Oisin
774 posts
Apr 07, 2011
3:41 PM
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How easy is it to fit marine band plates into recessed combs like the SP20 ??.
I have a some old super vamper harps (exactly like Marine bands) and I want to keep the reed plates and cover plates but I donn't like wooden combs or the sandwich type construction. I realise I will have to do a bit of drilling.
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Oisin
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Swezey8
72 posts
Apr 07, 2011
3:49 PM
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chromaticblues should be able to help ya on this one. His custom jobs on SP20's include a swap to MB cover plates. I believe he just drills a single hole in the cover plates to align with the existing one in the SP20 comb and uses a drill size that will allow for the same cover plate screws and fasteners that stock SP20's use. In regards to bit size and all- have to get that from an experienced source!
If this is your first foray into the cover plate swap though, you'll notice a distinct tonal and volume difference with the MB cover plates. Maybe to your liking, maybe not- but def a different and cool option. Hope it works out for ya!
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Oisin
775 posts
Apr 07, 2011
3:58 PM
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Thanks for the post Swezey. I've been collecting these old harps for a few years now but I've been playing SP20s all this time and when I started playing the super vampers over the last few days I realised I just don't like the sandwich construction.
They have a lovely tone though and I hope this isn't lost too much if I swop combs.
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Oisin
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Swezey8
73 posts
Apr 07, 2011
5:34 PM
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didn't catch the reed plate swap too...that's gonna be a little more work drilling the reedplates if you want to swap both. if they are the same as MBs you'll add 3holes to the front of the reedplates to match SP20s comb. but you may not need them, depends on the seal i guess to see how airtight they are without
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ElkRiverHarmonicas
631 posts
Apr 07, 2011
7:32 PM
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I've done some crazy stuff in my day, never been crazy enough to do that. You'll have to trim the edges of the reedplate to fit and you'll need perfect precision. Recessed comb reedplates are generally smaller. You'd have to make your sandwich reedplate to fit.
Elkriverharmonicas.com
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"There are only two things money can't buy - true love and homegrown tomatoes." - Lewis Grizzard
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walterharp
576 posts
Apr 07, 2011
8:18 PM
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translation: if dave says that, it means no! unless you are completely bat sh&t obsessed
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htownfess
261 posts
Apr 07, 2011
9:06 PM
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Oisin, I did that with a couple of early 1990s Dark Ages MBs back around 2000. You only have to trim the ends of the MB reedplates, and you can cut that off with ordinary tin snips. Front to back fit is already fine. Then you have to either cut off the plastic uprights that stick up through the reedplates to support the coverplates, or use a drill & files to make rectangular openings in the reedplates for them. I cut off the supports.
It is a bit fiddly to fit SP20 coverplates so that their edge rests atop the outer edge of the mouthpiece side of the MB plates, but not too tough. Some people use MB coverplates, just slotted normally into the groove on the reedplates. I've done that, feels a little different but doesn't leak air horribly. Supporting either kind of coverplate is an issue if you're the crushing kind; I put these two together with three through-bolts to support the covers and fasten the reedplates, just ignored most of the original SP20 screw holes and let Micropore handle the sealing.
The biggest issue may actually be winding up with MB nail holes in the wrong places, sucking wind. Back then, I just took Micropore tape and sealed it. You might be able to seal the individual holes on the reedplates instead, but I didn't have the patience to experiment with that.
Too much work, but those Dark Ages MBs could be so bad that I thought I needed to do something drastic. Tim Moyer sold harps that were MB reedplates and covers transferred to combs from the Chinese SP20 knockoffs Hohner sold, the Blues Band IIRC, with Micropore doing the sealing.
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Jehosaphat
39 posts
Apr 07, 2011
10:08 PM
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@Htownfess"Tim Moyer sold harps that were MB reedplates and covers transferred to combs from the Chinese SP20 knockoffs Hohner sold, the Blues Band IIRC, with Micropore doing the sealing. "
I bought one of those from Tim around 10(?) years ago,i dunno if i just got lucky but that Harp(in A) was just pure joy to play.
