Gig74
39 posts
Jan 07, 2011
12:39 PM
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I've recently had the pleasure of trying out a Chromatic Harmonica, a Larry Adler Professional 12. My father in law insisted I borrow it and give it a shot. I was a little hesistent, being I'd never used anyone else's harmonica before never mind used a Chromatic.
Hygiene issues aside I really enjoyed having a shot, initially it made no sense whatsoever but I got into it after awhile.
Since then I've had a few thoughts about buying one, but the price is a big chunk more than a diatonic so I'm less inclined to experiment by getting a few over a period of time.
So my question is what would you all recommend and in what key?
I'm still a beginner, working mostly on blues in second position, but also enjoy tinkering with a bit of country and pop/rock, playing mostly at home and at the odd family gathering or infront of friends so it doesn't have to be top of the range but something decent so it lasts is certainly worth paying for in my opinion.
look forward to your insights.
cheers
Greg
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Living the dream and learning the blues one little trouble at a time.
Last Edited by on Jan 07, 2011 12:45 PM
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KingoBad
555 posts
Jan 07, 2011
1:45 PM
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I bought a Hohner 270 Deluxe. I love it, but i wished I had the extra low holes of a 16 holed chrom (or at least got the tenor version). My next chrom purchase will probably be the Suzuki scx-64.
I play mostly third pos. blues on it, although there is some great first position blues to be played on it too. Playing octaves amped is a bad ass sound on the chromatic.
C is the standard, but certainly far from the only one used. However, that is an expensive proposition that you should encounter long after you are tapped out on the C.
You are going to need third and first position to make it worth your while. I don't think I have even attempted 2nd on a chrom. Probably my ignorance though. I guess I'd just as soon pick a diatonic for 2nd.
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RyanMortos
936 posts
Jan 07, 2011
1:47 PM
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Hmmm
Two recommendations I would have got had I not got a 16 hole would be:
Hohner cx-12 about $192
or
Suzuki scx-48 about $145
I think there was a third I was looking at but can't remember.
(edit: oh yeah, key of C )
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~Ryan
"I play the harmonica. The only way I can play is if I get my car going really fast, and stick it out the window." - Stephen Wright
Pennsylvania - H.A.R.P. (Harmonica Association 'Round Philly)
Contact:
My youtube account
Last Edited by on Jan 07, 2011 1:49 PM
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toddlgreene
2428 posts
Jan 07, 2011
1:48 PM
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The Swan 16-holer is surprisingly nice for around 50 bucks. It plays as well as my Hohner Super 64 which cost a buttload more.
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Todd L. Greene, Codger-in-training
Last Edited by on Jan 07, 2011 2:01 PM
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Gig74
40 posts
Jan 07, 2011
2:32 PM
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I've looked at the suzuki ( online ) it looks and get a good write up. I certainly like the thought of the 12 holes, being more what I'm used to I guess, but maybe I'm missing the point :o)
Can you get a full 3 octaves on all 12 hole croms, as I see some models use it as a selling factor in their write ups?
I presently only play 2nd or first position if I do play anything else at the moment it is purely an accident :o)
I don't know if I have many options to buy swan harps in the UK, I'll do some searching though and see what's available.
Cheers
Greg.
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Living the dream and learning the blues one little trouble at a time.
Last Edited by on Jan 07, 2011 2:33 PM
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Hollistonharper
210 posts
Jan 07, 2011
2:49 PM
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Do chromatics play better OOB than diatonics or do you need to expect to do much work on them as well. Would love to know before investing in one
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Gig74
41 posts
Jan 07, 2011
3:02 PM
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I've had no bother with buying OOB but as I've only been learning a while my expectations and demands on a harp will be less than a more accomplished player.
I'd hope that the extra investment would = a good standard out OOB but I guess there is no guarantee.
Greg
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Living the dream and learning the blues one little trouble at a time.
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Silvertone
71 posts
Jan 07, 2011
3:29 PM
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another vote for a tenor C 12 holer
yes you can you get a full 3 octaves on all 12 hole croms
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chromaticblues
458 posts
Jan 07, 2011
5:13 PM
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The CX 12 is a great harp. It is expensive, but good!
If money is an issue the Hohner 260 is the best cheap harp IMHO.
