Part and parcel in response to Hohners and Suzukis new reed replacement tools; Seydel is upping its own products capability too.
BUT...as rumours go, i've heard variations on an interesting story. One is of a German whom modded the Seydel tool and was selling them for big bucks.
a later version has him being just a general northern European of indeterminate country.
another version has him going to America, and another as him being an American in the first place. heh, heh,:-)[being an American, MPs smile broadens]
no matter. i take it all with a grain of salt.
upshot. instead of using tape as i show in the below vid he (being German.i think) did something less homey than my masking tape improvement.
The new Seydel tool is so new that my supplier has them on back order do to demand. Alas, i have nothing to film...Yet. i will do a vid on the new tool w/ the same hi def quality (Nikkon and German Camera components), and clarity ( Sennheiser mic), as my other vids.
just waiting on the tool. Soon come Babu, Soon come.
apparently the tool will do what i show below making my vid obsolete unless you already own the old version.
cheers, Mark
---------- MP affordable reed replacement and repairs.
"making the world a better place, one harmonica at a time"
click user name [MP] for info- repair videos on YouTube. you can reach me via Facebook. Mark Prados
I would love a tool that would let you then press the reed/rivet back into the reedplate keeping the reed centered and the rivet tight. I still run into the occasional replacement reed that will be too loose. It has to be efficient!
i'm fairly certain that it will keep the rivet intact. i was told in no uncertain terms that my tape job vid above is soon to be obsolete by a mutual friend of ours.
i expected the new Seydel tool two weeks ago. oh well.
what i'd like to see is a hand held embosser that does both sides of the reed slot simultaneously with relatively equal pressure so each side of the slot are even. also it would need a size adjustment for wide or narrow slots. that would be trick!
PS. already my mod above makes flattening the top reed plate less painful. also, if one wanted to wax the seat area prior to affixing the reed it is easier.
i like to beeswax 4 5 6 a a preemptive measure for OB set-ups on my own harps- not other peoples harps unless that is how the harp was set-up. i just replaced a four blow on a Buddha harp w/ OB capability. time consuming but it bent up and down like a champ. should have charged more. it can be tricky.
---------- MP affordable reed replacement and repairs.
"making the world a better place, one harmonica at a time"
click user name [MP] for info- repair videos on YouTube. you can reach me via Facebook. Mark Prados
Last Edited by on Oct 24, 2012 1:24 PM
For those that are interested. A video on the new Seydel rivet tool. The video is on the Seydel web site. Not as complete as Mark's vids and of course the demo dude could have chosen a better background! lol..
Not sure about all the background stuff on the lead post in the thread. I think it is just Seydel serving the needs of the harp players and those who work on them. The new tool has a very inexpensive removable punch as well as a set screw that acts as a depth gauge. So far, the feedback from those who have used it has been positive.
---------- Greg Jones 16:23 Custom Harmonicas greg@1623customharmonicas.com 1623customharmonicas.com
Yes sir.. I realize the vid is limited.. I provided several videos to Seydel as part of the contract to provide the pliers.. and they picked that one... I guess I'm not as camera-worthy as I think I am! ---------- Greg Jones 16:23 Custom Harmonicas greg@1623customharmonicas.com 1623customharmonicas.com
just tried new Seydel reed removal tool as seen in the above video w/ Greg Jones demonstrating.
my unvarnished opinion- but first off...
i worked on brass, woodwind,and reed instruments for schools,the symphony, and jazz guys from 84-92. i know my tools. this is almost complete junk.
i got mine yesterday and am sending it back today after a frustrating hour of trying to adjust the wobbly bugger. the nib and set screw are out of alignment. the set screw threads catch the threaded hole opposite so tool doesn't spring open as designed. also the threads on the set screw get stripped.
it's boxed up and ready to go. keep your older tool.
keep your old Seydel tool in favor of this so called improvement. i tried in vain to remove reed and rivet intact as i show in my video above. i suspect that this new tool is not even made in Germany.
strong words, i know. i'm passionate about tools. Of course i won't do a video on it.
Aloha, Mark ---------- MP affordable reed replacement and repairs.
"making the world a better place, one harmonica at a time"
click user name [MP] for info- repair videos on YouTube. you can reach me via Facebook. Mark Prados
Last Edited by on Oct 30, 2012 3:38 PM
I would ask out of fairness that it be noted, the tool is called the SEYDEL RIVET TOOL and hence, is sold for those who work on Seydel.
