yogi
79 posts
Sep 13, 2015
5:34 AM
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There seems to be a general consensus that even when you buy professional level harmonicas we have to accept that a good percentage will not play well and need tweaking.
Are there any other musicians who would accept this from their instrument?
I accept the costings are different between pianos guitars saxaphones etc and a harmonica but there is a big difference in price between entry level harmonicas and say crossovers and manjis.
Why can harmonica companies not set up harmonicas in a way that represents the cost in the same way other instrument makers do?
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Kingley
3925 posts
Sep 13, 2015
5:49 AM
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It would seem that you and many others on here have a distorted view of this subject. All musicians regardless of their instrument tweak their instruments to make them play the way they want them to play. Ever single drummer, pianist, saxophone, trumpet, guitar, flute, mandolin, citern player I've ever met tweaks their instruments. Regardless of the cost of that instrument. The only exception to that rule is when they buy custom made instruments. Most instruments are playable straight of the production line. In fact playing stock instruments can be hugely beneficial to any player of any instrument in the early stages of playing music. People only 'tweak' their instruments to increase the ease of playability. Again that is across the board and not simply down to the harmonica.
So given this fact, why would you think a harmonica would or should be any different?
Last Edited by Kingley on Sep 13, 2015 5:50 AM
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Goldbrick
1106 posts
Sep 13, 2015
6:59 AM
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I strongly agree with Yogi
Harps are a crap shoot-- I am a drum and guitar tech= and yes you adjust those instruments- but you can PLAY them first to see if they suit you
I can also easily measure drum head tension with a dial or string height with a ruler.
Harps are trial and error . And you cant return them
I love getting a new guitar or drum. I only buy a new harp when I must "cause there is no telling what you will get
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Gary 62
29 posts
Sep 13, 2015
7:04 AM
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I agree too with yogi. Getting an instrument and it being out of tune SOTB is pretty bad form IMO. Thing is with a guitar it's a lot easier to tune. With a harp you have to take it apart and file and it's a real headache. Most beginners probably wouldn't pick up the harp if the thought they had to do all that kind of stuff straight away. Not to mention they wouldn't have the skills to tune it anyway.
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Kingley
3926 posts
Sep 13, 2015
7:09 AM
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The last time I bought a harmonica that was unplayable or so badly out of tune that it couldn't be played straight out of the box, was in the 1990's. I play Hohner Marine Bands. So I'd disagree with all of you.
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SuperBee
2797 posts
Sep 13, 2015
7:23 AM
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I agree with Kingley.
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Thievin' Heathen
602 posts
Sep 13, 2015
8:10 AM
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I think Hohner's Artist setups will probably get you that additional level of quality control. The cost does not seem too unreasonable.
Given all of the history and challenges faced along the way, I sometimes wonder how this little instrument is even still obtainable. Germany in the '20's & '30's. Bombed to rubble in WWII. East Germany from the '50's through the '80's.
It is a privilege to buy one and market competition has set the price point and quality level. We are living in the Harmonica Renaissance. Enjoy it.
Last Edited by Thievin' Heathen on Sep 13, 2015 8:10 AM
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dougharps
1015 posts
Sep 13, 2015
8:43 AM
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Years ago, when my daughter took flute lessons and played in school bands, we regularly took her flute (first a beginner instrument, then later intermediate) to be maintained and adjusted. Guitar teachers often check the set up of their students instruments and make adjustments or direct the student to someone to make necessary adjustments. I bought an inexpensive Strat knockoff electric guitar locally in the '90s and the store owner replaced the plastic nut with one he made of bone. He didn't like how the plastic nut was made and changed it without my having a clue about it. Our local guitar store these days will do guitar setup/adjustments for a small fee when you buy new strings.
Unless you have the harmonica set up for you by a pro harmonica tech or player who knows what you want/need you are going to get a relatively widely gapped harmonica OOTB. If they sold them gapped for overblows the great majority of people who buy harps would complain that the reeds didn't work, because they would choke the reeds by playing too hard.
People with a wide range of skill levels and playing styles buy harmonicas. You can either pay for someone to do the setup for you, or learn to do it yourself. I learned by trial and error over the years. It is only recently that that I attended workshops on setup and modification offered at SPAH, Harmonica Collective, etc. Although I learned in theory how to shape reeds at workshops, I find that gapping and (only if desperately needed) tuning individual reeds are the main things I do. I do not have the patience for embossing every slot, shaping every reed. I do occasional reed replacements, only when needed. I used to just buy new reed plates.
I have never received a pro level (Spec 20 and up) harp out of the box that was significantly out of tune. Pitch differences (in my opinion) are primarily due to note attack and the breath force we each use. I can play an octave clean at low to moderate volume or push it and deliberately cause beating. The player has a great degree of control of pitch unless one of the reeds is already below 440 tuning. There is no way to mass produce an instrument at even the current prices and expect the setup to suit all players.
I suggest that every player should learn adjustments to the degree that they are comfortable, and pay a pro for more advanced setup.
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Doug S.
Last Edited by dougharps on Sep 13, 2015 8:47 AM
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Goldbrick
1107 posts
Sep 13, 2015
9:28 AM
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I think Hohners sound best but are the highest risk of getting a clunker.
I have never had a bad Lee Oskar but not my favorite sound.
Suzuki kinda falls in the middle
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Pistolcat
864 posts
Sep 13, 2015
10:01 AM
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I agree with Kingly and Doug.
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Pistolkatt - Pistolkatts youtube
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JInx
1075 posts
Sep 13, 2015
10:06 AM
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If you get a lemon, you can send it back to Hohner and they'll fix it
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Chris L
91 posts
Sep 13, 2015
10:06 AM
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I would have to agree with Kingly and Superbee. We have such specific highly developed tastes and sensitivities that we forget that most mid priced harps e.g. Special 20s, Lee Oskars or Bluesmasters are perfectly playable out of the box. If they are seriously out of tune or not functional they can be returned. As soon as we begin gapping to our playing style and shifting the tuning by 10 cents here and 3 cents there we are already trying to meet the requirements of some pretty refined tastes that the average listener would not even hear or notice.
On the other hand, once you are down the optimization rabbit hole.....
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MP
3309 posts
Sep 13, 2015
1:29 PM
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I agree w/ SuperBee and Kingley. I've fixed and built many, many, harps. The days when Hohner harmonicas were crap OOTB are long gone.
I'm amazed at the wonderful quality of OOB Hohner, Suzuki, Seydel, and the over priced but virtually unbreakable Lee Oskar harmonicas.
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I'm out of the Biz for a while till I get over my burnout. You can try HarveyHarp or arzajac, or just look the page nacoran put together under Forum Search.
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