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Dirty-South Blues Harp forum: wail on! >
How Loud is Your Amp?
How Loud is Your Amp?
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htownfess
88 posts
May 14, 2010
4:02 AM
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Contrary to conventional wisdom, if the band is playing, four women fighting is no louder than two women fighting, regardless of fight intensity. In fact, if the band is playing, one woman fighting is every bit as loud as four women fighting, and a lot more Zen to boot.
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htownfess
89 posts
May 14, 2010
4:12 AM
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"I agree. The Salami post was pure genius."
I concur. But let us give credit to HarpNinja for pioneering the noun-swapping technique. Some self-styled iconoclasts claim that swapping in different nouns makes no difference in usable volume, yet the laughter seems louder and louder to me. Probably some quirk of acoustics that needs debunking.
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htownfess
90 posts
May 14, 2010
4:30 AM
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"I think we've established two facts here:"
Tricky Dick's Mythbusters is in logical fallacy reruns: The technical term for what others have noted is that this time it's begging the question again, i.e., stating a debatable premise as though it were a recognized truth.
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5F6H
136 posts
May 14, 2010
6:20 AM
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No, I'm not a lawyer....still 2 out of 3 ain't bad! :-)
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Ev630
435 posts
May 14, 2010
6:53 AM
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Let's dip into the archives over at WeberVST and roll tape on a replay. Some classic stuff here, answering Rick's question as to how the guys on the board managed to play without getting feedback. Rick asked:
"I'm intrigued here... All you gents here on the Weber Forum who have CM /CR mics seem to never have any feedback issues. How do you accomplish that?
What is different about your mics (or amps or technique or whatever) that allows you to defeat the feedback demon (to say nothing of the laws of physics). Surely you can share the secret."
Htownfess replied:
"Well, Rick, they're probably going to hunt me down and kill me for revealing this, but the time has come to reveal how the Jedi masters of CM/CR do it--they embrace the feedback magnetism of CM/CRs and use it to their advantage. This secret knowledge has been handed down from harp player to harp player by word of mouth only, until now.
And it's unbelieveably easy. Since CM/CR bullets are feedback magnets like you say, before the gig they set a CM or CR bullet out for a while on top of the amp. Don't plug it in! Then, as late as possible before the show starts, they take an absorbent chamois, wipe off all the feedback the mic exterior has attracted, and quickly seal the cloth inside a ziploc baggie or other airtight container. Presto! No feedback all night! Of course, devious sorts that they are, if a lesser player sits in on harp, those guys will surreptitiously crack the baggie open and let some of the feedback out to make the lesser harp player look bad.
Of course, there may be some residual feedback left in the room after the chamois ritual, but experienced players know how to grip the mic shell and play without dislodging any of it, whereas newbies tend to knock it all loose and it goes right in the grille. Of course, that's why the mic is not plugged in during the chamois ritual--to stop feedback from leaking into the amp before it can be collected.
You've got to watch out for those experienced players: really nasty ones carry some old bags or jars of feedback around with them all the time so they can make lesser players look even worse. The additional aged feedback can really stink up a joint.
Excuse me, gotta run see my handler from the witness protection program--
Later adding:
Oh, and another trick they use if they forget their chamois cloth is to set another CM/CR mic approximately the same distance behind the amp as the player is standing in front of the amp. That way the feedback gets confused between the two poles of magnetic attraction and stays trapped inside the amp. The drawback is that you have to leave a CM/CR bullet in the green room or walk-in cooler or alley to do it, whatever's behind the stage, so most players would rather use the chamois method.
Then I added:
"Rick, please ignore everything Stephen wrote. I just want you to look into the bright light at the end of this pen-like object, there's a good fellow. Won't hurt a bit.
Actually, the real secret is that the feedback comes from within. You have to find a way to let the feedback out of your chakras before you step on stage, otherwise the inner harmony is thrown out of whack and you experience a "bad kharmic reso-wave" - or what is known to laymen as "feedback". Now, you know how boxers should never have sex before a title bout? See, it's the opposite with harp. Indeed I find that frollicking with at least two women before a gig works a treat. Blondes are excellent and if you can score twins, it actually adds bass to your tone. Try it! You may not master the feedback kata, but I can guarantee you'll be satisfied with the medication!"
Don D noted:
EV, I like the way you think! I've always said that sex with 19 year old women will cure about anything that ails you!!! Never tried it to solve the feedback issue, but definitely worth trying. It seemed to work for Muddy, he wrote a song about it..."
To which I added:
"Don the important thing is: never the same women twice. You'll thank me."
Happy times, happy times.
Anyway I understand Rick has purchased a chamois and is also actively looking to meet wimmins.
