I know there are some who say there are no stupid questions...but here goes.... I have recently been asked to play in a local blues band. We had a practice and a gig last night that actually went pretty good for only one practice. I do not read music....I play second position well, and beginning to play a little third position. I find third position quite limiting. So I thought I'd just go out and buy some L.O. minor harps. So.....one of the song is in Am...so I'd buy a Dm harp for second position. Another song is in Dm.....The circle of fifths say to play a Gm harp for second position. They don't make one.....SO ....I know there is a simple answer to this question.....I have tried to find it ....but alas.....I am asking the great minds and teachers of this esteemed group.
Thanks in advance
Paul ----------
Music is your own experience, your own thoughts, your wisdom. If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn. They teach you there's a boundary line to music. But, man, there's no boundary line to art. - Charlie Parker
Last Edited by on Oct 31, 2010 8:36 AM
I knew there was a very simple answer !! Thank you SO much !!! ----------
Music is your own experience, your own thoughts, your wisdom. If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn. They teach you there's a boundary line to music. But, man, there's no boundary line to art. - Charlie Parker
It is as mercedesrules says--and D natural minor harps are available in Marine Band and Special 20, as well as LO. I found that they were also available in Gm with a Google--although I only have Am and Dm myself.
If you do any tuning at all, it would pretty easy to convert any harp to natural minor by just flatting the 2,5,and 8 blow one semitone--and the 3,7 draw one semitone. There is a tuning conversion helper at http://www.truechromatic.com/tune-o-matic.php . ----------
i find 3rd limiting, too. but i believe it is my own limitations. my lack of understanding and skill. how about you, pharpo? why do you find 3rd limiting?
eharp......for the exact same reasons...I have not spent enough time with it. I admit...I am looking for the "easy way out" LOL. ----------
Music is your own experience, your own thoughts, your wisdom. If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn. They teach you there's a boundary line to music. But, man, there's no boundary line to art. - Charlie Parker
whew!! i thought, maybe, that i was the only lazy, non-practicing, not truly serious harpster her. (not inferring you are all of those things, pharpo.) i keep thinking i should buy some minor harps, too. but you can add cheap to the above list for me. for the couple of minor songs we play, i will stick to holes 4,5&6 or risk 2nd position for a tad. (until i decide to put some time into 3rd.)
@eharp--add me to the list of the lazy non-achievers--but, if you are truly lazy, you should break your cheapie tendencies down for at least one Natural Minor Harp--they are really great fun--for no added work at all you can just play the shit out of minor tunes. . . ----------
HAH !!!! (I am all of those)- Have we met ??? LOL I appreciate all the suggestions.
@oldwailer - that sounds like an interesting project- I have all the tools I need to do that.
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Music is your own experience, your own thoughts, your wisdom. If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn. They teach you there's a boundary line to music. But, man, there's no boundary line to art. - Charlie Parker
wait. you'll try to tune, but wont practice 3rd? sounds like me. i would definitely risk $30 harps instead of putting in 10 hours of focused practice! were we separated at birth?
Or for minor key blues, use Fifth Position (E minor on a C harmonica / A minor on an F harmonica): B2 is root, avoid D5 and D9, and don't bend anything but D3 and don't play any chords, except you can use D1,2,3 or D2,3,4 on the I chord. If you follow this over-simplified formula it's actually pretty hard to hit a really bad note.
Last Edited by on Oct 31, 2010 2:17 PM
@eharp - you are absolutely correct...and I appreciate it very much. Between this thread and my other plea for help - on my Crate v18 - I have learned quite a bit. AND it has all remained positive !!!!!
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Music is your own experience your own thoughts, your wisdom. If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn. They teach you there's a boundary line to music. But, man, there's no boundary line to art. - Charlie Parker
"eharp - you are absolutely correct..." Oh geez - now all those new hats he bought are not going to fit!!!! ;-) ---------- If it ain't got harp - it ain't really blues!!!!
If you can be bothered to put in the time I would highly recommend working on third position. I had the same frustrations with it, however I have been using it more and more and rather then finding it limiting I'd say I now find it very liberating.
It gives you two full octaves on the blues scale (plus a little bit at the top) and if played over some major key progressions it can give you a nice slightly jazzy feel blues.
1-4 draw split gives you the root.
If you can play 2nd position you can play 3rd, the only tricky bit is getting the two bent notes on the 3 draw.
http://www.harptabs.com/printsong.php?ID=5150
Last Edited by on Nov 02, 2010 6:48 AM
I think that Baker put it perfectly.. if you put the time in it all comes easy. I don't try to bend my 3D i can never hit it right??? but the 1-4 split draw is a good sound and really adds some depth to the song. and just remember it's all blow up to the 4 work 4,5,6 blow or draw B7 and work the hell out of 8,9,10 blow or draw. it takes pratice but you can do it. give your self a week of 1 hr practices and you'll have it down.
Pharpo- It just takes time to get used to 3rd position. At first I thought it was limiting,too. But the more I played 3rd,the easier it got. I can now actually do some improvising in 3rd. Find some minor keyed songs and fiddle to them in 3rd. Incidentally,somewhere Ricci has a video showing the merits of playing in 3rd vs. using a minor tuned harp. If I have time,I'll dig it up and post it.
Tuckster.....very informative. I had never seen this one before. Thanks ! ----------
Music is your own experience, your own thoughts, your wisdom. If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn. They teach you there's a boundary line to music. But, man, there's no boundary line to art. - Charlie Parker
I have a question for all you guys that say you don't practice 3rd position. What do you play (or think about) when you are on the 5 chord in 2nd position blues?
"The key of music labeled on Natural Minors is based on playing in Cross Harp (2nd Position). Natural minors are DESIGNED to be played in Cross Harp... NOT Straight Harp (1st Position)."
FYI - They do make a G Natural Minor.
Last Edited by on Nov 02, 2010 10:12 AM
@ ridge - Thanks, I originally thought they were not made because - when I went to order from my usual source, they were not listed - and HE has everything !! (I thought)...I then saw them on the L.O. site. ----------
Music is your own experience, your own thoughts, your wisdom. If you don't live it, it won't come out of your horn. They teach you there's a boundary line to music. But, man, there's no boundary line to art. - Charlie Parker
