Rockin Daddy
3 posts
Jan 26, 2014
6:57 PM
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I have a Bassman RI LTD and I am looking to swap the first preamp tube to a 12AY7, and I have a few questions about NOS tubes. I currently have a 12AU7 in place, but I'm looking for some more mojo. Are there any tubes that are worth the extra money? I saw some RCA black plate that had a big price tag, but are they worth it? What should I be looking for in a NOS 12AY7? I know not all tubes are equal, and I've read on other posts here that NOS GE or RCA tubes are preferred but I'm seeing different types, so I'm hoping to get some better direction and clarification on what to look for.
Thanks
Brian
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1847
1480 posts
Jan 26, 2014
7:21 PM
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you can get new old stock tubes
for not too much money.. depending on where you live?
i just bought 2 12ax7's for ten dollars each
the 12ay7's i last bought off ebay were not that expensive either. 5 star black plate are....... if i am not mistaken are made by G. E.
may be re-branded rca
if you google..... 5 star black plate triple mica 12ay7
those are the one's
you can run two of those with great results
i spent some time today talking to the tube amp doctor
they sell new tubes
i have not tried them but i came away very impressed
definitely worth looking into.
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i get a lot of request when i play my harmonica
"but i play it anyway"
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blueswannabe
400 posts
Jan 27, 2014
4:20 AM
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I like the NOS RCA 12Ay7 or 6072. I have both. They are very nice tubes and were made in the 50's through 60's. I put the RCA JAN 6072 in V1 in place of a new electro harmonix 12aY7. The 6072 is a very quite tube. IT is quieter than the RCA 12Ay7. I can crank the amp to 12 with nothing plugged in and it is very quite, you hardly notice it's on. Also, both are very musical with great tone.
Some of these tubes are way too expensive. For example, the GE 6072 triple mica 5 star. I heard its a great tube. But I like the quality and sound of the RCA to which I'm partial.
I think most of the NOS RCA's are great tubes.
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Barley Nectar
256 posts
Jan 27, 2014
7:11 AM
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I have hundreds of tubes here. Profesional scrounger. Preamp tubes last a very long time. Often used tubes are just as good as new tubes and way cheeper. There are sonic differences in tubes but often the difference is very small. If you have a good ear and are very familure with your tone you may be able to hear the difference between a GE 5 star and Sovtek but the audience will never know the difference. Also, you may like the tone of the Sovtek better. Subjective...
Find an ebay tube seller with good feedback. Look for a lot of 12AY7 that this seller has tested and buy the lot. Now you will have a few to try. Presonally, I don't fuss over tubes. I stick um in, if they work and are not doing something weird, they stay. JMO...BN
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dted
55 posts
Jan 27, 2014
9:39 AM
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@Rockin Daddy--- I have alot of NEW never used NOS GE 12AY7 and GE 6072A black plate tubes. Also a few RCA ( I think). All have been tested. I will not charge you much more than the Russian ones sell for. Shoot me an email.----- Ted
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Tblues1
61 posts
Jan 27, 2014
12:13 PM
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I like the current production Electro-Harmonix 12AY7/6072A, better than the NOS JAN GE 6072A I have.
They are cheaper (around $13-15) and sound every bit as good, if not better in my opinion.
Last Edited by Tblues1 on Jan 27, 2014 12:14 PM
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Greg Heumann
2575 posts
Jan 27, 2014
12:21 PM
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The first thing I would do is make sure you have finished choosing the gain setup that works best for you. My personal favorite setup for a Bassman RI is 12AX7 in V1, 12AU7's in V2 and V3. The cheapest of the new tubes (like the 12AX7 that comes in the VHT Special 6) is definitely harsh compared to old tubes. The Kalamazoo's came with RCA, Philips, and Raytheon tubes from the factory - I like the RCA 12AX7's the best.
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***************************************************
/Greg
BlowsMeAway Productions
See my Customer Mics album on Facebook
BlueState - my band
Bluestate on iTunes
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blueswannabe
401 posts
Jan 27, 2014
2:37 PM
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There are more differences (gain) in the value of the tube not the make. However, there are indeed differences with NOS v. current. The differences are subtle but they are there. For example, a mullard 5AR4 rectifier is a great tube compared to current. THe NOS tubes tend to be smoother and less harsh. THe electroharmonix 12Ay7 I can honestly say is a great tube. Will the audience know?? Very very very doubtful. Will you know, more likely. Sometimes the subtleties are so small, you can't tell in a blind test.
I think the current production tube quality continues to increase. If the makers do their homework, they can get the tube close to what an NOS sounds like.
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Rick Davis
2918 posts
Jan 27, 2014
4:02 PM
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Much money is wasted on NOS tubes. Vendors will tell you all kinds of tales. Be skeptical.
