kudzurunner
1561 posts
Jun 11, 2010
4:37 AM
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With all the talk of custom harps, it surprised me to check the roster of official Hohner endorsers and discover how many well-known blues players (along with Howard Levy, Charlie McCoy, and a couple of others) show up there. Of course, at least one of these guys is a heavy-duty customizer, but still: It's a broadly representative group:
T C Carr
Wallace Coleman
Bob Corritore
Grant Dermody
Mark DuFresne
Jonathan Edwards
Joe Filisko
Buddy Greene
Mitch Kashmar
Pierre Lacocque
Howard Levy
Bill Lupkin
Delbert McClinton
Charlie McCoy
Randy Miller
RJ Mischo
Mike Nazarenko
John Nemeth
Jon Paris
John Popper
Annie Raines
Tad Robinson
Rockin' Jake
Bobby Rush
Johnny Sansone
Corky Siegel
Matthew Skoller
Rob Stone
Greg "Fingers" Taylor
Phil Wiggins
Kim Wilson
Last Edited by on Jun 11, 2010 4:38 AM
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Kingley
1243 posts
Jun 11, 2010
7:25 AM
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A lot of the guys on that list send their harps to customisers for them to work on I expect. Kim Wilson for example only plays Filisko Marine Bands and Howard Levy plays Filisko harps exclusively as well to the best of my knowledge. I also remember R.J. Mischo saying he has had Joe Spiers work on harps for him.
Also I would expect that Hohner at least checks the gapping (these days) on the endorsers harps to optimise them.
I wouldn't imagine that any of these players use true out of the box harps. If you think about it Adam even your Marine Bands are tweaked, because as you have mentioned in the past you gap them yourself. So that by definition makes them customised to a degree.
Last Edited by on Jun 11, 2010 7:27 AM
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waltertore
647 posts
Jun 11, 2010
7:39 AM
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when I was an hohner endorsee it was pretty loose. No one ever checked up on you. They don't give harps away. they give a slight discount off what you would get from a competitive online store. Walter
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walter tore's spontobeat - a real one man band and over 1 million spontaneously created songs and growing. I record about 300 full length cds a year.
" life is a daring adventure or nothing at all" - helen keller
2,000 of my songs
continuous streaming - 200 most current songs
my videos
Last Edited by on Jun 11, 2010 7:40 AM
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Buddha
2005 posts
Jun 11, 2010
7:40 AM
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most of those guys are Filisko customers.
speaking of quality, back in the late 80s I used to get sacks of harps from RJ Mischo, many of them were brand new but he didn't like the action so he would just toss them in the sack. Even today I must have well over a hundred harps in my parts bin from RJ. Too bad the overall quality on those harps are so poor because they would be nearly NOS.
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"Musicians are the architects of heaven"
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Todd Parrott
94 posts
Jun 11, 2010
7:59 AM
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Even though Hohner endorsers have their harps tweaked or customized, I would assume that they prefer Hohners for their tone. I don't necessarily judge a harp by how well or how poorly it plays out of the box - I focus on the tone more than anything, because any harp can be made to play better. And I believe most customizers will agree that Hohners customize better than any other brand and will make the best overblow harps.
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Nastyolddog
897 posts
Jun 11, 2010
8:08 AM
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TB OOTB NAZI says if you can't play it OOTB you shouldn't be playing Harp:(
man was put on earth to solve problems to adapte to certain situations why can't he learn to adapt to a simple instrument:)
Last Edited by on Jun 11, 2010 8:09 AM
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Todd Parrott
96 posts
Jun 11, 2010
8:40 AM
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I played mostly out-of-the-box harps for about 18 years, though I did have a few customs, so I agree you can play some great music on stock harps. The only thing that pushed me toward more custom harps was the need for overbends, which are sometimes not possible on out-of-the-box harps. And I use the overbends for expression more than anything else. However, I also agree that you can be a great harp player without playing custom harps, overblows or overbends, etc. Too many musicians, not just harp players, think you have to play like Van Halen or something to be a great player. I think it's more about how you feel your music and how you express it, than about how many fast notes you can cram into measure.
