|
Dirty-South Blues Harp forum: wail on! >
Paying your dues
Paying your dues
Page:
1
5F6H
327 posts
Oct 15, 2010
10:46 AM
|
There's a lot of negativity on this forum...period.
You have to pay your dues in any genre, it's not limited to blues...all genres have their classics & standards, they are copied, or perhaps better described as "interpreted" decade in, decade out.
The enjoyment of music, to me, comes from its excution as much as the concept, people forget that just because that they are acquainted with a style, or a number, that it doesn't mean that everyone is...you just have to count the number of songs that are regularly attributed to cover artists to realise that. I see it when one artist derides another for playing stuff , "I was playing 10-15yrs ago!", forgetting, of course, that the source material is 40yrs older than that! I guess what I'm saying, is that as people develop a style, they tend to narrow their view of what is relevant...perhaps forgetting that their perception of 'relevance' is unique to them.
People play well when they are playing music that they enjoy, it's not for me, or anyone else to tell you what you should be playing, if that is what floats your boat (though, if asked we may offer, hopefully constructive, criticism on how to improve - I have to admit that it took me a while to learn to wait until I was asked).
|
harmonicanick
939 posts
Oct 15, 2010
10:58 AM
|
you begin you practice to have the technical ability to play the notes
its good to know the names of the notes as well
learn scales and understand the connection between them
most importantly: spend time playing with other people. Make sure youlearn how to play with other people and FOR other people.
That's the job - to play music for people
There's nothing worse than someone who has practised his or her whole life and never learnt to play a song in front of people to make them feel good
|
Joe_L
709 posts
Oct 15, 2010
11:19 AM
|
Play what you want. Ignore the others. People will frequently put down the things they don't understand or can't do.
Jazz saxophonist, Ed Petersen told me a long time ago, "if you care what other people think, you'll never do anything great."
It's your instrument and your music. If you want to play Blues, play Blues. If you want to spend time playing stuff note for note and tone for tone, do it. Play the way you want.
It's your life and your music. It's supposed to be fun.
----------
The Blues Photo Gallery
|
9000
36 posts
Oct 15, 2010
3:29 PM
|
There's all kinds of dues to be paid. I read an interview with Butterfield one time where he talked about being asked to play various songs that the Chicago fans knew from hearing the Walters, etc. He said he just simply couldn't play those songs at the time. I agree with what's been said about having fun and playing what speaks to me personally. I had to study voice for awhile in college and my teacher was highly sought for experimental music.She could read/hear quarter tones and sing them on demand. She was at the top of her game. She used to accuse me of being "in love" with my own voice because I would hang on certain notes longer than was indicated. I realized that I'm a very tactile learner and sometimes I hang on a note or hit in hard because I like the way it feels. That means my music is going to sound different than others but I sure enjoy playing! The rule in our band is, "If we're not havin' fun...it's not gonna be good!
|
hvyj
713 posts
Oct 15, 2010
3:43 PM
|
True story: A guitar player with a degree in music (jazz performance) was hired to run a one-off open blues jam at a club where he had been performing with his jazz band. He asked me if I'd be there to help him and i agreed. A young, reasonably competent and fairly experienced blues harmonica player comes in and gets called up. He plays the usual tried and true blues licks on several familiar blues tunes.
Then a bass player comes up who (like the guitar player/leader) is basically a jazz guy and the band launches into Herbie Hancock's "Cantaloupe Island" which has a great groove and is very playable on diatonic harp. The young harmonica player immediately gets a deer caught in the headlights look, motions to me, hands me the mic and says he can't handle that tune. So I played on it.
Now, I'd been listening to this kid play a half dozen blues tunes with reasonable competence and it was absolutely clear that playing "Cantaloupe Island" was well within his technical capabilities. It's a fun tune to play and has a terrific groove. But, because it's not a I-IV-V chord progression and because you couldn't get through it playing just blues licks, the kid was lost. That's what happens when you focus on learning blues licks instead of learning to play your harmonica like a musical instrument.
Last Edited by on Oct 15, 2010 3:51 PM
|
Joe_L
712 posts
Oct 15, 2010
4:15 PM
|
I know this sounds really odd and it's often quite hard for some people to grasp this concept.
Some people go to Blues jams to play and listen to Blues. They don't go to Blues jams to play Jazz, Country, Rock or the Blues bastard stepchild, Blues Rock.
Let's be real. It's an open Blues jam. Pulling out a jazz tune is hardly or another tune that other players don't know is a punk thing to do. The open jam is supposed to include, not exclude.
The same sort of thing would be true, if the harp playing leader pulled out a tune with an arrangement that they knew the blues rock-playing guitar players wouldn't know. It's not cool.
