|
Dirty-South Blues Harp forum: wail on! >
new Satan and Adam album
new Satan and Adam album
Page:
1
kudzurunner
1264 posts
Mar 19, 2010
5:27 AM
|
I'm in Tampa right now to record a new Satan and Adam album. We actually managed to record the whole thing in less than five hours yesterday afternoon. Our drummer, Dave, is ill. He played the gig on Tuesday and sounded fine (you can access a podcast of the gig, I believe, at www.fatradio.com). But after setting up on Wednesday evening, he began vomiting blood, which is never a good omen. (Or maybe it's a scene out of THE OMEN.) He ended up being taken to the emergency room in the middle of Wednesday night and he's currently in the ICU.
The studio engineer found us a drummer and things worked out. I recorded a solo (harp/footdrums/vocals) version of an original tune of mine, and we did a range of other material. We're going to include a killer original cut, "Listen to the Music," from the very first HARLEM BLUES session--one we could have used but never did. It's the old over-the-top S&A sound.
Also, if we can get WXPN's permission, an on-air version of "Lotto 54," another original of Sterling's.
We're doing a remake of one of my tunes and calling it "Thunky Fing Rides Again."
And a bunch of other blues songs, including "Fever," "Take You Downtown" (I get to sing), "Big Boss Man," "Ain't Nobody Gonna Do My Baby Wrong."
About 10 songs, all told.
I'm using my Premier Twin-8 and my Kay. We put both of them in an isolation room and tried various miking arrangements. We ended up aiming the amps in the same direction, putting them a couple of feet apart, and miking them from a foot away.
It turned out that they were almost 180 degrees out of phase. The engineer has incredible ears. He A/B'd the amps for me, showing me what happened when he reversed the phase relationship. The bottom end mostly evaporated when he leaves them out of phase; when he reversed the phase of one amp, the sound thickened right up.
So I'll need to rewire the speaker on the smaller amp to reverse the phase.
Out of phase, when you're talking about paired harp amps, means that when one speaker cone is moving forward, the other is moving back. It's very important to make sure that all the speakers are moving in the same direction when you play a given note. Otherwise certain frequencies--and specifically the low frequencies--cancel out. I'd forgotten about this element of the two-amp thing, but it's something I worried about a lot in the old days. And the A/B comparison was shocking.
I hadn't noticed any problem when playing live; all of the clips I just uploaded to YT from my live gig in Oxford were made using this pair of amps. I don't think you can hear any adverse frequency problem. In fact, sitting onstage, the sound was very full at all frequencies. But in the studio, the problem was unmistakeable, as was the fullness that accrued when the phase of one amp signal was reversed by the engineer.
You guys will like the harp sound we came up with. On my solo piece, I'm playing an F harp and even that high harp, hanging out in space, sounds full and rich.
Last Edited by on Mar 19, 2010 5:29 AM
|
toddlgreene
1067 posts
Mar 19, 2010
5:35 AM
|
I can't wait to hear it-any chance of some board dumps or early mix samples to further whet our appetites?
I'm glad you guys got to make another album together. That's special.
Best wishes to your drummer Dave-hope he has a speedy recovery.
----------
Todd L Greene. V.P.
Last Edited by on Mar 19, 2010 5:36 AM
|
Ant138
374 posts
Mar 19, 2010
5:57 AM
|
I can't wait!!!
----------
|
HarpNinja
290 posts
Mar 19, 2010
6:24 AM
|
Awesome!!!! Can't wait!
Regarding phase...that can vary from room to room. So rewiring your amp won't always work to the best of my knowledge. There are some techy types (even on the board here) who can probably help more, but there are switches, etc. that will help with this.
If I were running stereo, I would be using a Radial Tonebone Twin City instead of just a Y adaptor. This pedal would eliminate any grounding issues and eliminate any phase issues.
Why did you choose to now use the HG2?
----------
Mike Fugazzi
vocals/harmonica
MySpace
YouTube
Twitter
Facebook
Album Ordering
|
arzajac
115 posts
Mar 19, 2010
6:31 AM
|
That's awesome news!
When will we be able to buy the album?
|
jaymcc28
252 posts
Mar 19, 2010
6:31 AM
|
Adam mentions "Fatradio.com" for a podcast, but that url doesn't exist. Anybody know where that podcast might be had?
----------
"Take out your false teeth, momma, I want to suck on your gums."-P. Wolf
|
kudzurunner
1267 posts
Mar 19, 2010
7:14 AM
|
Mike: The HG2 has a more aggressive sound. I'd definitely use it in a band context, paired with one of the other two amps. But in the studio, it would have been louder than I needed. When I played solo in Oxford last week (see my recent vids), I used the Premier/Kay combo and the sound was absolutely my ideal sound. So I stuck with those two amps. With Satan and Adam, I'm playing a lot while Sterling is singing, so I need a slightly less edgy tone than the HG2 provides.
I think that most harp players cycle through amps. They find something they really love; they stick with it for a while, swear by it. Then for some reason they try something else and it clicks and they go with that for the next little while. I love the HG2 and would tell any player to buy one as a first amp, if they can afford it. But each amp has a different character, and each application requires a slightly (or moderately) different setup.