Last Edited by on Jun 11, 2010 8:41 AM
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Kingley
1244 posts
Jun 11, 2010
8:43 AM
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Todd- Yes I would agree with you. My personal feeling is that Hohners have the best tone.
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Ryan
293 posts
Jun 11, 2010
12:35 PM
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"man was put on earth to solve problems to adapte to certain situations...."
Exactly, in this case people adapt by learning to improve thier instrument. People started customising because their instruments weren't playing as well as they could, so they figured out way to improve the instrument.
"if you can't play it OOTB you shouldn't be playing Harp:( "
Nobody is saying you can't play harps just as they are out of the box, but the fact is that an out of the box harp is a sub-par instrument when compared to a custom harp(I'm not saying ootb harps are bad instruments, in fact many of them are excellent, but they don't compare to custom harps). Just like a like Piedmont or Johnson harp is a sub-par instrument when compared to an OOTB Special 20.
"... why can't he learn to adapt to a simple instrument:) "
So why don't you play one of those cheap harps (ie. Piedmont, Johnson, Hot Metal) instead of the Special 20? Those cheap harps are certianly playable, and you'll save quite a bit of money, so why don't you adapt to those harps? I'm guesing the reason is the same as those who use custom harps. The Special 20 is a better instrument than those cheap harps, it sounds better and it plays better, which allows you to play better, and makes playing much easier than if you were playing a cheap $5 harp. These are essentially the same reasons people buy custom harps.
Last Edited by on Jun 11, 2010 3:34 PM
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groyster1
111 posts
Jun 11, 2010
2:51 PM
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hello ryan
I bought a case of 12 johnsons on ebay for 40.00 they are great to practice with but they are certainly no match for special 20s which I feel are the best value with lee oskars a close second but it was great to get those 12 johnsons for 3 and change apiece
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Ryan
296 posts
Jun 11, 2010
3:48 PM
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groyster,
I think you may be missing the point I was making. But yes, I agree, while those cheap harps are playable, they're no match for a Special 20(which is exactly what I said in my post). Similarly, while the Special 20 is a good harp, and you can do a lot with it, it is no match for a custom harp.
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Gwood420
201 posts
Jun 11, 2010
4:38 PM
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what... no adam gussow???
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Marty we're no GOD
how i make a living
Facebook
MySpace
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7LimitJI
186 posts
Jun 11, 2010
4:48 PM
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If you don't overblow/bend You don't really need a custom harp as set-up is relatively easy.
If I played professionally, I would buy custom, purely because I'd rather play than work on my harps.
But as I gig maybe twice a month I do my own.
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Those Dangerous Gentlemens Myspace
Youtube
Due to cutbacks,the light at the end of the tunnel has been switched off.
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waltertore
651 posts
Jun 11, 2010
4:55 PM
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You need what you need and nothing more. The secret is to really figure out what you need and that usually takes a lifetime of trial and error :-) I play stock marine bands and stock delta frosts. I played well over 200 gigs a year for 20 years with stock marine bands. I never felt like I needed more and still feel that way. I can get all the sounds I dream of out of a stock marine band or delta frost. OB's don't do anything for me. When I started playing I could get my harps at Mannys in NYC for under $5. the prices today on stock MB and DF harps seem like custom harp prices! Walter
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walter tore's spontobeat - a real one man band and over 1 million spontaneously created songs and growing. I record about 300 full length cds a year.
" life is a daring adventure or nothing at all" - helen keller
2,000 of my songs
continuous streaming - 200 most current songs
my videos
Last Edited by on Jun 11, 2010 4:59 PM
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groyster1
112 posts
Jun 11, 2010
6:14 PM
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the harp is the car the player is the drivetrain
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Mojokane
41 posts
Jun 11, 2010
6:50 PM
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It's nice to hear there is a wide variety of players on the list of Hohner endorsee's. Funny, there is not more who are customizers. Though most, or all, use custom harps...what is that number?