I noticed awhile back that my metric sockets don't work on my old GMC. I don't think that renders them ineffective.
The tool is made in China like a lot of other really cool stuff in the world.
You do have some great experience working on instruments and that is respected. I won the video ping-pong tournament in 1984 on an old Atari, but unfortunately that doesn't make me a gamer today.
---------- Greg Jones 16:23 Custom Harmonicas greg@1623customharmonicas.com 1623customharmonicas.com
I too have one of the new rivet pliars, and I did, successfully remove Hohner Rivets, but it did take me a while to get it adjusted right. I also have a Farrell tool that I have had for 15 years, and that is still my preferred method of rivet removal. What I want, and which is why I bought the Seydel tool. I want try to use it to rivet the reed back on. As you probably already know, Hohner rivets remain in the reed if you do not push it out too far, whereas Lee Oskar and Seydel do not. Rick Epping once told me that this is what gives Hohner its signature sound and feel. The plates just holds the Rivet, and the reed acts on the rivet. Or something like that. What matters to me, is that the when I use a donar reed, it is easy to install it when it has a rivet already in the hole. On new Hohner reeds, and Seydel, and Lee Oskar reeds, I personally have to screw them on, which is not too hard, but does away with Rick Eppings theory, since it is sandwiched between the screw head and the reed plate.
Greg jones says that the Seydel Rivets have flat heads, and it is easy to get the Rivet reinstalled, because they stand up. With that in mind, if you could find a stainless steel rivet (perhaps a small nail) that would capture the reed, like Hohner Does, and rivet it to the reed plate, and if Rick Epping is right, then perhaps you could get that Marine Band sound out of other harps.
I hated to see the old tool go. It was awesome. It was for sure Made in Germany. It was a pair of pliers made by Waha or somebody that had been modded to have this tit and hole combination. I have popped I'm sure thousands of rivets with it. The only thing it had trouble with was Hohner MS - those heads on those rivets are too big. With my old pliers, I've popped, Seydel, Hohner, Lee Oskar, Kratt, Hugo Rauner, Vermona, F.A. Rauner, Hotz, Kratt, Hering, Koch, Weiss, Kostler, and probably a bunch of other companies I can't remember off the top of my head - rivets out. The only ones it balked at were the Hohner MS. I never work on Hohner MS anyway, so it wasn't a big deal. ---------- David
____________________ At the time of his birth, it was widely accepted that no one man could play that much music so well or raise that much hell. He proved them all wrong. R.I.P. H. Cecil Payne
i was feeling a bit nonplussed the other morning because i was REALLY excited about the new Seydel Rivet Tool.
i really love Seydel tools. From my favorite screwdriver to the nut driver to my file, i'm a fan boy. the pin vise i modded because it slipped a bit but i'm used to adjustments.
the new tool removes rivets instantly and works fine on Hohners. the difference between the old tool and the new one is i don't even have to think with the older one. i just squeeze and that reed pops out w/ rivet intact and ready to go.
you are right though, and i'm very offended that you would use logic on me, for instance, Seydel for Seydel, Hohner for Hohner.:-)
oh, i suck at video games and can't do a lay-up to save my life. But i bodysurfed the Banzai Pipeline yesterday. Freaking big! Tube-o-lishus! Stoked!
After my surf session i felt in balance and realize i'm being unfair about the new tool. i just don't care for it. BTW. my bodysurfing fins are totally cool and made in China.
Aloha, Mark
but i prefer the old tool. ---------- MP affordable reed replacement and repairs.
"making the world a better place, one harmonica at a time"
click user name [MP] for info- repair videos on YouTube. you can reach me via Facebook. Mark Prados
Darn, I was hoping for a real nasty fight. It not fair to us rabble rousers to settle a difference of opinion is a gentlemanly polite manner. Watch it or you will give us harmonica players a bad name. ----------
I wanted to mention this, but I forgot earlier. The original post kind of gave the impression the Seydel tool was a response to these other tools. It wasn't, seydel has had this tool for probably a decade now. this is just a different version of it. ---------- David Elk River Harmonicas ____________________ At the time of his birth, it was widely accepted that no one man could play that much music so well or raise that much hell. He proved them all wrong. R.I.P. H. Cecil Payne
Last Edited by on Nov 03, 2012 2:00 PM
"seydel has had this tool for probably a decade now."
really! i had no idea. thanks for the input Dave!
i really should investigate a little deeper before making pronouncements. i just have trouble spending more than an hour on the computer. i need fresh air,ocean, or just leaving the house to make a racket on the harp where it won't bother people. No way would i tether myself w/ the electronic leash of an i-phone either. it's bad enough i often take my cell phone. :-) ---------- MP affordable reed replacement and repairs.