And of course HOW you mic a harp amp in the studio makes a huge difference. We started off by miking both amps real close. That sound was OK, but it wasn't
great--where in a live application, it was great. But when you're playing live, the audience is getting a full-spectrum sound from the amp--live sound, not just sound through the mic. Those two sounds blend.
In the studio, on the other hand, if you close mic two amps in a fairly small room, you're ONLY getting a tight, up-close sound. That didn't quite work. So we pulled the studio mics about 10 inches back from the amps, and put them slightly off axis. That sacrificed some proximity effect--we lost some bottom end response--but it gave a fuller sound.
Ideally, if the amps were in phase, we would have combined close miking with a room mic for the harp amps. But because the amps were out of phase, would couldn't do that.
There's a science and an art to all this. I'm always learning something new. Most of all I've learned to keep trying different things, and to trust my ears. The sound we came up with is killer.
When I listened to some playback after we'd properly miked the two amps, the sound was slightly too raw for me. So the engineer A/B'd the amp sounds for me. The Kay was the raw one--it was overdriving more--and the Premier, which wasn't totally cranked out, was smoother. I had him tweak the Premier volume up slightly and the Kay volume down (on the board, I mean; I didn't touch the amps themselves) and voila: perfect tone. That's the advantage of using two amps.
When I play outdoors at a couple of festivals this summer, I'll probably use the HG2 and the Premier, because you need to move more air outdoors, and the rough edges of the HG2 will get rubbed off in the open air. In fact, that aggressiveness will translate into more punch, more vividness.
Last Edited by on Mar 19, 2010 7:16 AM
|
HarpNinja
291 posts
Mar 19, 2010
7:28 AM
|
Thanks for all the great details! We released an album last month and I had a lot of similar experiences. On half the tracks I used a Vibro Champ and then a Double Trouble on the other half.
The DT ended up with a close mic on one speaker, and then one about 10" off the other. One was bright with cut, the other smoother, etc...very close to what you're saying.
With the Champ, the tone was too dark and round. I ended up re-recording most the solos with different amp settings (have to eq to the recorded sound and not the room). On a few songs, I liked what I played so much that we were able to tweak the tone a bit at the board. Personally, I can tell the difference, but it sounds solid.
For me, it was tweaking the room sound that was the most challenging. Quite the learning experience in deed!
----------
Mike Fugazzi
vocals/harmonica
MySpace
YouTube
Twitter
Facebook
Album Ordering
|
HarpNinja
292 posts
Mar 19, 2010
7:29 AM
|
Thanks for all the great details! We released an album last month and I had a lot of similar experiences. On half the tracks I used a Vibro Champ and then a Double Trouble on the other half.
The DT ended up with a close mic on one speaker, and then one about 10" off the other. One was bright with cut, the other smoother, etc...very close to what you're saying.
With the Champ, the tone was too dark and round. I ended up re-recording most the solos with different amp settings (have to eq to the recorded sound and not the room). On a few songs, I liked what I played so much that we were able to tweak the tone a bit at the board. Personally, I can tell the difference, but it sounds solid.
For me, it was tweaking the room sound that was the most challenging. Quite the learning experience in deed!
----------
Mike Fugazzi
vocals/harmonica
MySpace
YouTube
Twitter
Facebook
Album Ordering
|
XHarp
295 posts
Mar 19, 2010
7:38 AM
|
Try this link
http://wfatradio.com/
Came from Sterling "Satan" McGee's My Space web page.
----------
"Keep it in your mouth" - XHarp
|
XHarp
296 posts
Mar 19, 2010
7:42 AM
|
Actually, go to this address
http://www.myspace.com/twofatboys
and you'll catch a glimse of our fearless leader with Satan.
Gotta say Adam, Hope you don't still have those shorts?
----------
"Keep it in your mouth" - XHarp
|
DevonTom
77 posts
Mar 19, 2010
8:51 AM
|
Looking forward to it. Did you video any of the proceedings?
|
Chickenthief
28 posts
Mar 19, 2010
9:36 AM
|
Hope Dave is doing much better now. Congratulations to you and Sterling Magee, looking forward to hearing your new recording. What is the name
of the studio where you recorded please?
|
kudzurunner
1268 posts
Mar 19, 2010
10:39 AM
|
We didn't get any video, ourselves, but the documentary producer sent a guy who got it all. When the doc finally comes out, you'll see it.
I was unable to find any trace of our actual performance on the wfatboy.com website, although they did have a big ad for the gig.
|
jonsparrow
2594 posts
Mar 19, 2010
11:13 AM
|
awesome posts adam. so now that you did the album does that mean the documentary is finally ready to be put together?
----------
|
pharpo
218 posts
Mar 19, 2010
12:40 PM
|
Good news.....hope Dave is on the mend....you know I have an mp3 player that just has Blues on it.....I think I can fit one more album on it...LOL
----------
Music is your own experience, your own thoughts, your wisdom. If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn. They teach you there's a boundary line to music. But, man, there's no boundary line to art. - Charlie Parker
|
nacoran
1457 posts
Mar 19, 2010
3:14 PM
|
Sorry about your drummer. Hope he feels better. Can't wait for the album!
----------
Nate
Facebook
|
Post a Message
|