My personal take on the customized harp vs OOTB,
---cheap reeds(metal quality), = junk tone...
..you can't shine shit.
It really doesn't matter, until you understand.
I'm a big fan since I got one(thanks MP)
...fortunately, I can afford the bump per harp. But it has also elevated my level of creativity, while practicing and playing. (and I have a lot of ideas to accomplish) Making it easier, for me, to grab ideas out of my head on the spot, and actually play them well.
Now, I use em all the time. They really are better. They allow you to achieve ideas more easily.
Sticky reeds, not enough air tightness, working harder, it's very technical stuff. And if you're not into it, it doesn't matter.
Last Edited by on Jun 11, 2010 6:56 PM
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Nastyolddog
903 posts
Jun 11, 2010
7:18 PM
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Yo Ryan when i started playing i walked into a muso shop they had the all new Hohner Special-20 i had a lot of other harps to choose from,
Hohner MB, Hohner MB or Hohner MB or the all new Hohner Special 20,thats all many shops in Australia stocked,
yes i know it was a very expensive top of the Line Harmonica cost me about 10 bucks back then:)
i just bought one of them wood comb air leaking MB Hohners every one works on for hours to get playing right, no air leaks whatever the pursuit is,
i was playing it perfectly within 5 mins i could get all my bends and my tone wasn't effected, maybe some what enhanced ,no need to do all that custom work i adapted to the instrument:)
oh and they are cheaper i can get MB's for $35 special 20's $45:)
I'm a Hard bargain man and can get a pretty good deal on my Harps from my Local Pawn Shop,that doubles as a music shop:)
Last Edited by on Jun 12, 2010 12:02 AM
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groyster1
113 posts
Jun 12, 2010
6:54 AM
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never played a custom probably never will just not a discriminating dude
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DeakHarp
53 posts
Jun 12, 2010
9:35 PM
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Once you play a custom yur life is never the same ....it was so easy to control ... and the octaves are true .....i couldent pay for any so my friend that made my first one ... showed me how to do it ... I been making them ever since ....Billy Branch loves the one i gave him .....
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Kingley
1249 posts
Jun 13, 2010
1:07 AM
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DeakHarp - Yeah I agree. I customise my own Marine Bands and love 'em.
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Nastyolddog
911 posts
Jun 13, 2010
3:42 AM
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Billy Branch loves the one i gave him!!
Great mate!!!
Brett w Clarke
24 Garth st Edgeworth 2285
NSW Australia
Special-20 Key of C
Make me a Believer:)
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HarveyHarp
43 posts
Jun 13, 2010
9:46 PM
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I agree with Deak. with one exception. Once you "successfully" play a custom harp it is hard to go back. I find that if you give a custom harp to a beginner, who bends all notes, thereby breaking a lot of reeds, then the first thing that happens is that he can not draw the last 4 reeds, because they are choking for overdraw, and just a squeaking sound comes out. I had this happen yesterday, and it took me over an hour to teach him how to make the notes sound. Also, I also find that good players that blow hard, which you sometimes have to do with OOTB harps, have to want to change their habits in order to live with Custom Harps, or they will choke.
BTW, I gave Deak Harp one of my harps and he loved it, I think!!
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LittleJoeSamson
308 posts
Jun 13, 2010
11:21 PM
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Hohner harps ? what a joke! the chinese stuff is pure junk.
Hohner sucks Major!
