MP
2879 posts
Aug 06, 2013
2:28 PM
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I received a B-rad as a gift some time ago and being as it was well played, the notes read all over the place so i couldn't determine how it was tuned. i tuned it like a Crossover and i like it fine.
Anyway, i adjusted a guys three draw on his B-rad but, like my B-rad, the readings are all over the map.
Anyone know the stock B-rad tuning? Thanks! where is David Payne when you need him?
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MP
affordable reed replacement and repairs.
"making the world a better place, one harmonica at a time"
click user name [MP] for info-
repair videos on YouTube.
you can reach me via Facebook. Mark Prados
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arzajac
1120 posts
Aug 06, 2013
2:42 PM
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Hi Mark.
I worked on a Brad Harrison Marine Band a few weeks ago. It needed a reed replaced and the tuning was a little all over the place.
It wouldn't say for sure but in the interest of comparing notes from what I could piece together, my guess was that it was tuned to straight MB tuning but with generously stretched octaves. Chords sounded extremely rich but the octaves beat at medium breath force or higher.
I don't know if this helps since the B-Rad likely had its unique tuning. But maybe this observation may be helpful...
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Custom overblow harps. Harmonica service and repair.
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MP
2880 posts
Aug 06, 2013
3:50 PM
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Hi Andrew,
actually, it does help. though every note was sharp the thirds, sevenths, were clocking in at zero+ where the roots were somewhere 10+ to 20+ cents sharp.
The inference drawn that the B-Rad is Richter like the MBs Harrison rebuilt in the past.
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MP
affordable reed replacement and repairs.
"making the world a better place, one harmonica at a time"
click user name [MP] for info-
repair videos on YouTube.
you can reach me via Facebook. Mark Prados
|
arzajac
1121 posts
Aug 06, 2013
5:58 PM
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It was sharp. The base tuning was at least 443, maybe 444.
If the roots and fifths are sharp and the thirds and sevenths are zero, and you raise your reference pitch to make the roots zero (by going from 442 to 445 (+12 cents)) then the thirds and sevenths are -12 which is getting close to stock MB tuning, just with a higher reference pitch.
I don't assume a customiser always uses the same base pitch for everybody, though. Which is why I "zero-in" on the roots (or the whole chord) and then go from there.
But the mass-produced B-rad would have had the same base pitch for everybody. I think.
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Custom overblow harps. Harmonica service and repair.
Last Edited by arzajac on Aug 06, 2013 5:59 PM
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Frank
2593 posts
Aug 07, 2013
4:26 AM
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The ones I have are...445.......442... for 3rds and 7ths
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MP
2881 posts
Aug 07, 2013
1:12 PM
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Thanks again Andrew- and hello Frank! 445 was close to zeroing out on the roots.
i'll give it a whirl. 442 just doesn't cut it on the root notes. Too dull. Thank you very much.
i tried to get in touch with David Payne @ elkriverharmonicas.com No dice.. what happened to him? He worked at B-Rad.
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MP
affordable reed replacement and repairs.
"making the world a better place, one harmonica at a time"
click user name [MP] for info-
repair videos on YouTube.
you can reach me via Facebook. Mark Prados
|
Kingley
2996 posts
Aug 07, 2013
1:33 PM
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Mark, try shooting Joe Spiers an email. I seem to recall that for a very short period he was working on some B-Rads for Brad to try and help him out. So he probably knows how Brad was tuning them. I can't speak for him obviously, but Joe is a very good guy and I'm pretty sure he would help you out with a bit of advice on their tuning set up, if you ask him nicely.
Last Edited by Kingley on Aug 07, 2013 1:39 PM
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MP
2885 posts
Aug 07, 2013
1:42 PM
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Thanks Kingley!
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MP
affordable reed replacement and repairs.
"making the world a better place, one harmonica at a time"
click user name [MP] for info-
repair videos on YouTube.
you can reach me via Facebook. Mark Prados
|
Frank
2602 posts
Aug 08, 2013
6:34 AM
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Mp...445 for the blow and draw roots and 445 for the 5ths and 6ths on the second pos chord....442 for the draw 3rds and 7ths, and blow 3rds. Thats how I keep my brads anyhoo...
Last Edited by Frank on Aug 08, 2013 6:35 AM
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harpwrench
666 posts
Aug 08, 2013
7:34 AM
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B-Rads were setup in 4 different shops- Rockford, Sleigh, Harl and mine. Richard and I used strobe tuners, the others did not AFAIK. Rockford builds were set up and tuned by hired help using tuning tables which are useless for fine tuning IMO. I used the table to rough tune, then fine tuned by mouth centered with 3 blow at 443. Perfect fifths and octaves, 2 blow and 7 draw at minus 7 cents, 5 draw was at equal. So pretty much like a Crossover. Brad's tuning specs were a bit different and I didn't use them because tuning with a real strobe is different than using numbers only.
