Littoral
937 posts
Jul 21, 2013
5:13 PM
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I'm trying to set up a pedal arrangement for attending jams and going PA. SM 57, LW Harp Delay and a Harp Break. XLR is the usual PA input but I'd like to be ready for both (1/4").
Figuring out the configurations is driving me a little wacky. I do have a line transformer.
Any help would be much appreciated.
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timeistight
1299 posts
Jul 21, 2013
5:39 PM
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SM 57 -> line transformer -> Harp break -> Harp Delay -> direct box -> low-z PA input
If you have a PA with a high-z 1/4" input, you'll skip the direct box.
If you replace the SM 57 with a high-z mic, you can skip the line transformer (or use it on the Harp Delay output instead of the direct box).
Last Edited by timeistight on Jul 21, 2013 5:44 PM
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HawkeyeKane
1901 posts
Jul 21, 2013
5:42 PM
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Even if the PA has 1/4" hi-Z inputs, it's still a good idea to use a DI. Not only will it provide a balanced signal, but most of them can also provide ground lift in the event of a mismatch hum through the PA.
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Hawkeye Kane
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Littoral
938 posts
Jul 21, 2013
5:50 PM
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Ok, all makes sense. Any DI suggestions?
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Kingley
2925 posts
Jul 21, 2013
10:14 PM
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Just be sure to buy an active DI box. Then you have the options of ground lift and -db. Passive DI boxes don't have that option. I use the Soundlab Active DI box.
Last Edited by Kingley on Jul 21, 2013 10:14 PM
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HawkeyeKane
1902 posts
Jul 22, 2013
7:20 AM
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I've used both active and passive. Kingley's got a good point though. Active DI's will usually have a gain cut option. Lately, I've been using a Behringer Ultra DI100. It has both balanaced and unbalanced inputs, a link jack to run signal to a hi-Z input amplifier, ground lift, and two -20db gain cuts. It's a pretty solid little unit.
But if you don't think you need the gain cuts, a little Rapco passive unit would work.
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Hawkeye Kane
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timeistight
1300 posts
Jul 22, 2013
7:27 AM
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Here's a passive DI with ground lift and attenuation:
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Greg Heumann
2275 posts
Jul 22, 2013
8:55 AM
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Active DI boes have the above-menitoned advantages. They're also more expensive and are running your signal through solid state electronics. I carry the Whirlwind IMP2 passive box. It has parallel in's plus balanced out, and a ground lift switch - works great and is only $39.95
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/Greg
BlowsMeAway Productions
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Littoral
939 posts
Jul 23, 2013
5:55 AM
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bump, timesight ask's a good question (above)
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HawkeyeKane
1904 posts
Jul 23, 2013
6:19 AM
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Advantage is that the signal is amplified rather than slight degradation from the passive.
As for Greg's point about solid state circuitry, one option would be an ART Tube MP preamp. Those serve as active DI's and have a valve for warmer transference. Gain control, phantom power, gain boost, phase reversal, and output limit system. No ground lift, but there are ways to negate ground buzz by pin removal. The only disadvantage to them is that they require AC power.
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Hawkeye Kane
Last Edited by HawkeyeKane on Jul 23, 2013 7:20 AM
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Rick Davis
2150 posts
Jul 23, 2013
9:25 AM
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This is what I use for DI: Hughes & Kettner Red Box Pro
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The Blues Harp Amps Blog
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Last Edited by Rick Davis on Jul 23, 2013 9:26 AM
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snowman
14 posts
Jul 24, 2013
6:17 PM
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I use an audix fireball-with mic cord into Nady DMP2-[basically a pre amp] I take the mic line out from back of nady to line in 'lone wolf octave pedal' [the cord used from back of nady, to octave is female xlr to 1/4" about 1 foot long ,just the cord ,not cord with transformer-that's been done in the nady]--- now to get to the pa-- I use a short patch cord 1/4" male both ends--plug one end into lone wolf octave out-- the other end into a '[female 1/4" male xlr transformer]===I UNPLUG THE MIC ON STAGE AND PLUG IT INTO MALE XLR END OF TRANSFORMER----{PURPOSE-ALL IHAVE TO DO IS ASK THE MIXER TO MUTE THAT MIC FOR AN INSTANT AND IM PLAYING THROUGH THE PA]---the volume on the nady is at about '9 0clock' not to hot---mic volume varies from there-- the volume on channel your in at pa usually winds up at 3-5 like all the other vocals --what I like is [with the octave pedal I get little or no feed back---and I get the overdriven Chicago sound using a standard mic thru a pa---I have it all set to go ==so all i do is un plug mic and plug into that cord--I did this for the blues cruise ,so I could hear myself==works for me thanks
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SuperBee
1322 posts
Jul 25, 2013
4:54 AM
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Ground lift? I'm only getting a vague idea what that's about. Can someone elaborate please?
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HarpNinja
3388 posts
Jul 25, 2013
8:08 AM
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The biggest "issue" with playing straight to the PA is getting enough signal to the board, IMO. The signal from a 1/4" is often weaker than an XLR - this is true on the modeling units guitars use too.
If you crank the volume on the HB, you probably won't overdrive the delay, and you might have enough gain hitting the board. This means a passive DI with ground lift (which is an annoying hum).
The XLR signal would have the same gain, essentially. A passive DI is probably good enough.
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Mantra Customized Harmonicas
My Website
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timeistight
1306 posts
Jul 25, 2013
8:51 AM
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How about running the mic straight to the PA's low impedance input and putting the pedals in the channel insert? Anyone tried that kind of setup?
@SuperBee: Ground Lift switches can be used to prevent ground loops, which can cause hum and worse.
Last Edited by timeistight on Jul 25, 2013 8:54 AM
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HarpNinja
3390 posts
Jul 25, 2013
8:52 AM
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That'd work, but might be harder than a DI if you aren't running the board.
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Mantra Customized Harmonicas
My Website
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Littoral
942 posts
Jul 25, 2013
9:06 AM
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...figuring out the configurations is driving me a little wacky.
I guess I can quote myself.
@snowman, I really like the octave and hadn't considered it as a pedal for PA use. Sure makes sense, especially with the feedback capacity.
I clearly need to spend an afternoon with a PA and a note pad to keep track of what happens.
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