|
Dirty-South Blues Harp forum: wail on! >
Cross harp key question
Cross harp key question
Page:
1
ReedSqueal
350 posts
Jan 23, 2013
5:57 PM
|
2nd position:
Assuming the standard of
Song: G - Cross harp key: C
Song: A - Cross harp key: D
etc.
Why is this:
Song: F - Cross harp key: Bb Why not a B?
And then
Song: Bb - Cross harp key: Eb
----------
Go ahead and play the blues if it'll make you happy.
-Dan Castellaneta
|
Tuckster
1252 posts
Jan 23, 2013
7:58 PM
|
Hmmm A year ago, I probably couldn't have answered this. I was hoping someone like Michael Rubin will expand on my take.
It really helps to know the major scales,even if you have to look them up in a chart.
For whatever harp key you have,you would play in the key that is the 5th note of the major scale.(Cross harp only)
C harp: the 5th note of the C major scale is G.So you play in the key of G.
Bb harp-The 5th note in Bb major is F. And so on.
Sticking with a C harp,the G major scale has the same notes as the C major scale EXCEPT it has a flatted 7th instead of a major 7th. I.E. the C harp has a b7 as compared to G major.
That is the Mixolydian scale,which works nicely for blues(among other things).
Last Edited by on Jan 23, 2013 8:10 PM
|
nacoran
6423 posts
Jan 23, 2013
8:21 PM
|
Circle of Fifths-
That's the fast answer.
What it ultimately comes down to is the names we give notes is somewhat arbitrary. There are 12 notes in the chromatic scale, but a major scale only uses 7 of them. All major scales use the same pattern; they just start on different notes.
Ab A Bb B C Db D Eb E F F# G Ab A Bb B C Db D Eb E F F# G Ab A Bb B C Db D Eb E F F# G, etc., etc., round and round again, from the bottom of our hearing range, right off the top.
It's easiest to see on the piano.
The key of C is simplest to see the pattern in. It's notes are C D E F G A B. (Over and over!) It's all white keys (and here I'm talking about the physical key made out of ivory!) It's a pattern of steps though. Each note, black or white, is a half-step apart from the one on either side of it, black or white. The major scale is a pattern of whole, whole, half, whole, whole, whole, half, rinse, repeat. To make that pattern we named the notes. There are different naming schemes. Sometimes we do 'Do Re Mi', sometimes we talk about them as tonic, supertonic, mediant etc. (I had to look those up. I don't remember them!) Sometimes we call them by Roman numerals. Sometimes it's a dot on a line in sheet music. Historically, sometimes they represented notes by shapes!
What it all comes down to, is they had to come up with a naming system, and they went with the alphabet. They had two choices then, to keep the pattern. They could have named each note sequentially, and you would have gotten- A B C D E F G H I J K L, but then, to keep the pattern, you would have to skip letters of the alphabet. Instead, they laid out the pattern for C (C is the middle note usually between male and female vocal ranges) and labeled the steps in between as flats and sharps. (If you look at the piano, you'll see that every black key is to the left of one white key, and to the right of one white key. It's a quirk of the naming system, but every black key is both a flat and a sharp, depending on what key you are in.)
So, this crazy naming system always uses one of each letter, and always uses either just flats or just sharps (it's just a name, designed so you always have one of each letter A-G). It turns out there is a pattern, an order to it all, but you have to sit there and count it a few times to see it. In the end, each of the 12 keys starts on a different note on the piano, and uses the same pattern of whole and half steps. The names are arbitrary, except that we all agree on them. The reason we play in cross harp is because the two keys are close.
The key of C:
C D E F G A B
The key of G:
G A B C D E F#
Notice that even although they start on different notes, they use 6 of the same 7 notes, which means it's pretty easy to play them on the same harp.
The key of F uses:
F G A Bb C D E
The key of B uses:
B C# D# E F# G# A#
Not much overlap!
But Bb uses:
Bb C D Eb F G A
So F and Bb are only off by one note.
By common agreement, we use up to seven flats, or seven sharps when we name a key. After that you need to start using double sharps and flats. At the bottom of the circle, you'll see that one key has two names. F# and Gb are the same thing! So, the name isn't really as important as the pattern. It's just an artifact of the naming system.
----------
Nate
Facebook
Thread Organizer (A list of all sorts of useful threads)
|
FMWoodeye
543 posts
Jan 23, 2013
8:36 PM
|
Just count five half steps. So five half steps up from G is C. Five half steps up from F is Bb. If you don't need to know the whys and wherefores, you can do that.
|
nacoran
6424 posts
Jan 23, 2013
8:32 PM
|
Notes in scales:
C D E F G A B
G A B C D E F#
D E F# G A B C#
A B C# D E F# G#
E F# G# A B C# D#
B C# D# E F# G# A#
F# G# A# B# C# D# E#
The flats work out the same... each one shares all but one note with the key on either side of the circle of fifths. All the circle of fifths is is a pattern someone found that shows that, (and also happens to work for finding intervals that work for chord progressions, but I don't know if that is coincidence or mathematically just something that has to do with the whole pattern thing.)
For harmonica players, it's really a pain in the butt system. A 'Do Re Mi' system is much simpler to use if you don't have to worry about what to call the flats and sharps, but people who use fully chromatic instruments needed a more complicated system. If you tell a beginning piano player to switch something to a different key, they have to figure out all the intervals and carefully transpose it. All a harp player has to do is grab a different harp. Unfortunately, sometimes we have to talk to people who play chromatic instruments. Personally, I've found a lot of guitar guys prefer using the Roman numerals. :)
----------
Nate
Facebook
Thread Organizer (A list of all sorts of useful threads)
|
Post a Message
|
