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Dirty-South Blues Harp forum: wail on! >
Sorta OT: Audiophile/Recording Help?
Sorta OT: Audiophile/Recording Help?
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HarpNinja
1672 posts
Sep 12, 2011
10:52 AM
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This isn't a plea to get people to comment on the song, but if you know about recording and could help me out...
I am getting a weird high end distortion on the really low tones through my recording rig. As evident here:
http://mikefugazzi.com/files/HeyJoeDistorted.mp3
Any ideas as to the cause? I don't hear it through my headphones in real time (used for monitoring) and it only happens upon play back.
That lends me to believe it is not the mic, cable, or pedals. Here is my entire rig for this...
Ultimate 57 (could it be rattling?)
POG2
Line 6 M13
Tech 21 Sansamp Blonde
Mackie Onyx Blackbird Interface
Laptop
Audacity
Everything is connected via 1/4" cables except the USB chord connecting the interface to the laptop.
According to the Mackie's preamp, I am NOT clipping the preamp while recording. I guess I don't know if I am clipping in Audacity or not.
I did ZERO mixing/mastering/editing to the clip, so it isn't from adding reverb or anything...I am stumped. The noise is a huge buzz kill.
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Mike
Quicksilver Custom Harmonicas
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MrVerylongusername
1931 posts
Sep 12, 2011
11:38 AM
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Is it there before you convert to mp3? Could be a compression artefact.
Are you sure it's not the POG though?
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HarpNinja
1673 posts
Sep 12, 2011
11:50 AM
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It happens in playback through Audacity before converting. I tried the entire rig into a PA and didn't hear it. I also don't here it through the monitor out of the preamp before recording or when listening to a loop.
I am too ignorant to recording to know if it is computer or Audacity related. If it were clipping the preamp, you'd think I'd hear it live. IMO, it sounds like speaker distortion, but there are no speakers to distort while recording! Everything is direct in.
I did try different POG settings with no luck. If it is the POG, I am going to be livid! I have to have the slider below unity as it is way too loud to be the bass otherwise. I have to have the mix of beatboxing/harmonica/bass set before playing as it is all on one channel.
It sucks as I don't like listening to it during playback (it haunts me to the point of not listening to anything else), and I want to record a demo at home (after more woodshedding).
Oh yeah, if you listen closely, you can hear it on the real low harmonica notes too. So it isn't just the POG. I don't have any evidence that the M13 is the cause either as I don't hear it live...only in playback.
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Mike
Quicksilver Custom Harmonicas
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5F6H
840 posts
Sep 12, 2011
12:08 PM
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I can hear something that sounds like reed rattle?
You'll have to pardon my ignorance with PC based recording suites, but how many channels do you have to record onto on the PC? The reason I ask is because rather than using the looper like you would in a live scenario, it may be better in the long term to record the loops as seperate tracks, then if you get any unwanted artefacts you can drop on one loop without screwing up anything else.
More time consuming & labourious but perhaps easier to salvage unaffected tracks/loops? Or let the full loop run through an amp/PA cab & play with mic position/angle, see if going a little off axis lessens it enough?
Having said all that, it's not something that would particularly wind me up, plenty of well known recordings have worse glitches.
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www.myspace.com/markburness
Last Edited by on Sep 12, 2011 12:09 PM
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HarpNinja
1677 posts
Sep 12, 2011
12:38 PM
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It does sound like reed rattle, but it isn't. That is a really good way to describe it. Honestly, I don't play hard enough to rattle the reeds on the Thunderbirds. Also, I am singing the bass part...no harmonica.
I thought it was my Ultimate 57 at first, but after trying various mics, nothing. I've seen some posts about stuff like this on that Audacity forum, but no one has an example for me to compare to.
The only reason I do it this way is I am essentially recording my rehearsals. If I were to try to record something formal at home, I would for 100% multitrack. Actually, what I'd do is do all the instrumentation live but take two feeds...one straight to mixer and one to my "amp".
I would then overdub all the harmonica leads and vocals. Finally, I'd add other overdubs.
I intend on doing this, but I am really unsure how this experiment will play out. At this point, I am planning to share live, real time recordings that are "dress rehearsals". I'd like to get this bug figured out first.
BTW, the vocals are a separate track altogether. They were done live, but with a different mic. In the future, I will prob overdub them a lot of the time because I sometimes sing loud enough for the kids to hear it. I can go back and do them on the weekend or something.
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Mike
Quicksilver Custom Harmonicas
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MrVerylongusername
1932 posts
Sep 12, 2011
12:50 PM
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Try recording at a higher sample rate and see if it helps.
