Hello, Lately I've been working on getting my tongue blocking down. I've been doing pretty good. I've even been tongue switching to be able to t-block the 1st hole. Now I am trying to bend while t-blocking and have been having a real hard time. I was told to switch back to a pucker to do bends, but it seems like a hassle to be switching embouchers all the time? Do most people switch to do bends? If not, does anyone have any tips they could share on bending while using a t-block embouchure?
Try dropping your jaw as low as you can. It takes a little longer to get bending using TB as your tongue is occupied in closing off holes but you will get it.
I know there are some people who only use Lip pursing for bending holes 1,2 and 3 and TB the rest but you should be able to bend all notes using both methods.
You will find that switching embouchers will come easily when you learn to TB effectively. ---------- Oisin
I tb almost exclusively, and learned to bend by articulating kind of a tee sound for unbent, and a too sound for bent notes. (keee or kooo might be easier)
Some variation of that method will get you started, then you will naturally refine it as you go.
Hi, I'm going through the same process. My teacher said to do the bend LP and without changing anything do the bend TB. Took me about 2-3 minutes to get a bend. While it was not pretty I got a TB bend, and have now been working on it for about a month. I can get draw bends now on all notes between 1 and 6. Lot more work to do from my end to get it consistently. Rob
What helped me learn to bend while TB was forgetting the tongue and mouth. Instead, try to bend from down in your gut. It's hard to explain, I admit. :-) Try to pull from down around just above your belt buckle. As with any harp technique, however, don't pull HARD and don't force things. You've got to relax and breathe through the harp. It'll come.
I don't understand this dropping your jaw stuff. If one is playing with good embouchure the jaw should be dropped anyway. I'm not a full time TB player but I can TB and can bend while TBing. The technique is identical to the technique I use To bend while LPing.
BEND WITH YOUR THROAT. You narrow or constrict the throat by subvocalizing "ooow" as you pull air in from deep in your diaphragm. The "koo" or "too" sounds work as well, but i think one gets faster response and fatter tone without using the consonant. But YMMV.
Last Edited by on Feb 02, 2011 6:25 AM
A further thought: "ooow" works for a half step bend. Open up to "ohh" for a full step bend and "ahh" for a step and a half bend. This works LPing or TBing.
Bending with the throat is, IMHO, faster, more accurate and produces more even tone and attack than using the tongue. CAVEAT: What I am calling the throat may actually be the root of the tongue, but it's so far back it feels like the throat. I'm not certain about the actual physiology.
Last Edited by on Feb 02, 2011 6:25 AM
I happened upon this video by Ronnie right before I saw this thread. As I try more and more to implement TBing into my playing, I'm finding more and more that Tbers vary quite a bit in when and how they TB.
He plays holes 1,2,3,8,9, and 10 pursed...he tongue blocks when he plays holes 4,5,6,7.
Anytime he bends a note, draw or blow, on any hole, he plays pursed.
I find that interesting because I hear so much that bending while TBing is so imporant. Does this mean it is not common to bend a note,say hole 4 draw, and play the flutter lifts to the left? WHen you bend TBing, are you usually just playing the single note?
I am a hardcore lip pursing overbending fool, but I am trying to expand my abilities to tongue blocking.
My point here is would I get the TBing effects I'm missing from just learning to block/lift/flutter on the left side while playing an unbent note on the right? What effects (other than tone which is another story) would I not be able to do if I learn side TBing and skip the bending while TBing?
@ Harpdude I would say no you wouldn't. You got to remember there alot of people that are good that will tell something completely different than the next really good player. Some will even tell you if you don't do it the way they do it your doing it wrong! Ronnie is a good player, but I would not take his advice on that one. I would say try to learn as much TBing as you can so you can go back and forth at will. TBing on the high end works great for tongue lifts and slaps. I don't TB bend on the highend, but some people do! I TB bend on 4, 5, and 6 sometimes just because it sounds different than LP bends. I'm not saying it sounds better, just different. LP TB and Octaves all sound different and I think it sounds cool to go from one to the other quickly and effortlessly.