It knew i wanted a 3 draw two step bend before I did.
As far as i remember Tim actually stopped using micropore as a gasket just before he stopped doing customs all together.
I think that the story was he came to the conclusion that the micropore deadened/dampened the resonnanace ofthe harp
Anyone know if Tim is still around harpin'?
Last Edited by on Apr 07, 2011 10:09 PM
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jim
790 posts
Apr 08, 2011
3:16 AM
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The question is WHY????? What you are about to do is useless waste of time.
Sp20 and MB have IDENTICAL reeds.
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7LimitJI
456 posts
Apr 08, 2011
3:31 AM
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@jim
I think there's a clue in the OP
"but I donn't like wooden combs or the sandwich type construction"
And anyway, one mans waste of time, is another mans hobby.
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chromaticblues
767 posts
Apr 08, 2011
9:29 AM
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@Oisin I haven't tried, but know I can. I modify things much more difficult than that!
OK Do you know that SP 20 and Marine bands use the same reeds and the reedplates are the same material and thickness.
OK If you really want to do what your talking about. First see if one of the reedplates is more apted to fit in a SP 20 comb or Big River comb. The Big River comb is a liitle bigger and might just drop in? Anyway when you trim the reedplates (if you have to) make sure the reeds are going to line up in the middle of the slot. Get the reedplates to fit your comb then drill your holes one plate at a time useing the comb as your templete.
Good Luck! Oh and if you have to trim some off the end use a hacksaw and go slow and light. Tin snips can leave it slightly mangled then you will have to straighten that with a ballpen hammer.
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htownfess
262 posts
Apr 08, 2011
11:39 PM
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This is one of the harps I was talking about; not a great photo but you'll get the idea. I guess I used four screws to hold the plates together and maybe drilled endholes for SP20 coverplates, but I think those older MB plates had that hole already. You can see two screws sticking up to support the top coverplate. IIRC, trimming the ends of the reedplates with tin snips was no big deal; this one looks like I dressed the ends with a file afterward.
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nacoran
3986 posts
Apr 08, 2011
11:49 PM
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If you are a plastic harp player and it's the wood comb that is bothering you, before you do all that work, think about sanding and sealing the combs or trying other materials. I'm not of fan of MB's because of the combs, but I've played harps with wooden combs and protruding reed plates that are comfortable. The comb should be sealed and the front edge of the reed plate can be sanded smooth. And it's probably less work than what you are planning and will probably give you a better result.
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ElkRiverHarmonicas
632 posts
Apr 09, 2011
4:07 PM
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Htownfess, you are always one of my favorite posters... really just the ends? That's sweet. Doesn't look like you had to trim much at all in that pic. Erifahs never explored this in great detail. I've known of special 20 plates that have gone on wood combs sandwich style. Jason Ricci did it once, he actually cut a coverplate groove for it.
You should try it Oisin. The ends are no big deal.
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"There are only two things money can't buy - true love and homegrown tomatoes." - Lewis Grizzard
Last Edited by on Apr 09, 2011 4:09 PM
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Oisin
777 posts
Apr 10, 2011
10:22 AM
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Firstly thanks for all the great advice chaps. I'm not too sure i'd be very confident cutting reedplates so I might not try SP20s for cambs.
However I have just tried one of the reedplates in a Lee Oskar comb and it fits in there..with room to spare. So my next question would be if the reedpalte was screwed down tight enough, would these gaps matter?
Edit..Scrub that plan...the coverplates are much too small.
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Oisin
Last Edited by on Apr 10, 2011 10:34 AM
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ElkRiverHarmonicas
636 posts
Apr 10, 2011
12:22 PM
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Room to spare may not be a good thing. Any places where air can leak? Also, tight is not good. Tight is leaky, you just want screws snug.
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"There are only two things money can't buy - true love and homegrown tomatoes." - Lewis Grizzard
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