I don't get much of a chance to play with others; so lately, I've been enjoying putting together a set list of songs using a looper to come up with the backing. I've got a couple different loopers: a digitech jamman solo and a zoom g1xon.
I'm considering getting a different looper. I'd like to have two separate synchronizing channels so I would be able to lay down a short 1 or 2 bar drum beat (likely beat boxing) and then while that plays come over with a longer 4 bar, 8 bar or 12 bar backing. Then have the ability to choose which channel you overdub and undo from.
I know the boomerang will do all this and much more, but they are more then I'm looking to spend. I've tried using the two separate loopers to do this and sometimes it works and other times they get out of sync with each other.
I've been eyeing the vox lil looper and was wondering if the two channels can have different lengths; such as a 2 bar loop and a 12 bar loop.
Just curious what some harp players use or think. Thanks.
Thanks Michelle. That is good to know. I think for the jamsync to work though it has to be a JamMan Solo XT while I have the version before that, but I will look into this for sure to verify. If it would work then getting the digitech express would for sure be the easiest and cheapest way to get what I'm after. Thanks for the great info!
Mike; that is a good point. I have several android devices, but no apple products. Loopy does exactly what I am wanting to do and would work pretty well for it, but unfortunately it isn't available on android at this time. Apparently due to some latency issues. I keep waiting though.
There are some looping apps available on the android platform, but the ones I've found always seem to have something I don't care for. Usually it is that the tempo has to be set before the loop is started or something else that doesn't work well for a live setting.
If I had an ipad then that would be the absolute easiest way to go, but without one and with that being the only purpose for getting an ipad; then a dedicated loop pedal might be more practical in my situation.
I do appreciate the information and advice.
I know you used to do a lot of gigs with the boomerang looper. Do you still use that in live performances? By the way I've enjoyed your looping youtube videos (and many others).
I have used loopers a lot (ask Richard Hunter, he sat in with me in San Diego a couple of years back) but seldom loop the harmonica, as I also play guitar and that is a superior rhythm section (plus I play it a lot better than harp). I recommend the 'Rang, sure it's a lot of money, but a lot of looper for $500--up to four stereo loops, with control of the regeneration (feedback), no drift, small footprint, and lots of flexibility, it even has an optional expander (the Sidecar) for more control. I use it, and sometimes also bring a Jam Man with guitar tracks loaded on it--the 'Rang will not store loops, it's designed for live looping. I also have LoopyHD, I picked it up after HarpNinja recommended it. Recently I have been experimenting with AudioBus by using my iPhone as a controller and the iPad as the looper with an app called AudioBus Remote. See attached video.
I have the vox lil looper and it does do what you want. BUT with these caveats: 1) The second loop has to be an even multiple of the first. So if you do two bars on loop one, you could have 2,4,6,8,etc. bars on loop 2, but not 1,3,5,7, etc. That's OK, but you have to keep the total combined loop time of both loop 1 and loop 2 within the maximum loop memory (45 seconds, I think? EDIT: No, it's 90 seconds total. See below). 2) You need the external pedal to make using the looper that way really feasible in a live situation. The good news is that it's really easy to make one yourself if you've ever done some soldering. When I get back home ill post a picture of how I've set up a custom set of external switches to make using the pedal live easier. I think it's a great pedal for the money, and certainly the most versatile looper in the low ball price range. Sound fidelity is not super, however. The looper on my Zoom G3 sounds much better, but is less flexible for live playing with a couple of loops. If you are really serious, save up for a boomerang or a big boss floor unit. If you are like me, playing at home, out in the street and the occasional open mic, then the lil looper with extension pedal will do just fine... ----------
Thanks for the info Gnarly. The boomerang looks awesome, but I really just play at my house or out in the street; so I just can't justify spending that much on what would essentially just be a toy for me.
Isaac- Thanks for the info regarding the vox lil looper. I am glad to here that both channels don't have to be the same length, but rather can be a multiple of the other loop. With the addition of the foot switch extension can you stop each loop with a single tap? I have a terrible time with the double tap stop function on the jamman solo and never got around to making/buying the foot switch extension for that pedal. Also I read somewhere that the minimum loop length for each channel is 10 seconds. I assume this means that a minimum of 10 sec is allocated to each channel. Can you record loops that are less than 10 seconds?
