000,000!!!! Let's assume that HALF of those people worshiped at the altar of Gussow and were drinking his harmonica juice pre-YT. But, any rational person would realize that there is no way half of 'em were already on the bus before the vids.
That means 4,500,000 new fans/followers/viewers. Ok, most people digging it will view those vids more than once. Let's assume that all 4.5 MILLION, again - million, watch it 100 times each.
That is still super conservatively 45,000 unique viewers (I can prove over 20,000 by his subscriber number, but I think it is at least double that)! That is a shit-ton of people. Being that most the vids, including the most popular, are geared towards harmonica players - and not even fans of harmonica - that number is even more impressive as it shows a HUGE chunk of semi-serious to serious harmonica players have tuned in.
Adam can chime in if he wants, but I don't think 45,000 harmonica players were concerned with what he was doing in the years leading up to his YT vids...obviously he had some popularity still from a very successful run with S and A, but it wasn't at its peak, he was doing a lot of gigging, he was part of a formal act...and his initial legacy didn't start in a flat world when it was peaking. I had his book (read it on my honeymoon 7 years ago) and all the SA CDs way before his YT stuff too.
The fact that people on this board, who make up maybe 1-5% of harmonica players are savvy to the brand. We are, though, in the HUGE minority.
Ronnie is at 7 million views. I would wage the same argument with his material, and I would suggest that Adam's 2 million more views were fueled by being a popular fringe artist in the harmonica world.
The argument could be made with Ronnie that he was the first YT harmonica star, lol. He gave people what they wanted from YT harmonica before everyone else was trying. If I learned his first couple of jam vids to the letter and posted them, no way, in the current near-oversaturated world of YT, would it catch like that. Five years ago, though...(and I would insist that a lot of people have found his newer vids and gone back to view the old vids).
Christelle has done a good job with YT too. Like Adam and Ronnie, bringing up the fact that they are great players isn't really the point. If you look at her vids, she started something no one else was really doing - frequent updates jamming on a webcam. She is around 7 million views, but she doesn't offer much instructional material. Note that she also doesn't have vids over the million mark on their own.
She is a great player, but the fact that she is a woman doesn't hurt. She earned her views for sure, but being one of the first, an the first woman, surely helped in a world where middle aged white men are the primary viewer. She appears to try and go after a different crowd and genre than blues, but has garnished a lot of YT attention.
She, IMO, really proves my theories. If she didn't have YT, no way a million+ people would know who she is. Unlike Adam and Ronnie, she does not - either before or after YT - have a background in live performance, harmonica instruction, or attending harmonica events. That isn't a diss at all. Again, she is being smart - getting the chance to do her thing and make the best of her situation.
I can go on all day about this. 12gagedan has almost 2,000,000 views of his beginners harp lesson. That accounts for over 50% of his 3.5 million views. His other vids, have a 50-100x fewer views on average. That just is what it is. I mean, he has tens of thousands of views on his other vids, but his "beginner" lesson is the most popular.
If you look at Adam's page, his performance material generally has the lower views. His "beginner" type lessons have 10-100x more views.
I would use myself as a case study, but I have no where near the sample size to do so. I don't have the number of vids nor views to really prove anything.
My first posts were all performance vids under the user name NiteRail. There are 17 vids (not even a 1/10th of Adam, Ronnie, or Christelle) with a "whopping" 14,000 views. My personal page has 37 vids, again, not really very many, with only 40,000 views. I have never posted an instructional material relevant to budding blues harmonica players. Most my vids are just random demos of things people talk about on boards like this or even more random performance footage.
I am looking mostly at the relationship between the most popular harmonica players on YT, what they share that is popular, and how that has impacted their careers.
Again, in hindsight, I would have been very intentional in starting a YT channel as a way to market a brand. The truth is, though, I am lazy, hate posting videos from my basement, and don't prioritize my time to do such. I think a lot about doing a rock harmonica channel and eBook, but it seems like work, and not very fun compared to playing with my kids or building harps. I would hypothesize that it wouldn't, no matter how well done, work like it does for those others. That niche is much smaller than even blues harmonica and I don't want to start with basic blues stuff and work up to rock.
With NiteRail I begged the guitar player to post instructional guitar vids on the channel to gain views and potential fans. No one was going to find the channel by accident.
***The only thing other than lesson material for your average harp player that can really help someone get started is gear demos.