When I am playing at a jam, I attempt to pick a tune that will work for everyone involved. At an open Blues jam, that usually ends up being Blues. The common genre that the jam is organized around is supposed to be the glue that holds it all together.
Going to a bluegrass jam and attempting Acid Rock isn't going to work. It's ignorant.
Why make people look bad?
Last Edited by on Oct 15, 2010 4:16 PM
|
Buddha
2577 posts
Oct 15, 2010
4:49 PM
|
"My point is that the tradition of learning the blues is "copying" and "imitating". "
Do you like mongolian music?
They were copying and imitating long before the blues
----------
"I am a great believer in understanding, not copying."
|
hvyj
714 posts
Oct 15, 2010
5:36 PM
|
@BeardHarmonica: Perhaps i should have added that the player I was talking about had just played 3 minor key tunes in third position, one of which was a natural minor, and he had enough knowledge and experience (and a good enough ear) to avoid the major sixth (draw 7) on the natural minor tune. That is a sufficient skill set to be able to play "Cantaloupe Island" in third position.
It is NOT a hard tune to play. To my ear, it's more R&B than jazz anyway. It's Dorian minor which is third position on harp except for a short passage that goes to natural minor on which you can lay out.
You can use blues scale/minor pentatonic scale to play it (which are the scales we use to play straight ahead blues), and which are same scales the kid had just been playing on the blues tunes he had been playing on. So, clearly he had an adequate skill set to handle this tune. BUT you can't rely on cliche blues licks to do it.
With all due respect, if you can play minor key blues in third position, the only reason you would find this tune difficult is if you only think in terms of playing blues licks over standard blues chord progressions. If you just play the same notes in a different order and not phrased as blues licks you ARE able to play this tune. It's not that you can't play it--it's that just imitating blues licks has limited your thinking and approach which makes you feel confused when there is actually no reason to be.
Again, I do not wish to appear to be disrespectful, but there is a difference between learning to play the harmonica and learning to imitate blues licks. You are most likely technically able to do everything you need to do to play this tune.
@Joe_L: I agree. It's certainly not a tune I would have called at a blues jam. But you had a couple of jazz cats on stage who have played it with me more than a few times, so they know it's playable on harp and they look at it as R&B style jazz anyway (like "Mercy, Mercy"). So they probably think a harmonica player shouldn't have a problem with it. And you know what? A harmonica player shouldn't. But, someone who only uses a harmonica to initiate blues licks might get confused. But he wouldn't if he actually knew how to play his harmonica (or understood what he was doing when he is playing blues) BECAUSE HE ALREADY HAS ALL THE TECHNIQUE AT HIS DISPOSAL THAT IS NECESSARY TO BE ABLE TO HANDLE THIS MATERIAL.
Btw, i don't want to appear to be arrogant either, so i don't mind letting you know that i don't always get this tune exactly right every time I've played it. But i usually make it through without flagrantly screwing it up and more often than not I do just fine. But I've been known to screw up on blues tunes from time to time, too, so that's ok. We can all strive for better consistency.
Last Edited by on Oct 16, 2010 12:50 AM
|
N.O.D.
275 posts
Oct 15, 2010
6:21 PM
|
The only relavence is the music and how you interpret this music playing note for note isn't always about carbon copying the original artist,
now you as the Artist will take this song and Add your own little nuances to this tune the things Adam has explained these suttle little changes to add expresion of ones self in his/her Music,
it may be a little Bleed on the end of a note a soft tailed of vibrato or may be way out left feild a tastfuly added lick, this is when you make the Tune your own, you become the Artist it is your voice people will reconze this Voice,
Are the Audiance Listening Well when theres a BLIP load of Harpin Brothers and Sisters in the Joint then talk to you later and say Hay! i like what you did with the last tune that Vibrato thing on the end of that BLAH BLAH Tune sounded great i loved it:)
How Do you Learn Music, to talk, walk, Yes Mum and Dad teach you,,You look Listen and learn eventuly become your own person Walk your own Walk talk your own Talk Play your own Music,
Shure it Has the Foundations of of What you learned from Mum and Dad,
But it is your own Voice your own Strut your own Music,those who can't see the Person Behond the Strict teachings of The Parents are Blind and can't see the real Artist For who She/he is or what they are saying in there music they will never understand this Artist They will never understand you:(
Are you being a Copy cat or are you being your Own Artist are you traveling your own path?
some say NO!
Blues Music is what it is,
It will always be What it is,
We will die and Fade away
the Blues is here Forever and a day:)
----------
You will never understand Me:)
|
Post a Message
|
