J-Sin
75 posts
Nov 28, 2011
10:38 AM
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This has been piling up inside me for years. So here it finally goes.
I hate tuning. Really, it must be in my general Top 5 hate list of all the things in the world. But it's such an important part of playing the instrument I feel so passionately about, not to mention I play lots of shows and record all the time, that I feel invalid somehow. Keeping instruments in good shape is vital. Most of the time I just buy new reed plates, but those aren't always available when I need them.
So why do I hate tuning so much?
I was just tuning a low E harp with 1 blow flat enough to make that irritating octave wobble. I gently scraped some metal off the tip, equally along the reed, textbook in my opinion. No effect whatsoever. I did this 2-3 times and noticed that if something, it just kept getting flatter. Once I got it almost in tune, blowing it for 30 seconds or so lowered the pitch again back to the original pitch. But not enough to call it a lost case. Stuff like this happens to me all the time.
It goes without saying that I suck at this for some reason. Over the years I've progressed as a musician to a level I could've never even imagined. But all these years I've been equally bad at tuning. I'm not a handyman at all, even the idea of making my own mics or cases or whatever is a nightmare. What I want is to give money (or goods, or services), get fantastic craftsmanship in return and concentrate on the music. If there would be a professional harmonica tuner in my town I would visit him all the time. I feel good supporting people who know what they are doing. I'd buy all my harps custom if I had the bread.
Another thing is that I really hate the idea of inhaling little particles of metal. I don't know if it can harm you, the guys at Hohner (and this forum) must do that all the time, but still, the idea doesn't make me any more excited to begin doing something I already hate. So I just buy new plates instead.
What do you think, do I have an attitude problem? What should I do to overcome my disgust?
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Reed To The Beat!
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HarpNinja
1933 posts
Nov 28, 2011
10:48 AM
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I don't think they need to inhale brass at Hohner. I try my best to avoid doing so as well, but I always feel like I am, even when I am not.
Tuning is an art all to itself. I've said this many times, but there are so many variables you simply can't account for all of them.
While general guidelines have been established by the greater harmonica community, I am suspect to all of them.
For one, the idea of warming up a harmonica before tuning. This is widely established as something we should do, and I do do (I said do-do!), but it isn't the real world. At a gig, I don't take time to warm-up a harp before staring a song...I play them at room temperature.
Another tuning rule I hate is to play with light breath force. Why not tune at your typical breath force? That is something I always do.
The key to overcoming this is consistency and practice. It also helps to have a good tuner. IMO, typical cheap guitar tuners don't work very well, but probably good enough for a lot of ET stuff.
You are on the right track with making sure the octaves don't beat. Go ahead and warm up the harp, use a consistent breath pressure with the reeds attached to the comb, and trust the initial reeding.
In the real world, you won't attack those notes the same way as when tuning. You will also naturally change the pitch of even regular blow/draw notes as you hear the tones against a band.
1. Get a good quality tuner
2. Warm up the harp and make sure it is dry and on the comb
3. Use a consistent attack and breath force
4. Blow or wipe the brass dust off before testing
5. Trust the initial reading
When tuning this way, I always blow the dust off the reed as best as I can. I also use a lint free rag/cloth to give a quick swipe when necessary. It isn't much of an issue on the blow plate, but it can be on the draw plate.
Eat brass sucks and it is in my head enough that I always think I have some in the back of my throat whether I do or not.
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Mike
Quicksilver Custom Harmonicas
VHT Special 6 Mods
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Littoral
434 posts
Nov 28, 2011
10:58 AM
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I've been successful at tuning and I promise, if it could be screwed up I'd find every way. I really go as simple as possible. I use my tuner app, file, patience, and get the octaves to sing. I better not read much more or I'll learn something to mess up.
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STME58
26 posts
Nov 28, 2011
11:18 AM
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In my (very limited) experience, if a reed goes flat it is usually due to fatigue and no amount of scraping will bring it back up. Your experince of it getting flatter as you scraped it is proably because it was fatiguing faster than you were lightening the tip.
This reed is likely to break off very soon. These usually break off on me when I attempt to tune them.
Disclaimer: I have some experience in metal fatigue and failure analysis, but I have never sucessfully tuned a harmonica. Thank God for replacable reed plates.
Last Edited by on Nov 28, 2011 11:19 AM
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nacoran
4998 posts
Nov 28, 2011
11:22 AM
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Mike, you might have stumbled on an invention idea in there... " At a gig, I don't take time to warm-up a harp before staring a song...I play them at room temperature."