"making the world a better place, one harmonica at a time"
click user name [MP] for info- repair videos on YouTube. you can reach me via Facebook. Mark Prados
Last Edited by on Nov 03, 2012 5:18 PM
It may actually be older than I think it is, I don't know.
The one I have, I bought in 2006 or 2007. It started life as a pair of pliers made by NWS in Solingen, Germany. It was modified by hand to be a rivet tool and it is very awesome. It was hand-ground on the sides to make it a little less bulky. There were some that I sold later that used a more streamlined set of pliers, but it was the same idea. It has a hole on one side of the pliers and a tit on the other. The tit pushed the rivet out the hole, perfectly intact.
The new design looks more modern to me. It does not look as strong as the old one. The old one was made of some really good German steel. I'd be interested to see what the new one is like.
I borrowed this pic from Matthew Smart's site: ---------- David Elk River Harmonicas ____________________ At the time of his birth, it was widely accepted that no one man could play that much music so well or raise that much hell. He proved them all wrong. R.I.P. H. Cecil Payne
Last Edited by on Nov 04, 2012 6:47 AM
I have an early awesome handmade version. Harponline sold them, Michael Timler's wife actually was the one who made them. I figured he brought the tool to Seydel when he was hired back in the day, don't know for sure. ---------- Custom Harmonicas
I have always used a piece of 2x4 with a slit cut width wise using a hacksaw - thats my base...Then on the reed I want to change, I'll file the back of it's rivet flush with the reed plate, slide a thin piece of feeler gauge between all the reeds, set the reeds rivit heads in and along the slot of the 2x4 and use a a tiny hammer and nail punch to tap the rivet out...Works like a charm!
Last Edited by on Nov 04, 2012 8:38 AM
You are correct Jim...the way I described goes fairly quickly, but for "quantity" - doing a lot of reeds in succession it would not be the preferred method.
yeah, i got the one in the picture. great tool and no sign of it slowing down. Sometime in 2007? you sent two complete Seydel repair kits to Honolulu. One was for me and another was for a friend.
still don't use the tool holder/14 harp case they came in. Cheers, MP
---------- MP affordable reed replacement and repairs.
"making the world a better place, one harmonica at a time"
click user name [MP] for info- repair videos on YouTube. you can reach me via Facebook. Mark Prados
Last Edited by on Nov 05, 2012 11:36 AM
I have the one pictured above by Dave and really like it (although I am conflicted about how best to ream the reeds when using screws - see my other post). I saw a pic of the new one on the Seydel site and it has a blueish handle. I was excited to get one, but I guess there is no real need. ---------- Mike OOTB Harmonica Price List VHT Special 6 Mods Note Layout Comparisons Quicksilver Custom Harmonicas (Updated 10/25/12)
The old tool works fine and probably works as well or better on non-Seydel reeds. The old tool is a very clever design but not without challenges. The steel on pliers is drop forged (ie hard) so the machinist had to work around that while installing the pin-tit which is not drop forged. When users, like me, had a moronian (Word??) moment and didn't line up the pin-tit correctly, it would break off, ruining the tool.
Under warranty, Seydel was replacing the entire pliers because with the pin-tit broken, there was simply no way to repair it. It was a costly endeavor. The new pliers work fine on Seydel stainless reeds and come with an inexpensive replaceable pin-tit that screws on. They work on Seydel because even if the rivet gets driven completely out of the reed, it is still easy to re-install. If you re-install Hohner reeds using a screw then it really doesn't matter if the rivet comes all the way out.
I guess like all tools, it is just a matter of the application.
I am sure my usage of the words pin-tit will subject me to comments about my Texas A&M non-engineering education. Note a pin-tit is better than a nitwit.
Yours in excellence..
---------- Greg Jones 16:23 Custom Harmonicas greg@1623customharmonicas.com 1623customharmonicas.com
