I am really enjoying my return to harp but I am also finding the ease of getting info, due to the net, a little confusing. I started to play way back around 1989 or 90 and played for a couple of years or so. Back then there was no internet and I used books and tapes as well as a friend who instructed me. Actually he also gave me a set of tapes by John Sabastian, I also followed along with and tried to copy many records; little Walter, Sonny Boy II, Sony Terry etc. My first tape (by recommendation of my friend/teacher) was Harp Attack and I learned a lot from that. But basically I went by sound and knowing what holes "fit" and what didn't. I could tongue block, bend, hit clear single notes and all of it. But again it was all by sound. I had no clue about notes or pitches etc.
Eventually I stopped...2 years....4 years? Don't recall. But in 2000 I picked up the guitar for a few years. Again...I had no clue about notes and such. I learned all the open chords and the major scale and I learned the pentatonic scale...since I was into blues. Once I learned that, I went right into "just playing along with the 12 bars." Pretty much all those notes fit and I just played with what I felt, making sure to come back by the turnaround. As for bends? I just bent for effect. I never had a thought about what "note" it was. I liked "deep bends" ala Stevie Ray Vaughan or Albert King. I pretty much just plated solos and no chords.
My harp playing was the same. I bent notes just for effect. I play within the 12 bars and come back when I need to, not considering "notes," or anything but timing for that matter. Now, since my return to harp playing, things have changed. There is a boatload of information at your fingertips due to the internet. I am suddenly reading "alot" about bending to the wrong note (too much or too little) and knowing the right note to be on for the chord changes in a 12 bar progression etc. Say what? I have always played 1 draw, 2 draw, 3 draw, 4 draw for wailing, 6 draw, used the 5 hole as a step between useable holes, ended on 2 draw to turn around etc. Actually I find it hard to write down since I pretty much do it by feel. But I go holes 1 thru 6 in a 12 bar progression and just "fit it in."
Now, after all my recent studies since rebooting my harp playing, it seems I am severely lacking and that leaves me confused as well as feeling pushed back further than I thought. Being on the right note for chord changes? How can you not be, by playing between 1 and 6 holes? Or the blues scale? Unless this is if you also play melodies? At this point I only solo or play fills to backing music by guitar or prerecorded . However I am learning bit by bit and taking in all the info available now. It just all seems a bit daunting at this point. I thought I could just play by ear, now it seems i have to learn a whole lot more.....like theory!!! I have never thought of bending to a specific note or pitch! I only bend for feel and emotion. What am I missing.
No Tom that information was around back then also. It just wasn't at your finger tips like it is now. Steve Baker's Harp Hand Book came out in the late eighties and a book that I thought was very good was Glen Wieser's Blues and Rock harmonica. That was late 80's or early 90's. There was a publication called the American Harmonica Newsletter the started in 88'. There was alot of GOOD info then. Theres alot of good info now, but there is alot of bad also. People that are in need of instruction don't know the difference!
There are many questions I could ask now. But let me start with this. So as far as bending goes. If playing along with a typical 12 bar blues. There is a "specific" time to bend according to "note" and chord rather than just "I think a bend would sound good here?
I mean, that would open a whole new can of worms...lol.
Well, I guess it stands to reason seeing as my first book came with a harp and was called "Harmonica for the Musically hopeless! My second book was "Rockin' Blues Harmonica" by Gindick. Oh well....back to the studies.
Tommy ---------- Seven times down Eight times up
Last Edited by on Jun 05, 2011 4:57 PM
Tommy, I give Skype or phone lessons specializing in this aspect of the harmonica, but also with your technique as well. I have put up 36 Youtube videos for you to get a sense of my teaching style. Here is the first one:
Enjoy, Michael Rubin Contact me at Michaelrubinharmonica@Gmail.com for lesson info
Here's an excerpt from an old post of mine that you may find helpful in deciding what notes to bend when:
"Playing blues you use the blues scale of the KEY YOU ARE IN over all 3 chords. Of course you can play other notes, too. But, unlike playing many other styles of music you don't routinely play the scale of the tonic note of each chord. You select notes from the blues scale of the key you are in based on their function relative to each chord. For example, the flat third of the key you are in is the flat third of the I chord and and the flat seventh of the IV chord. Flat seventh of the key you are in is the flat seventh of the I chord and the flat third of the V chord. Etc. You use the blue notes of the blues scale of the key you are in as blue notes relative to each chord as you move through the chords. this is why some musicians say that blues has no harmony. I don't agree with that statement, but i understand why they say it. Some musicians say that blues is just a floating dominant 7th chord. Again I'm not sure I'd put it that way, but they say stuff like this all because you play the blues scale of the key you are in AGAINST ALL THREE CHORDS. This differentiates blues from many other styles of music. Jazz blues may be different, but I'm talking about blues blues."
I might add that flat fifth of the I chord is a restless note and not a note of resolution so it's a good take off point for a solo. It's a note to move from, not a note to move to.
Here's an excerpt from another one of my old posts:
"Tip for playing blues: If you bend notes, it generally sounds better for blues if you hit the note bent and release it up instead of bending it down. Of course it also sounds pretty good just to hit the bent note dead on pitch, without releasing it."