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Nastyolddog
916 posts
Jun 14, 2010
2:25 AM
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DeakHarp
Kingley
HarveyHarp
Please listen first Ok:)
lets talk?
if find no Problem Produceing exellent tone with out trying to Blow hard with OOTB SP-20s,
this Blowing hard to get OOTB harps to play is being
confused in my case with Breath force,
Breath Force is how i can control OOTB harps ajusting my Breath force to suit the Harp this is how i controlled the wood comb MB i recently bought,
not by Blowing hard or Harder, you will not produce tone Blowing Hard in fact you will lose tone,
Ive been told by my Harp teacher and many other Players i have great tone infact i have just been Jaming with my Bro:)
he mentioned to me that in my Harp club there are only 3 Players with exelent tone, man I'm glad i got a mention, fact he metioned me first:)
Ok i have thought about custom Harps SP-20's
ya not going to change old SP20 Nazi:)
i have thought about what i want from a SP20 or how i would like a simple custom set of SP20's to sit next to my Old clunkers,
nothing Special i currently run open Backs i custom myself,i would like to complement them with some solid combs not wood,apart from that some simple gapping,
so never haveing a custom harp what is the adavantage
of me haveing custom harps i don't overblow:)
what is trying to be achieved with a custom harp is it just ease of playing?
as mentioned above i find no problems playing OOTB harps:)
the only advantage i see is makeing the Harp easyer to play:)
Im sure there are no changes in Tone of the instrument
if there was i don't need or want a different sound,
my tone is in perfect control:)
I do my own natural embossing,,ie em gooberbossing
a don't clean my harps I'm old schoole i let them Bed in:)
So Bro's your reply is most welcome:)
Deak I'm seriouse if you can give them away,
have some fun you may just screw up my life
but in a good way :)
Brett w Clarke
24 Garth st Edgeworth 2285
NSW Australia
Special-20 Key of C
Make me a Believer:)
I pay Post:)
Last Edited by on Jun 14, 2010 6:49 AM
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Jfllr1
189 posts
Jun 14, 2010
3:44 AM
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PLayed my Buddha zen harp yesterday.
If you think you can achieve the same expression on an OOTB, you're wrong. It allows better expression, by allowing you to play more technically, giving you more options. The two go hand in hand.
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"Blow as thou pleaseth"
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Nastyolddog
934 posts
Jun 16, 2010
7:11 AM
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Should i have mentioned i would like i fucken civil reply, one with technical explanation about the machanics of the Harmonica:(
Maybe you could have convinced me to buy a Harp from the Old wind Bag or some custom combs:(
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hvyj
400 posts
Jun 16, 2010
6:36 PM
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@Nastyolddog: The attraction of custom harps is response and precision more than tone. Custom harps respond better and more consistently to technique. Bends are much more precise--accurately separating the three available bends in the 3 hole draw is so much easier on a custom harp in any key as is dropping the ten blow a whole step.
I don't OB, so i can't speak to that.
Last Edited by on Jun 16, 2010 6:38 PM
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DeakHarp
56 posts
Jun 17, 2010
2:40 AM
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Nasty dog Good tone Comes from alot of factors ...It dont come from a custom harp ....Tone is genetic ... everyone got a diffrent tone ....it is natural to think it comes from costom harps ... great rigs ...great mic's ... its not that way ... it comes from being human .. everyone has diffrent shapes in there mouth vocal cords larnex diaphram ....vibrado ...and about 1.000.000 hours playing .....and all of a sudden it hits you ...Great Tone ..... A custom harp is a harp that plays like butter ... and bends easy and is in perfect tune ...The reason why i gave Billy Branch a harp .. is because i was returning the favor .. When i was living in Chicago in my truck ... Homeless and got all my harmonicas robbed from me ....Billy gave me his harp that he had in his pocket ... A A harp it was .... He asked me where is yur harps deak ... and i told him they got stolen ... he gave me his ......Custom harps take 5/6 hours to build ... and fine tune ... i got orders for a month straight if i work on them every day 7 days a week ....not to mention how burned out you get from doing it for 12 hours straight ....That is why they cost $$$ to build ... not counting the 30/40 bucks it takes to get a new harp to work on .... And im gigging 4 days a week i make a comitment... to start every harp i make ... not cus i want to but i have orders to keep up on ....Im a Marine Band Man ... i dont work on Sp 20's .. they leak too much while tuning them ... If you want to play a custom harp .... i would love to make you one if you can pay 130 ... + Shipping .. i dont think that is too much .... Everyone thinks we make a killing making these harps .. it comes out to about 15 dollars a hour ... Ill pay you 15 dollars a hour to come here on my farm and Bush Hog my pasture and moe my front grass ..and Weed Wack . and when yur done ill make you a harp for free ....in exchange for the 6 hours it took you to do it ....Blues Lives
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DeakHarp
57 posts
Jun 17, 2010
3:01 AM
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News Flash ... I will be endorsed by hohner shortly i just got a phone call from Andy Garrigue.. And he been hearing alot about me ... He said i should have no problem getting endorsed ... As long as i play Hohner Harps exclusive ... I been doing that for 37 yrs..i dont see a change in that happening for another 37 + ..