That is not to say some NOS tubes are not great. As many of you know, I like the NOS JAN Philips 5751 for great tone and a good price. Recently the price has climbed to around $45, but I still think they are worth it. I had two of them in my Bassman (preamp and phase inverter) and the tone was excellent.
I have some 12AU7 NOS tubes that I like very much that will be in the next run of Memphis Mini amps, but it is kind of a crap shoot. Others were bad. You have to test the tubes and listen to them in an amp. Don't take the vendor's word for anything.
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-Little Rick Davis
The Memphis Mini harp amp
The Blues Harp Amps Blog
The Mile High Blues Society
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blueswannabe
402 posts
Jan 27, 2014
7:53 PM
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@ Rick, I would agree that a lot of money is wasted on NOS tubes. Your right about not taking anyone's word for it. On Ebay, most give you test results, but there is a good majority that don't tell you whether the tube is microphonic or not. And there are a lot of vendors who don't have a clue. I love how they advertise....they label the tubes the "Holy Grail." and black plates seem to get better mojo than grey plates... and triple mica is better than double mica . My father started his engineering career in tube technology. He started out fixing TV's and has to this day an RCA case filled with tubes. Unfortunately, I can't use any of them with an exceptional 12Au7 or El84. I remember going to a local electronic supply shop where he would but all his RCA tubes. There were shelves of tubes. If I knew then what I know now, I would have told him to buy amplifier tubes. He laughs at this stuff. .. But there are indeed instances where the NOS tubes have shown to be more reliable, better quality and better sounding. There is no doubt about that. To avoid falling into a trap, I tend to ask vendors questions about their tubes and how and why they are classified as NOS.
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barbequebob
2457 posts
Jan 28, 2014
10:04 AM
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The newer production tubes have definitely improved a lot since they were first introduced in the mid 80's after all the US and Western European manufacturers stopped making them.
There are still some NOS tubes that are worth it because some of the newer production still ain't remotely close to NOS stuff.
The newer 5AR4 rectifier tubes I've seen don't come close to an NOS Mullard, altho I've yet to check out the reissue Mullards and another coming from TAD.
The new production 12AY7's I'm still far from impressed with and the NOS versions I prefer to use in my real Bassman are the 5-star GE's made from the late 50's-mid 60's and the RCA. There are several different GE 12AY7's and the 5 star military grade is my hands down favorite. My only complaint with the RCA is that they tend to be the first one of those two to get microphonic.
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Sincerely,
Barbeque Bob Maglinte
Boston, MA
http://www.barbequebob.com
CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
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HawkeyeKane
2284 posts
Jan 28, 2014
10:30 AM
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"There are still some NOS tubes that are worth it because some of the newer production still ain't remotely close to NOS stuff."
Boy you ain't kidding. At least when it comes to power tubes, a lot of them are just pinout changes of other tube grids. Like JJ's 6V6's and 6L6's are pentodes whereas most NOS ones are tetrodes. I think the same is true of EHX with their oddball power tubes like 7868's and 6973's. I mean, yeah, they work or else they wouldn't still be selling them. But do they sound the same?
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Hawkeye Kane
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Rick Davis
2920 posts
Jan 28, 2014
10:37 AM
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For power tubes I really like the new production Tung Sol tubes for their combination of warm tone and good price.
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-Little Rick Davis
The Memphis Mini harp amp
The Blues Harp Amps Blog
The Mile High Blues Society
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Barley Nectar
259 posts
Jan 28, 2014
11:34 AM
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I just put Tung Sol 12AX7's and JJ 6V6's in my newly acquired Champ II. I also freshened the chassis with caps and a couple of R's. I must say, this amp has awesome tone and power to spare. If the NOS tubes are so much better, you can't prove it by me...BN
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Rick Davis
2921 posts
Jan 28, 2014
11:49 AM
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Goose, I agree.
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-Little Rick Davis
The Memphis Mini harp amp
The Blues Harp Amps Blog
The Mile High Blues Society
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blueswannabe
403 posts
Jan 28, 2014
5:48 PM
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Can anyone comment on nos RCA 6l6gc tubes and how they compare to the jj's 6l6gc's?
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1847
1483 posts
Jan 28, 2014
7:23 PM
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try these
my amps are vintage i use vintage tubes....however
try two blackplate 12ay7s a 5751 in the phase inverter
and two of these for the output... 2 for 20.00 dollars
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i get a lot of request when i play my harmonica
"but i play it anyway"
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puri
137 posts
Jan 29, 2014
6:14 AM
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@Rick - "For power tubes I really like the new production Tung Sol tubes for their combination of warm tone and good price."
Just noticed that you seem to like dark/warm sounding stuffs. I tried the new Tung Sol and thought they were tight & punchy but too dark for my taste. Also the Lil' Buddy is a good speaker but I found it a bit too dark on its own. Might be different in your amp though..
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