This is a familiar Horace Silver tune, but I can't remember the name of it. Anybody?
Jay does it in third position and Rob does it cross harp. This is the sort of jazz blues that used to come up in Harlem clubs when I was hanging out up there. NY-area players, like these guys, needed to know how to hang with this sort of tune. It's a long way from Chicago grooves to this stuff! But very good for expanding your range. I encourage everybody to learn this tune. I really will, one of these days.......
Personally, I'd love to hear more chromatic lines and things of that sort, but I'm speaking from the mind of a person who has only been listening to Coltrane, Davis, Krupa, etc, for the past few months. I think it's good, though!
I don't see jealousy at all. I never claimed to be an incredible player and I am not a Jazz genius, but I do have a preferred sound I like to hear, and that is my comments given to this video. I'm very happy with how I play but I've chosen to take a hiatus to listening to harmonica 24/7.
Yes that is really cool. That's one of my favorite things to do in one of my own songs, I also do an extended solo with Jazz tunes in it, always including "My Favorite Things."
Personally love the leaner sweeter Trane ballads best. Miles was a pretty darn sparse player himself - though he played with all sorts of course.
Nothing wrong with your personal leanings Zack - I think of this song in mellower terms - though.
I'm with you on listening to music other than harmonica. I just started to listen to harmonica players again after many years of all but ignoring it. - 'Harp playing' sure has undergone some amazing development in the last two decades.
Regarding Jay - It seemed, as a gifted young-un with quickly developing chops, he had been overly seduced by the faster means better - or 'gotta play more notes because I can' school. This video is evidence to me of a maturing approach. He can and will play plenty of notes. Not necessarily Parker-esque bop (though he yet might) - but he sure is a developing monster. I'm just glad to hear him evolving/ maturing.
Bone, in my opinion playing like Parker with all this other stuff in a song like this would be totally lame. Do it right and it can sound beautiful, especially in a ballad!
On the speed thing, I think lots of us have that issue. I don't like playing fast except for runs, but you know what, in certain styles (rock/blues) it sounds good (like Stevie Ray kinda stuff). It is very fantastic stuff. I love Charlie Parker and he just proved how good speed can sound, but Bop is very speed based, listen to Philly Joe Jones, no wait, Tony Williams! THAT is speed.
I think we should settle it at SPAH during the blow off.
I'll get the both on the stage with me. We'll see who can cut it.
That would be interesting, in a way I would be teaching in real time, my ways to two people who study them. That's some serious kung fu shit right there.
speaking of SPAH, and interesting music, I'll have to bring you to the homestead pickin parlour for the bluegrass jam. That's where I cut my teeth before I go into jazz and such.
Yeah, it would be interesting to see. But I guess all I'm saying is that Alex did some pretty incredible stuff here at my house that you can't find on his YouTube channel. And considering that he's only been playing for 2 years, it's pretty crazy. To me he has a good feel for music in general, which I suppose could be somewhat attributed to the fact that he plays guitar. I think playing other instruments besides harp helps one's harp skills also.
@Buddha Homestead picking parlor...wow...blast from the past. I used to go there once in a while...across from Pets on Penn. Little hole in the wall place. I used to hang more at a place across from Pete's Guitar in St. Paul and Torps Music by Frogtown on Rice Street as well....WAY back when.
Only wish I had the chops to play with speed if I chose to. If I did it would only be with the utmost taste and restraint of course ' )
In reality there are other skills besides speed I'm working on. -Speed and playing chromatically over changes will probably have to wait till my next incarnation. - but who knows.
- Guess I'll go check out this Alex kid - hadn't even heard of him
Buddha:What do these two kids have in common? Adam Gussow, Jason Ricci and me all flow through them...
This internet assisted community of connecting, sharing and teaching, together with real world encounters at SPAH etc., is accelerating the advancement of this little instrument like crazy.
These young talents (and the rest of us) are fortunate to have such access to people who are inspiring and teaching at the frontiers of what can be done with the harmonica.
Me thinks we are at the start of a golden age. -If we don't blow the basic survival on the planet thing that is.
Very inspiring stuff. I liked Rob's 2nd position more because of the depth in the tone I guess - he also managed to get little more feel in the song in my opinion. I liked the Gaunt's solo too, but at times it felt a bit lost. I guess it was easier for the second soloist to build upon the work done already...
Personally I didn't enjoy the clip with Rob and Jay at all. The tonality of the harmonica just didn't gel with the rest of the instrumentation to me.
I'm not a fan of this particular style of jazz at all. However I can appreciate both players ability and think that normally they both present themselves exceedingly well. In this clip though that wasn't in evidence to me. Rob did a marginally better job than Jay. Although in fairness to Jay, Rob has had much more experience.
I think that there are probably far better clips of both players out there.
i think buddha liked jays better because its how he'd have played it (3rd?)...i didnt watch the vid, and it sounded like something youd do chris... all in all i thought both were equally appropriate to the music. ---------- Kyzer's Travels Kyzer's Artwork
Very good stuff! I definitely look forward to what Jay can do in the future. Seems I'd only get there with 10 years of focused lessons or something, lol.
---------- ~Ryan
"I play the harmonica. The only way I can play is if I get my car going really fast, and stick it out the window." - Stephen Wright
Pennsylvania - H.A.R.P. (Harmonica Association 'Round Philly)
I have great admiration for Jay's musicianship here, but it's fingernails-on-a-chalkboard for me by almost all of his notes being at least 15-20 cents flat of A440 and the rest of the band, as checked with my Peterson tuner.