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waltertore
1488 posts
Sep 12, 2011
12:55 PM
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HarpNinja: I wish I could help you out. I have gone through similar journies with this recording oddesy only on older gear. I Started way back as kid with an old cheapo reel to reel with one tape that I recorded over and over till it wore out. Then I got into cassessettes off the mixing board, then a whirl with jamboxes, mini discs, adats, dats, and finally the computer. The computer is the most powerful tool out there today. They have it figured out like any field- from cheapo to top of the line. I have found that entry level gear will only give you entry level results. In the hands of a master engineer, the results will be pretty impressive but one has to spend decades to get that level of skill. Most entry level gear sound samples are done this way and when you give it a whirl the results are pretty depressing. I wanted a push one button, hang one mic, and presto, a great recording sound. I realized that ain't gonna happen and have been full time on the computer recording thing for 10 years now and feel like my stuff is just getting to the point where I like what I hear. I spend 3-10 hours a day/7days a week at it. I also have some top of the field friends that encourage me (mark who engineered my recent cd session). Just like I sought out the old blues greats, I now seek out great recording engineers. They have appeared just like the blues guys did. Mark and I played together for years in austin and he often would sneak me in the pro studios he worked in. Now he lives 30 minutes away and runs the ohio state university recording engineering program. I have had to endure a lot of what you are going through inbetween getting with these guys but if one stays inspired the right people appear. Keep it up!
A good mic, good preamp, good interface, good plugins, will make good recordings. Take one of these links and use entry level gear and you get entry level sounds. For one solid track of gear be prepared to spend 5k or more with the computer:
good preamp - 1k
good mic- 1k
good interface- 1k
outboard compressor- 1k
computer built for recording 1.5 - 3k
plugins - sky is the limit but a good eq, reverb, limiter, mastering eq, will set you back 5-800 bucks.
You probably read that and said "no way can I afford that stuff!" I was in the same boat starting out. Like playing a funky guitar, using bad sound systems, flat harps, because you don't have $ to do better, you will learn a ton about making funky stuff sound good. Then when you get on good gear, the universe explodes with endless inspiration. this has been my experience with playing and recording. Keep on going with what you have and let your inspiration guide you. It will be frustrating but what great journey isn't?
Anyway, I wish I could help you with your actual hardware problems but I am ignorant to most of the gear you are using.
Walter
link to cd
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walter tore's spontobeat - a real one man band and over 1 million spontaneously created songs and growing. I record about 300 full length cds a year.
" life is a daring adventure or nothing at all" - helen keller
my videos
Last Edited by on Sep 12, 2011 1:07 PM
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nacoran
4582 posts
Sep 12, 2011
2:27 PM
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I couldn't hear it on my speakers, but I could hear it when I plugged in my headphones. I usually record in separate tracks, so I'd probably just EQ it out, but since you're doing it one-man-band style that's tougher. Is it possible it's the noise of something in the room vibrating with the low frequencies?
If you recorded the low part separately it might help isolate it for trouble shooting. I'm kind of stumped though.
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Nate
Facebook
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Matzen
279 posts
Sep 12, 2011
2:43 PM
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Do you have enough memory? I remember messing around adding a bunch of overdubs to a track. It started to get a bit noisy when I was getting close to maxing out my memory. Could it be your soundcard?
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MrVerylongusername
1934 posts
Sep 12, 2011
3:27 PM
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I'm not familiar with most of your gear Mike, but I count at least 3 if not 4 digital boxes, including the computer. Each of those will have an analogue/digital converter and each could potentially be sampling at a different rate. A bit of background reading has suggested that up or downscaling sampling rates can introduce distortion into otherwise clean recordings. I would go through your chain and find a common sample rate, as high as possible, and set all your gear to use it.
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Whistler
1 post
Sep 12, 2011
7:50 PM
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Hi all I'm new here , HarpNinja I have a full project studio in my spare room with a DAW setup. What I believe I hear is digital clipping, unlike analog gear digital is very unforgiving it will not let you go into the red zone of your meters at all.In the old days of analog recording you could push your DB meters into the red to get that saturated analog sound, in the digital age you just get distortion. Check your DB meter on play back and check each audio clip in Audacity for clipping,nothing over -6DB
Hi again just read your earlier post on your problems with Sonar I also run Sonar X1 on my DAW so if you have any questions I'll be more than happy to help but it's a little OT for this forum so if you want to email me let me know?
Last Edited by on Sep 13, 2011 7:45 AM
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