Here's another excerpt from another old post:
"In the blues idiom, the player plays the blues scale of the key the tune is in against all 3 chords, selecting scale tones based on their relationship to the underlying chord. Of course, some non scale chord tones are also played, but an authentic blues player does not play the scale of the underlying chord as the chords change as is commonly done in other styles of music. The blues scale of the I chord is generally played against all 3 chords. (Jazz blues may be different--I'm talking about blues blues.)
This is why some musicians say that the blues has no harmony--which is not a statement i agree with, but I do understand why they say it. Referring to the second note in the blues scale as a sharp 9th appears to be an effort to have the concept of a minor 3d being played against a major chord make sense in terms of Western harmony--but blues tonality is African, and does not actually fit into the paradigms of Western harmony.
A big part of the emotion of the blues comes from playing a flattened 3rd against a major chord and whether, when, and how far one flattens the 3rd and if, when and how that bend is released UP to resolve into the 3d of the major chord. (Tension and release.) So, the "blue third" (quarter step bend) creates tension. AND, btw, in blues it is perfectly acceptable to play a major 3d for variety or as a note of resolution/release.
Similar imprecision in placement of the bend is employed when playing the 5th and flat 5th, but the flat 5th is a restless note and is not a note that resolves. 7ths are usually played as a true minor 7th or a little flatter than that. So, the flat 3rd of the I chord should be played as a true minor 3rd or a little flatter on the IV chord because it is the flat 7th of that chord. The flat 7th of the I chord can be played a quarter tone flat, or as a true minor 7th or even as a major 7th on the V chord because it is the 3d of that chord and can function as a "blue third" or even a major 3d on that chord. But when this note is played as a 7th, it should always be played minor or a little flatter (which is called a "blues 7th" or harmonic 7th).
So, much of the blues idiom is about placement of blue note tones from the blues scale of the key you are in in relation to the underlying chords as they change and whether, when and how far you bend them in relation to the particular chord and if, when and how the bend on the blue note is released. There is no method for accurately notating this stuff in Western music because Western music doesn't have a convention for notating quarter tone intervals.
These "blue note" tones are distinct musical concepts that are related to, but are different than, minor 3d, minor 5th and minor 7th.
I have been told these notes are not unique to blues. As I understand it, they are also used in English and Irish folk music where they are called "long notes." Barbershop quartet music uses the harmonic 7th. Those more knowledgeable than I am can probably provide other examples."
Thanks for that. I have some work to do. Thus far...with anything I have done musically, guitar, harp, singing...I have just gone by feel and knowing what fits in the song and what doesn't. I never thought (for some reason) that it mattered if I knew exactly why....as long as I was doing it. Thanks...I'll have to study up. It all sounds very complicated though...lol
Don't over think it. Just try to be aware of what you are doing as you are doing it and adjust if it doesn't sound right or doesn't sound good. Think about it when you are unsure of what to play and if you are unsure you can use theory as a guide. Nothing wrong with playing by feel. But knowing what you are doing will help you express what you feel in new and sometimes better ways. It may also help you handle a broader variety of material.
Last Edited by on Jun 06, 2011 5:25 AM
The funny thing about this is that I just discussed this a few weeks ago with a friend. He was a drummer for years but about 10 or 15 years ago switched to guitar. He is pretty good. We were discussing blues, which he isn't into, and he said he just didn't understand it or the chord changes. I told him (with my limited beginner knowledge) that he was thinking too much in terms of technical stuff that he is into. He likes Rush and Yes and bands/guitar players like that.
I told him to listen to 12 bar blues and then played him a couple of backing tracks. One was Redhouse by hendrix and the other was Key to The Highway by Eric Clapton. Then I said to him to follow the 12 bars and just play his scale in a question and answer format building tension and resolving making sure to time it to come back home for the turnaround. Thats how I do it. That seemed to open new doors for him. Now I'll have to go back and edit what I told him. lol. Well he actually understands music a whole lot better than me! I'm sure he'll be able to actually help me once I show him your post.
Actually I also showed him a Jason Ricci video on how he played 12 bars using just the 2 draw. See....one note a whole song!!! Just come back home on time and turn around. Phrasing.
Guess not! lol
Thanks again....great forum
Tommy ---------- Seven times down Eight times up
Last Edited by on Jun 06, 2011 9:50 AM
I can figure stuff out using theory (on paper) or I can play it by ear. I can't do both at the same time yet.
The thing to remember is when you are playing a bend you are playing a different note than if you weren't bending. You can figure that out with theory or by ear. If that bent note isn't in the chord everyone else is playing it will cause dissonance. If it is in the chord they are playing it will add to the harmony.
Sometimes you want dissonance. Lots of times you want harmony. The first step, by ear or by theory, is to figure out which one is which.
I'm surprised that Walter hasn't chimed in on this one. It sounds like you are halfway to sponto and you are trying to 'educate' yourself out of it. Man, if it works, don't analyse it, just keep doin it.