As far as working on chroms. A little gapping is usually needed, but not nearly as bad as diatonics.
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dougharps
15 posts
Jan 07, 2011
9:39 PM
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Here is a good reference:
http://www.angelfire.com/music/HarpOn/chrom.html
You can play most of what you would want on a 12 hole chromatic without the extra octave of a 16 holer. 12 holes are usually less leaky than 16 holes.
I hear that the 270 deluxe and Suzuki scx-48 are good. I hear good things about Seydel chroms. I haven't bought a new chromatic in quite a while, so I haven't tried those.
I prefer plastic bodied chromatics since I had some 270 combs split many years ago due to humidity/temperature changes.
I have really liked the Hering 12 hole 5148s. I found Hohner 270s to be much leakier. Herings were really a bargain when I bought them, and always played fine out of the box for me. I don't recall having to tweak a new Hering 5148 or 270 ootb. (I got a couple 5148s with a funky smell once, but when aired out a few days it went away).
Remember that you should have a chromatic warmed up to body temp when you start playing it(otherwise you may get windsaver buzz on the low end).
The Herings were less expensive, had a plastic body, were tighter than a 270, had IMHO a better mouthpiece, were more responsive, and bent easier (a chromatic bend is different than an unvalved diatonic bend).
On the down side, Herings were less durable, with faster reed fatigue, and had a brighter, less dark tone than a 270.
Hering used to have inexpensive replacement comb/reed-plate "combos" that you could move the covers and mouthpiece to if the old harp was beyond repair. Herings are still available, but for parts, distribution problems seem to persist. I don't know where to buy replacement combos today.
Musician's Friend has Hering 5148s for $137.99 with free shipping in the following keys: Bb, F, C, G, D, A, and E. I have no connection to Musician's Friend. I bought Herings from F. R. Farrell and Coast to Coast in the past.
If you really get into octave playing on a C chromatic, I find it is nice to have the extra octave that a 16 hole has, so you don't run out of room. A 16 hole chrom is a four octave harp for single notes, but when you are playing octaves, it is a three octave harp. I still use my 6164 chromatic (under $100 when I bought it) for big 3rd position chords, or octave playing in 1st, 3rd, or 4th. T think 4th is easier on a chromatic than a diatonic, just play in Am on a C chrom by starting on the A note, almost like 1st position. Summertime lays great in 4th (and 3rd).
With 16 holes you have lots of room, and can choose from very high notes to very low notes when single note playing, and you have lots of room for octave melody lines.
@ KingoBad,
I also don't usually play 2nd on a chromatic, although I am able to. I usually use a diatonic if a song lays well in 2nd. I think I recall that Paul Delay and each Norton Buffalo did some good chromatic stuff in 2nd.
I play chromatics in several keys/modes, and use the button a lot for passing notes, but do not truly play a chromatic chromatically in all keys. Slidemeister is a good site for info on chromatic info, but if you post, don't mention diatonic on the chromatic part of the board. Very strict moderating!
What is great about harps, diatonic or chromatic: you just never run out of goals for improving your playing. Like learning to read music on a C chromatic, leaning to improve diatonic overblows, improve tongue blocking single notes, learning corner switching, etc. I sure won't run out of things to learn and improve!
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Doug S.
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Sausagescoffer
4 posts
Jan 08, 2011
2:01 AM
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Gig74 - try Amazon or ebay - both will provide you with options to buy a Swan Chromatic.
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Bart Leczycki
8 posts
Jan 08, 2011
2:42 AM
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Hi, I played a few years on Suzuki SCX-48 - good instrument (price/quality/sound). Now I play on Seydel SAXONY with stainless steel reeds, new valve-system (no stick at all!!!), new slider (very silent) and BIG sound! It's really great, top quality instrument for demanding players. If you want very special key of chrom, you can order every tuning on Seydel's web.
It's very harp players friendly company!
==============================
www.myspace.com/bleczycki
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Chinaski
157 posts
Jan 08, 2011
2:46 AM
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Gig74 - another vote for the Hohner CX12, key of C.
Very good harp. I got one from this seller:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/HOHNER-CX-12-Schwarz-48-C-Dur-Mundharmonika-Neu-/260710373528?pt=Blasinstrumente&hash=item3cb38c9898
The buy it now price is already considerably cheaper than most UK sellers, and I reduced it some more by making an offer (I forget by exactly how much now).