Most people new to TB who started out puckering often don't have their embouchure or the inside shape of their mouths opened up enough to properly accomodate the tongue.
@Matzen --- Your embouchure is still at a point that it hasn't truly adapted to the TB well at all because of what I just mentioned, and this is very common.
IT's more like dropping your teeth just a tad more than the throat, but you need to make more like a singer, be 100% FULLY relaxed, NOT force ANYTHING (which is just what you're doing and the more you force it, the harder you're making things for yourself) and the throat needs to be more wide open, plus the tongue had to be pressed VERY LIGHTLY and it's clearly obvious that for you, this is FAR from the case. ---------- Sincerely, Barbeque Bob Maglinte Boston, MA http://www.barbequebob.com CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
Heed the wisdom of hvyj and barbequebob! I can bend just as well TB as LP now. I found that I did better if I kept my embouchure (jaw and tongue too) unchanged when bending, and concentrate on bending with the throat. Also when I was starting off TB, I had to use a lot of muscle force and tension because my tongue was not used to moving that way. Now I'm able to relax more and more.
Tongue blocking is awkward at first, but you can bend ALL the notes and do overblows in the TB embouchure, if you keep at it. If you have the time to work on it, I suggest that you do. THEN choose which techniques you prefer after you've given them all a fair shot.
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Last Edited by on Feb 02, 2011 10:18 AM
@7LimitJI- THANKS! I've been struggling with TB bends, always had to go back to LP, but I just tried the "Keooo" articulation on a MB Deluxe in C and found I could hit some bends straight off the bat, the rest are getting there quicker than ever.
I can bend while TB'ing, but I don't like the way it feels. Specifically, the air hitting my tongue from that angle. I can OB, but not very efficiently. I have a ton of respect for those that TB all their bends. I can see the pros and cons of either approach, but most the TB players I am into tend to switch to a pucker for bends.
Playing TB with some slaps on the upper octave in 3rd position can sound a lot like a chromatic.
If you can bend while you TB, try bending while playing split intervals. For example, play the 2-5 draw and then bend the 2 down to the octave of the 5. I haven't mastered bending the 3 to match the 6.
/If you can bend while you TB, try bending while playing split intervals. For example, play the 2-5 draw and then bend the 2 down to the octave of the 5. I haven't mastered bending the 3 to match the 6./
1-3** to 1-3 and 3*-5 to 3-5 are awesome.
EDIT: try 1-3** / 1-3 / 1-3** / (123)B. At 0.18ish (I think) that's what Joe Filisko is doing.
@HarpNinja --- I do most bends with TB and can easily do them with the pucker as well. I personally find the upper register bends easier puckered, but they can be done TB'd as well. Getting used to TB bends takes some time to work with them and getting used to the idea having a FULLY relaxed embouchure so that you allow for flexibility is KEY fo that and most people new to the TB technique, not even doing bending, are forcing their tongue on the harp and everything they do is always forced and far too rigid to be able to adapt to anything easily. If you're always thinking about it, you're usualyly trying to force it to happen, which once you do that, you quickly get yourself behind the 8-ball.
I'm so used to slipping in and out of going from TB to LB bor bends and single notes, often changing in midphrase that I don't even think about it.
I've done what you've mentioned on your last paragrpah and part of doing that is having everything FULLY relaxed and actually being flexible enough with the embouchure so that you can open the mouth a tad wider in order to do that. In a way, is not that different than getting an octave on a chromatic, which requires you to open your mouth to cover 5 holes with the tongue blocking the 3 in the middle. ---------- Sincerely, Barbeque Bob Maglinte Boston, MA http://www.barbequebob.com CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
Hvjy is right! I thought I was bending notes by lowering my jaw, but it is my throat that opens and drops down. I move my jaw to change tonal shadings. I don't usually think about this stuff.