You are quite welcome. So, no pics yet (later today maybe), but some answers to your follow up questions.
Total loop time is 90 secs, split between both channels. However, the longest length loop you can record on any one channel is actually only 80 seconds, since it will always "reserve" at least 10 seconds for the other loop channel. Make sense? Consequently, the shortest loop time is whatever is possible with the quickness of your foot tap, but keep in mind that the two loops are "quantized" together, meaning that the second loop has to be a multiple of the first. So, if you do a really short first loop, the length of second loop will be automatically adjusted to the nearest even interval of that time from the point when you actually clicked the button to stop recording it.
With the external pedal, you can start and stop each loop, independently, with one tap each. The external pedal adds one stomp button per loop. The original buttons can be used to initiate/end recording, add overdubs, and to initiate playing of a stopped loop. External buttons stop a loop, or double click to erase. I've set them up to make all that more intuitive than with the stock external pedal. The pics I'll post later will make that clearer... ----------
Thanks Isaac. That is super helpful info. I appreciate you taking the time to respond. I'd love to see pictures of your external pedal, but don't want to be a bother.
Harp_Study. Sorry for the delay, crazy busy around here. Here's the promised picture:
Basically, what this is are two independent "SPST" stomp switches, in two independent black plastic boxes. Each switch is wired to a mono 1/4" jack. It's the simplest wiring job that exists: one lug on the switch to one lug on the jack, the other lug on the switch to the other lug on the jack. Order doesn't matter, so you can't screw up! :) Then, there's an ordinary 1/4" stereo to dual mono splitter cable. The plug that goes into the lil looper's extension socket is the stereo end, and then each side of the stereo goes to it's own mono plug. These are plugged into each of the two extension swtich boxes. Once I tested to see which button goes with each loop, then I fixed the two extension boxes to the appropriate side of the lil looper using 3m picture-hanging strips (sticks well, but can be removed easily with no residue). I got all the parts off of Amazon for less than it costs to buy the stock extension pedal, that you can't configure this way.
How it works: Basically, each extension pedal is attached on the side of the lil looper that cooresponds to the loop it helps control. As I said above, the extension switches are used to stop and erase each channel. The original switches start recording, enter into playback from recording or stopped modes, or enable/stop overdub. Once all the buttons are lined up this way, it's super easy to do the foot tapping dance. Hope it helps! ----------
One last thing. The lil looper has some issues (as I said above), but it has one huge advantage: It's the only looper in the lower price bracket that has two independent loops that can be set up in the four-button style AND that runs on batteries. That's HUGE from a busking point-of-view, and it's the main reason I bought it. If I was doing studio work, I'd buy/use a looper with better fidelity. But for live work, especially street work, this little thing is great. If you are just playing in the bedroom now, you won't be disappointed, and this looper will grow with you for a while if you ever decide to take it to the people! ----------
Isaac - Thanks for the pics and the great information. I like that set up since the start and stop for each channel are next to each other. Those instructions make it sound pretty easy. I think I'm gonna sell my jamman solo and get the vox set up like this. I like the idea of 2 channels and battery powered.
Brandon Bailey is selling his Boss RC-300--it's listed on the forum on the for sale 2015 thread. Maybe that is something you would consider--it is also battery operated.
Last Edited by Gnarly on Nov 05, 2015 8:59 PM
The Boss RC 300 is a great piece of kit, and well worth the money, especially at $300. Note that, however, even at the great price Brandon is listing his for, it would still be twice the price of the Lil Looper plus extension pedal. Granted, you'd get drastic increases in functionality and sound fidelity. So you should weigh your options carefully, and decide how much you want to shell out based on what you really will use it for. ----------
Gnarly: Thanks for pointing that out. That is a great price for that unit for sure. Plus Brandon Bailey owned it! I'll have to give that some serious thought. Although I'm not sure the RC 300 will run on batteries. Plus like Isaac said it is still twice the price of the vox. If I did some real gigs it would be no brainer and the RC 300 would be the way to go, but playing in my basement most of the time I might be better with the vox. I'm going to have to really think about it though.
Last Edited by Harp Study on Nov 06, 2015 9:51 AM