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JDH
67 posts
May 14, 2010
7:58 AM
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I have to admit, Rick has a way of bringing out the worst in me. I tell myself that here is a fellow I need to ignore, and then wham, I find myself mildly outraged by something he says. Hats off to you Rick, you are the most annoying person I've encountered on the internet. But I'm still relatively new here and unwilling to say you are the greatest at anything.
How loud is my amp? It's probably louder than yours, but who cares?
EV630, my friend, you commented that I know a thing or two about amps. You are dead on, I know two things.
thing 1. When I first started playing guitar there was always a pile of tweed amps in my favorite pawn shop, usually a couple of twins, a bassman, and maybe a pro, super, deluxe ...etc. The prices ranged from $60 to $200. There weren't many of us youngsters interested, we thought they were ugly and they usually stunk of stale beer and cigarette smoke. I did know guys that low on cash bought them, died them with black shoe dye, and played through them, until they could scrape together $430 to buy Super Reverbs, or whatever.
thing 2. I would have been smart to buy them all.
Anything I think I know is only an opinion, based on 44 years of playing, buying and sometimes selling gear. I've never hesitated to buy a piece of gear if I thought I might learn something from it, or if my curiosity was peaked. My technical knowledge is limited, I am not interested in being an amp tech, or a bluesharpamp "guru"
One thing that I beleive is that modding amps is overdone. More times than not, most good amps sound best if they are just functioning properly and running good tubes with good speakers. If you need more distortion, more bass, and a modified frequency range, cool, life's all about freedom to me too. JD
Last Edited by on May 14, 2010 1:13 PM
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6SN7
56 posts
May 14, 2010
8:39 AM
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"modding amps is overdone. most good amps sound bes if they are functioning perfectly
true, true , true
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JDH
68 posts
May 14, 2010
10:39 AM
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@ 6SN7 you've misquoted me a bit, what I said was I believe most good amps sound best if they are 'JUST' <-(the key word being, 'just') functioning properly. Implying that without mods, they sound their best. All amps, even the worst ones, sound best if they are functioning perfectly I suppose.
I sense this is not the popular opinion amongst today's harp players, but I think at least a few of us would agree on that. To my ears, so much crunch, distortion, and excessive bass often mask what the player is really doing. Sometimes that may be a blessing, but not with a good player. At the same time an amp that's sterile and stiff is no fun, it's a delicate balance and a matter of personal taste for sure.
I won't mention names or say what amp, but I was listening to someone that posts here regularly last night. (vids on his blog) He was playing through a very popular harp specific amp.I really like the way this guy plays, he's a very focused economical player with big tone, great taste, and some Big Walter influence. I just kept thinking as I listened that I would like to hear him playing through a little cleaner amp, a more open sound, but that's just me, and obviously I'm in a minority, and that's OK, I'm used to that. JD
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6SN7
57 posts
May 14, 2010
11:20 AM
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Hey JDH, I agree with you. The whole mod thing is a bit overblown.
many years ago I owned a 59 bassman. All original except it had contact paper as the tweed cover, it looked like something from grandma's pantry shelves. After many years, I got it retweeded. The guy that did the work told me he would clean the amp up. I was an idoit and said okay. His work was fantastic and turned the amp into the greatest guitar amp and it lost whatever mojo it had had for years when I used it. The upside was I swapped it for a Sonny Jr, a 58 tweed deluxe and cash. I never regret getting rid of it. It became too much of a liability when playing out as I was afraid it would get kicked, ruin, stolen. I want a gig amp, not a parlor table keepsake. I bet it is in some private collection in japan or on display at a hard Rock Cafe, either way, it's gathering dust and unhappy. too bad.
Last Edited by on May 14, 2010 11:22 AM
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JDH
69 posts
May 14, 2010
12:36 PM
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@ 6SN7
I was guessing we were in agreement, just wanted to head off any misunderstandings.
I can relate to the liability thing, I have a few guitars that over the years have become too valuable to pack around, but I'm so emotionally attached I can't seem to part with them either, so I still worry about fire and theft. Although the last time I had a guitar stolen, the thief picked up the least valuable guitar of the three sitting there, just ignorant luck, took the shiny new one.
Skip Simmon's told me once that he believes the "Bassman as a harp amp" thing may have started with old amps that had drifted way out of spec. He said in the past he's had some very disapointing experiences with the same thing you mentioned. Once he brought them up to spec they weren't the amp the guy brought in. Now it's his policy to not change anything that doesn't absolutely need replacing. Gotta love that contact paper! JD
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Tuckster
538 posts
May 14, 2010
1:26 PM
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As my harp playing evolves,so does taste for what makes a good sounding harp amp. As a beginner,I'm sure I would have loved that sound Hakan was getting on that one post.To me,some of the "harp amps" sound like they have a thick wool blanket thrown over them.At one time I thought that was good,now I dislike it. I want some clarity-I work hard to get all those little nuances,I don't want the amp to gloss them over.
Last Edited by on May 14, 2010 1:34 PM
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