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Joch230
188 posts
Jun 17, 2010
4:47 AM
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DeakHarp...that's a great story. Thanks for sharing it and congrats on the Hohner endorsement deal.
-John
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DeakHarp
59 posts
Jun 17, 2010
5:48 PM
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Ill be playing live on TV tomorow WCIA channel 3 Champaign IL The Morning Show ....And ill be talking about My new Endorsement with Hohner ...
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snakes
535 posts
Jun 18, 2010
4:05 PM
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Congrats Deak! You deserve the endorsement.
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MP
492 posts
Jun 18, 2010
4:47 PM
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i met this hohner guy who won a world champ contest and somehow managed to be an endorsee of lee oskars and hohners simultaneously.
hohner called him into their office and told him to knock it off.
he plays filiskos. last year he told me the best out of box is the lee oskar. i think he's nuts.
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waltertore
676 posts
Jun 18, 2010
6:24 PM
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"i met this hohner guy who won a world champ contest and somehow managed to be an endorsee of lee oskars and hohners simultaneously. hohner called him into their office and told him to knock it off"
Things have changed a ton from when I was a hohner endorsee. Then there was no other harp to play that could touch a marine band and no custom harps being made for sale to the public. Lee Oskar was just starting out with his harps. He gave me a few and I thought they were terrible compared to the marine band (tone wise). Everything was done via mail - your application and harp orders. You would write hohner and tell them of your happenings and they would include it in their Easy Reeding magazine that was mailed to your house. The slight discount they offered was no earth shattering deal but you would have them at your doorstep in any keys you wanted. Music stores, especially outside the major music cities rarely carried more than a few keys at best. When touring that could be a real hassle. Congragulations Deak! Walter
on a side note- I am probably one of few ever given free harps from hohner. Unfortunately they were a few hundred rainbow harps (only 4, widely spaced holes) and were part of a huge box they sent to pilot the rainbow harmonica program in austin city schools. they sent a ton of patches, hats, posters too.
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walter tore's spontobeat - a real one man band and over 1 million spontaneously created songs and growing. I record about 300 full length cds a year.
" life is a daring adventure or nothing at all" - helen keller
2,000 of my songs
continuous streaming - 200 most current songs
my videos
Last Edited by on Jun 18, 2010 6:30 PM
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MP
495 posts
Jun 18, 2010
8:19 PM
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actually, hohner does give free harps to endorsees if they win a world championship. these are chinese junk with the winners name on them. they look like special 20s in an american ace box and are all in the key of C.
they are to be given away...to children i suspect.
Last Edited by on Jun 18, 2010 8:20 PM
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waltertore
680 posts
Jun 19, 2010
4:29 AM
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MP: That is a new one from when I endorsed them. Walter
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walter tore's spontobeat - a real one man band and over 1 million spontaneously created songs and growing. I record about 300 full length cds a year.
" life is a daring adventure or nothing at all" - helen keller
2,000 of my songs
continuous streaming - 200 most current songs
my videos
|