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Myspace
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7LimitJI
271 posts
Jan 08, 2011
2:54 AM
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CX-12 sound great amped and are very easy to play.
The wooden bodied Hohner chroms are a bit harder to play, are quieter and sound smoother.
I would get a Bb first esp if you like blues/swing like William Clarke and Piazza.
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The Pentatonics Myspace
Youtube
Why don't you leave some holes when you play, and maybe some music will fall out.
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jbone
467 posts
Jan 08, 2011
6:57 AM
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i currently use hering 5148. the baritono C gives some great low wnd notes and is playable all the way up. the fly in the ointment with hering is, their availablity and getting replacement reeds when needed. by the way, i won't bother with a harp that i have to ness with right out of the box, and in the hering's favor it was great from the first note. i also have a 5148 in G which i managed to kill a reed on and need to get it rehabbed.
to me a chromatic harp is totally great for 3rd position blues. i initially had a hohner chrometta 8, then a 12, and played 2nd position on them since i had no idea how to play in 3rd. but once i DID get around to learning 3rd, it was a whole new wonderful world harp-wise! it's sort of like learning to waterski on 2, then going to slalom. different dynamics but the end result once one learns the different technique is amazing!
the hohner chromettas are seemingly cheaply built and there are those who dog them without mercy, but as a learning tool they did very well for me. no tweaking, extra large holes, air tight, and not too expensive.
a friend gave me a hohner 271 recently and i can't believe how sloppy it is built. it tool me a very short time to decide i didn't want to play it.
i like the idea of the suzuki scx model- when i can afford one! their diatonics have been very well built and dependable imho, and i have seen very good reviews of the scx chromatic. when i can afford to i will likely be getting a scx.
for a decent chromatic of any flavor i would expect to pay about $140 us.
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Gig74
43 posts
Jan 08, 2011
1:58 PM
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Thanks for all the good advice it's great to get your views.
@ scoffer - I'd have never thought to look on amazon for harmonicas, but right enough there's heaps on there.
@ Chinaski - I'm checking that eBay option it's a good price, do you remember if you got charged import tax? How's the band going, any plans for heading north of the border before Dundee?
I guess I'm a stickler for what I know brand wise which is hohner
and Suzuki so chances are I'll end up going down that route. I'm amazed by the price of the swan though, it makes experimentation a bit more feasible. the shape of the hohner cx-12 reminds me of the Suzuki mini major with that plastic all in one body. I got one and found it more than a struggle to get anything like a tune out of it, but I'm pretty sure I'd have more luck with cx-12.
Since checking eBay I've found good prices on the Suzuki scx 12 hole models as well, so I could go either way :o)
Thanks again for all the details guys it makes decision making a whole lot more informed.
Thanks
Greg.
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Living the dream and learning the blues one little trouble at a time.
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Chinaski
159 posts
Jan 09, 2011
1:57 AM
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Greg - I'm pretty sure I got away with the import tax from Germany, but I've found it tends to be luck of the draw with that kind of thing.
Band is going well thanks - we will be at several festivals this coming year, including Dundee, but I doubt we will be north of the border before then. Hopefully see ya there..
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Myspace
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7LimitJI
275 posts
Jan 09, 2011
2:20 AM
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@Gig and China
No import duties apply when buying and selling within the EU.
The vat and duties are paid at source.
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The Pentatonics Myspace
Youtube
Why don't you leave some holes when you play, and maybe some music will fall out.
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Chinaski
160 posts
Jan 09, 2011
3:37 AM
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Ah yeah, that makes sense.. it's the US charges I usually cop for!
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Myspace
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Gig74
45 posts
Jan 09, 2011
2:03 PM
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Hey guys thanks again.
I've just bought the hohner cx-12.
From the eBay vendor you recommended chinaski, the great initial price, no import tax and the chance to haggle where to hard to resist :o)
Looking forward to it's arrival. Harps in the post are always an exciting prospect.
Cheers
Greg
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Living the dream and learning the blues one little trouble at a time.
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dougharps
30 posts
Jan 19, 2011
2:31 PM
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BUMP
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Doug S.
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