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Dirty-South Blues Harp forum: wail on! >
Moondance
Moondance
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lumpy wafflesquirt
185 posts
Mar 29, 2010
12:27 PM
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I was asked to play on Moondance at an Open mic last night.
The guitarist was in Gm.
Bearing in mind I don't have any minor key harps, what major key diatonic should I have used and what position would that be?
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"Come on Brackett let's get changed"
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barbequebob
650 posts
Mar 29, 2010
12:36 PM
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This tune falls perfectly into 3rd position, tho you will need to get some bends together and I'd use an F played in 3rd position, preferably a Low F.
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Sincerely,
Barbeque Bob Maglinte
Boston, MA
http://www.barbequebob.com
CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
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hvyj
244 posts
Mar 29, 2010
2:26 PM
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I usually play this tune in A minor using an F harp which is Fifth Position. To play G minor in Fifth position one would use an Eb harp. This tune lays out really well in Fifth Position
IMHO, Fifth Position works better than Third Position for "Moondance" and is easier to play because this tune is a natural minor, not a dorian minor. There is a flat sixth in the changes. In Fifth Position, you get flat thirds, flat sixths and flat sevenths without having to bend.
To play Fifth Position, use blow 2 for root, avoid draw 5 and draw 9 and don't bend anything but draw 3. Follow this oversimplified formula and it's actually hard to hit a really bad note.
Last Edited by on Mar 29, 2010 2:39 PM
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harmonicanick
702 posts
Mar 29, 2010
2:44 PM
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I use a minor tuned Am
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bluemoose
151 posts
Mar 29, 2010
4:40 PM
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Hvyi:
Wow! It works. Very cool. Never could really grok 5th before but that hits it. Thanks.
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hvyj
245 posts
Mar 29, 2010
6:43 PM
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If anyone is interested, here's why it works: Bb is the relative major of G minor--same notes in each scale, just start on a different note for root. SO, what harp would you ordinarily use to play in Bb? You'd use an Eb harp in Second Position.
Now, to play an Eb harp in Fifth Position for G minor, you just start on a different note for root and everything fits. In fact, the breath pattern for the minor pentatonic scale in Fifth Position is identical to the breath pattern for the major pentatonic scale in Second Position. So, if you can play in Second Position, you should have no trouble playing Fifth Position--you just have to be careful about bending notes because that can take you out of minor tonality.
Last Edited by on Mar 29, 2010 6:58 PM
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lumpy wafflesquirt
186 posts
Mar 30, 2010
1:24 PM
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I went on that theory and used an Eb. it seemed to work, but I think I needed to play it a few more times to work out exactly what to play.
Today I tried something else in Gm and tried an F and an Eb but settled on the Bb for that -- I forget the tune now :^(
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"Come on Brackett let's get changed"
Last Edited by on Mar 30, 2010 1:25 PM
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hvyj
248 posts
Mar 30, 2010
1:49 PM
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Playing Gm on an Bb harp puts you in Fourth Position, which is very easy to play. There are no avoid notes, BUT to get G (root) in the lower octave, you must bend 3 draw a whole step. No other bends are necessary, but if you want to, you can bend blow 8 for the flat fifth. Draw 2 is the flat seventh so you can drop that a whole step for the flat sixth if you feel like it, but using any other bends will take you out of natural minor tonality.
The advantage of Fourth over Fifth is you have the major second available in Fourth, whereas the draw 5 and draw 9 in Fifth give you a flat second. It's easier to play with blues phrasing in Fifth, though, and you don't usually need the second when playing blues, so Fifth is pretty cool for playing minor blues.
Playing jazz, and certain other styles, you are more likely to need to play the second, so Fourth may be a better choice for certain material. It depends on the material, what you like and what you get used to. But I don't find Third Position to be particularly useful for playing minor UNLESS it's a dorian minor.
Like anything else, it does take a little practice to figure out exactly what notes to play and to break away from habits formed by playing in other positions that you may be more familiar with. Keep in mind that in Fifth Position, blow 9 is your minor third, blow 8 is upper octave root, and draw 8 is flat 7. So don't be afraid to work the upper octave for variety. No bends required.
I play in minor keys pretty regularly. I will use Fourth or Fifth Position for natural minors,and Third Position for dorian minors. But, I don't use or even own any minor key harps.
Last Edited by on Mar 30, 2010 2:13 PM
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nacoran
1517 posts
Mar 30, 2010
3:26 PM
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I keep the Wikipedia entry for the circle of fifths bookmarked. I have it about half memorized and can work out the rest in my head by picturing a piano. Just go counter clockwise to find your cross harp key. If someone is playing in minor, just find the minor (lower cased) key and the corresponding major key and move one step counterclockwise to find the cross harp key.
If I was a harp manufacturer I'd stamp the circle on anything and everything. It looks decorative and musical even. You can even use it to tell the guitar player what flats or sharps he needs to play in keys besides E.
Circle of Fifths
:)
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Nate
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