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Custom Harmonicas
Last Edited by harpwrench on Aug 08, 2013 12:41 PM
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1847
960 posts
Aug 08, 2013
11:51 AM
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joe did you mean perfect fifths and octaves?
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master po
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harpwrench
667 posts
Aug 08, 2013
12:21 PM
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Yes I did sorry!
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Custom Harmonicas
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MP
2888 posts
Aug 08, 2013
1:10 PM
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From harpwrench-
" So pretty much like a Crossover."
Thanks Joe! So my first guess wasn't that far off. Nice! see yah, Mark
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MP
affordable reed replacement and repairs.
"making the world a better place, one harmonica at a time"
click user name [MP] for info-
repair videos on YouTube.
you can reach me via Facebook. Mark Prados
|
1847
961 posts
Aug 08, 2013
1:24 PM
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how dare i question the mighty "oz"
so what do i win?
a stage 3 marine band with a shiny black corian comb?
ok fine...can i at least keep the ruby red slippers?
there's no place like home
there's no place like home
there's no place like home
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master po
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groyster1
2331 posts
Aug 09, 2013
6:27 PM
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wow!!!you guys make it so hard to figure.....just intonation for playing blues....equal temperament for balladds....with my GMs....kisp.....
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Kingley
3010 posts
Aug 10, 2013
12:37 AM
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"wow!!!you guys make it so hard to figure.....just intonation for playing blues....equal temperament for balladds....with my GMs....kisp.."
Groyster1 - Ah yes, but which version of Just Intonation. That's the point. Are you gonna tune to the prewar 7 Limit JI, the more modernly used 19 Limit JI, Hohner Marine Band compromised JI, Crossover compromised JI or another form of JI altogether? Do you tune to A=440, A=442, A=443, A=444, or do you tune blow plates to A=442 and draw plates to A=443, do you stretch the octaves or not? These are just a few of the options available when tuning to Just Intonation. All of those are used in some form or other by the various harp manufacturers as well. So imagine if you were tuning for a customer, who'd sent you a harp for service. Do you tune it to the JI tuning you use on your own personal harps, or do you tune it to the factory standard JI tuning, or do you tune it some other way?
See it's not quite as simple as it sounds is it?
Last Edited by Kingley on Aug 10, 2013 12:37 AM
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bluemoose
909 posts
Aug 10, 2013
11:31 PM
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Okay....I'll confess (though with an afternoon of awesome jammin' at the Cottage Bistro with a couple Guinness under my belt, an evening of grilled wild salmon and a delightfull Belgian style Imperial stout, rocking out in the living room to Bill Lupkin and the Chicago Blues Coalition with my Electro split to my new Premier Twin 8 (sorry tennant downstairs) through my pedal box and now into the Gewurztraminer and yam chips I'm not sure if this is a good idea...but) It was my key of A Brad Harrisson MB that Andrew did his magic on.
I got it long ago before B-Rads were on the event horizon and was awe struck that a custom could be so sweet. I played the crap out of it and it really moved my playing along. 4 draw went flat but B-rads were in full bore at this time and Brad was occupied so it went to Richard Sleigh for a really nice tune up. It lasted a couple more (many?) years of constant use (and I'm on Richard's email list which is a blessing unto itself) but a reed went sour again so I put it aside. (and got an A crossover tuned by Jim which rocks!!!!)(really need to go light on the asides here ;)
So short story long, a dear 85 plus year old harmonica playing neighbour who has been attending the local jam for over 7 years with his son and grandson was expressing interest in custom setup harps so I got a bunch from him and my Brad MB plus a pre-war vintage MB (late 30's mouse ear?) and sent them off to Andrew. Not only is he Canadian (no duty/GST crap!!! Ya hooo!! Sorry MP :( ) but communication, timing, shipping etc was easy peasy.
Got them back last week (perfect timing between Okanagon Lake and Gulf Island time)and now I must say...as much as I am impressed with the Brad MB work (it just comes alive in your mouth, octaves ring forever) but that pre-War key of C mouse ear!! Damn boy! Did you nail that puppy.
Smile a mile wide. (And I ain't lying (too coin a nested phrase.)
Blue Moose
(Brian "Life" Sentance)
MBH Webbrain - a GUI guide to Adam's Youtube vids
FerretCat Webbrain - Jason Ricci's vids (by hair colour!)
Last Edited by bluemoose on Aug 10, 2013 11:31 PM
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MP
2890 posts
Aug 11, 2013
11:52 AM
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Sokay Moose. :-)
i'm overun as it is and don't care for the stress of deadlines.
less harps mean my customers get their repairs back faster. They dig it.
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MP
affordable reed replacement and repairs.
"making the world a better place, one harmonica at a time"
click user name [MP] for info-
repair videos on YouTube.
you can reach me via Facebook. Mark Prados
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