Last Edited by on Jul 25, 2010 5:14 PM
I hear it too... I think it's more of the jason ricci-isms he carries with his playing. Jason is a great player but precision and intonation is one area where he has a hole. And one of the reasons I always tell people to stop trying to copy harmonica players because most of us have terrible habits and musical issues that get transferred on.
Study flute, sax, violin, guitar or vocals and your musicality and intonation will come together faster. ---------- "All is bliss"
Ok, maybe it was that then why I somehow liked the Rob's solo better (or was that in tune either?). I haven't developed very precise ear for tone frequencies, although it seems to develop by itself in a process of learning to play music. On the other hand it's a blessing - but not for those of you that have that.. ;)
I like the approach of Indian music where there aren't any set frequencies for tones. The soloist defines it just before the set - and it can even change during the song too. Of course they have the advantage of not having chordal harmonies there which gives them more flexibility with the melodies..
Jay plays the melody (before improvising further) - Rob does not. Why do Song for my Father - if you don't play those sweet simple lines?
Funny how I've learned (?) to accept less than perfect OB notes.
Kinda crystalizes the criticisms and potential of these two approaches. i.e. 2nd = "tendency to use generic blues licks" - but is tonally 'right' OB's = too many notes that aren't really in tune - but melodically and chromatically more sophisticated - with much broader potential for all sorts of music
Hey guys, I appreciate the comments, both good and bad. I'd like to clear up a few things myself. First of all, as Joe pointed out, my e flat harmonica is very out of tune and I really don't have a good way of getting it fixed. Brad is always busy, and I have not yet been taught how to tune myself. Coincidentally, I also don't posses a functioning D harp and my current A is completely stock.
In regard to my playing specifically, I didn't really feel like I was doing that good of a job. I felt as if my playing was going in circles and my sound was just mediocre(having never played through an audix fireball... and idk, i felt kind of flat).But I greatly appreciate Adam posting this video and all of Chris's nice compliments, as always.
Jay- Comin to San Francisco anytime this year ? - I'd love to see you again- and still got a place to stay too if you want - noam (I shot and posted the 'ultimate harp jam' last year)
@JayGaunt Jay - We just watched the same performance that I recorded on our video camera from a different angle. The sound and lighting came in better at that angle. The overall tone is much different & better in our video. I agree. Don't be so hard on yourself. You and Rob both sounded great and really helped out the Garden State Harmonica Club that evening at Trumpets. I'll burn a DVD and send it to your mom.
I'm with Todd... Jay is just noodling aimlessly here, with an out of tune harp, and to his credit he admits it. Talent and potential for sure, but if we have to compare I'd say Jay is good, Alex Paclin is really something very special.
You say Alex is "not musical" Buddha!? Maybe it's someone else who is jealous... From what I hear, he's already up there with the top 2-3 diatonic players in the world. I'd feel some sympathy for any harp player who tries a cutting contest with Alex.
Jay it doesn't sound like your noodling. You mark your phrases well and can hear the direction of your lines.
About the melody being simple. The vocal version is much easier than the original instrumental version. The instrumental has a bunch of sixteenth note triplets that can be a little tricky to negotiate. ----------
"You say Alex is "not musical" Buddha!? Maybe it's someone else who is jealous... From what I hear, he's already up there with the top 2-3 diatonic players in the world. I'd feel some sympathy for any harp player who tries a cutting contest with Alex. "
@jj
please. Alex is good and still learning but nowhere near the top. Top 2-3? what planet are you from?
A TOP 2-3 player would actually play the song correctly and appropriately. Here he doesn't play anything musical, it's all "HEY LOOK AT ME" bullshit.
Listen to Margolin's solo... he did it right.
A top level player has a defined sound and style. When Alex plays, you can hear moments of Jason Ricci, Howard Levy, Me and other... WHERE IS ALEX? He's not there because he hasn't arrived yet. Do you get it? None of us are copying Alex but he copies us. As long as he sits in front of his computer and learns licks that other harmonica players play he'll never be as good as them.
I think Alex is a fine player, he's technique is outstanding but technique doesn't make one a top player.
Just to be sure on the musicality thing lets have another listen...
Nope, still "HEY LOOK AT ME" "I'm better than the band" and "I can play really fast licks that don't make sense in the context of the song." Still sounds a like a mix of me and Jason.
Let's listen to Bob...Yep. Real deal Bad Ass his short solo speaks volumes over the cerebral vomit that Alex was projecting.
Let's try again, maybe he was feeling pressure from being on stage with Bob Margolin
Nope, still doesn't play with feeling or any real musicality. Still tosses in a zillion licks and myriad of techniques into one song. Top players don't do that because they are playing for the song and the audience...NOT to show the audience how good they are.
Here's a vid of Jay playing with Bob
The phrasing is 100x better than anything Alex has put out. It sounds like blues, the tone is better and Jay is truly playing music with the band rather than vomiting on them.
You guys should be afraid of cutting heads with Jay, not Alex.... at least for the moment.
I don't want to come off as dissing on Alex, I think he's fine player but his head is more prominent than his heart and that shit is going to hurt him one day.
---------- "All is bliss"
Last Edited by on Jul 19, 2010 6:39 AM
jay, you sound great.. you gotta learn how to tune your harps, it takes like 1/1000th the work to learn to do basic tuning right as it did for you to work on the playing skills you have. Customizing like Chris or Joe, that would take many years to learn. buy a tuner, a nice little file, a feeler gauge and something to scrape with, and start with a crappy harp that is messed up anyway. any of the guys around here that play could show you how to do it.