Harmonica warming racks! Like towel racks (and maybe humidors) all wrapped into a convenient stage ready stand.
I've noticed a few holes on a couple harps aren't as pretty as they used to be, but for the most part I play out of the box. I should probably run a few by the tuner and see if I'm sabotaging myself.
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Nate
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groyster1
1599 posts
Nov 28, 2011
11:54 AM
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although I have had some success at gaping have never tuned a harp-the replacement reedplates would be the path of least resistance for me,but can you be for sure the replacement reedplate is in tune?
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STME58
28 posts
Nov 28, 2011
1:48 PM
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Nacoran,
We are on the same wavelenth. I was just thinking of incorporating the fuser roller from a laser printer into my harp case along with a PC battery and a thermostat to keep all the harps warm and ready to play.
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FMWoodeye
58 posts
Nov 28, 2011
2:27 PM
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No need for all the technical stuff to warm your harps. For a few beers I will come to your gig and squeeze them in my armpits until you're ready for them. I am nice and fat (as the moniker Fat Melon Woodeye would suggest) and I'm sure I could simultaneously warm most the the keys you need. PLUS....being fat means friction, and that in turns means not much armpit hair for you to hack up later. I do have those little meaty appendages that old guys develop, but they're pretty firmly attached.
Last Edited by on Nov 28, 2011 2:28 PM
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easyreeder
47 posts
Nov 28, 2011
3:33 PM
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I remember reading an interview with Robert Bonfiglio wherein he described using a heating pad (the kind you can get in a drug store, like a small electric blanket) to warm his chromatics before performing to prevent condensation. For a battery operated version of that maybe some of those heated hunting socks?
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oldwailer
1779 posts
Nov 28, 2011
4:22 PM
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IMHO, buying new reed plates is no guarantee at all that you'll have anything more in tune than a regular out of the box harp--and I don't think any Hohner harp I ever checked was really fully in tune--maybe some of the other brands are better?
Tuning is just a part of the gig--change over to guitar if you want something that's easy to tune--or move in next door to a really good harp customizer who just can't get enough of tuning your harps for free. . . ;-)
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Oldwailer's Web Site
Always be yourself--unless you suck. . .
-Joss Whedon
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BronzeWailer
333 posts
Nov 28, 2011
5:07 PM
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In Japan they used to sell heating pads that might be good for warming harps, IMHO.
Below is a description of the product
"Each Hotteeze pack contains iron powder and once opened, the iron ingredient oxidizes with the air creating heat, making Hotteeze the ultimate in comforting warmth. This simple reaction involves no electrical sources, batteries, burning, flames or toxic chemicals. The ingredients are completely natural, non-toxic, biodegradable and safe. Unlike capsicum based products like the ABC plaster Hotteeze won't cause allergic reactions and last a lot longer."
The average temp is 53 degrees Celsius so may be a bit too warm for the harp, but you could insulate it a bit.
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nacoran
4999 posts
Nov 28, 2011
6:25 PM
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FM, just don't tell me where you warm-up your backup harps. :)
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Nate
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STME58
29 posts
Nov 28, 2011
6:58 PM
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I don't need any more details from FM, but he probably has the right idea. Both Hohner and Seydel offer harp belts that keep the harps handy and warm.
I don't have the style in me to pull off a leather bandolier like Sugar Blue or to casually pull them from my vest pocket like Howard Levy.
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apskarp
550 posts
Nov 28, 2011
10:45 PM
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J-Sin, one thing that is important is to use good tools. If you have bad tools it will be pain. With good tools it isn't especially fun, but still tolerable and quite quick.
I use Richard Sleigh's draw scraper + chromatic tuner:
http://customharmonicas.com/r-sleigh/
When you'll be around here at Oulu I can show you how to use those tools... :)
PS. We'll be having a harp workshop with Helge Tallqvist here at Oulu in March! :)
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Hoodoo Sauna
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timeistight
229 posts
Nov 29, 2011
2:17 AM
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Chromatic players like Bonfiglio warm their instruments to cut down on sticking and popping wind savers. That's one problem most diatonic players don't have.
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STME58
39 posts
Dec 06, 2011
10:36 PM
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I just had the 7 blow on my Low D Sydel Session Steel go flat again. It is always 7 blow so I suspect technique. I first notice it a bit flat an in just a few minutes the blow is the same pitch as the draw. I the past I have tried to tune these and ususlly end ub breaking the reed. I suspect fatigue so I took a look at the reed under a microsope. I could not find an obvious crack but I did learn a bit about the way a harp is constructed. If anyone is curious I could post the photos if I can get instructions on how.
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