ii-V7-I is one of the most important progression in jazz, pop, and even some blues music.
so what is 2-5-1? And how is it connected to modes?
Well it IS the modes.
Dm-G7-C is the 2-5-1 for c major
while it's good to practice the modes but you'll quickly stumble if you see that progression and think I have to play dorian then Myxolydian and the major scale.
Instead think of the whole progression as the C major scale. After all, dorian and C major are really just the same scale but started in a different position. Besides that, you're a square if you're playing root tones. The next time you see a Dm scale just blow a C maj scale over it and it will sound cooler than just playing a Dm scale starting on D.
---------- "All is bliss"
Last Edited by on Aug 30, 2010 9:04 AM
For this particular example you've kindly laid out, what key harmonica would you select? Secondly, could you please name a song that uses this progression? I'm excited to try this. Thanks for dropping knowledge on us.
So, when doing a progression like this, would it be like... 2 measures on the ii 2 measures on the V and 2 measures on the I? Sorry I'm not very keen on music theory... something I would like to know more about.
Speaking of which, could you recommend any good books on music theory? Not just jazz or any specific genre. I have a modest interest in jazz, but I'd really like to learn a working knowledge of music theory, enough to translate the music in my head to the music out of my harp, and maybe be able to express my ideas to band mates.
hvyj, you can't play C over D Dorian because you can't play a scale over a mode. But if the key is in D minor lets say, you could play the C scale over the song because D is the Dorian mode of C. So, you're starting on a major second.
jon, you can't really answer that because technically you could do it anyway you wanted to. A 12-Bar blues in C would look like this: C7/// F7/// C7/// C7/// F7/// F7/// C7/// C7/// Dm7/// G7/// C7/// G7///
That's just one way, though. "Autumn Leaves" has the ii-V-i in it, but I'm looking at the chord changes and it is much different because you're dealing with a minor key. It is in E minor which is relative to G major which means the E minor becomes the i chord. Since this is the sixth degree of the scale that means the second degree becomes F#m7b5 (a half-diminished chord). But, don't worry about this.
I recommend going to http://www.realbook.us and looking at some jazz chord changes and also checking out the book Jazzology by Robert Rawlins and Nor Eddine Bahha. It goes over major scales, minors, etc, then goes into the 'basics' of jazz theory and goes form there.
By the way, if you played to "Autumn Leaves" try using 4th position as that plays in the relative minor of the key of the harmonica you are using. For reference, that is the Aeolian mode.
please stay away from teaching on my threads. Thanks.
@hvy the Cmajor scale is the same scale as the D dorian mode it's also the same scale as the G myxolydian mode and yes you can play the C SCALE over those and any mode of the C major scale. ---------- "All is bliss"
@Zack: C major won't work over D minor because D minor has a Bb and C major has a B. C major works over D Dorian, though. I knew that, but I was just trying to conceptualize the relationships.
hvyj, sorry about that confusion I misunderstood what you asked. Music is quite a beautiful thing but this just makes it complex, also. It is really fun, though, to mess with all of this stuff on equation. That one note differences of course is a matter of dissonance, might sound cool! :)
What's a tonal centre? And why would it be better/worse than understanding modes? My head hurts. Anyone come across any basic - from scratch - jazz harp lessons on YouTube? When it comes to different positions, I know some blues scale stuff but I'm guessing that's not what's required for jazz.
Jodan, modes are just starting and ending on a different note of a certain scale instead of the usual note (so, start and end on D instead of C, etc). On YouTube there really isn't any 'jazz harp' tutorials. You'll have to honestly read up on theory, etc.
i'm a very very newbie in getting understanding improvisation:) there are a lot of methods but i need someting simple to start with now i concentrate on these: jimmy bruno's school for guitar( see neighbour post) and Uncle Willie Thomas jazz everyone.com ( the real easy starting point) I play through the cicrle of fifths on diminished harp, though for richter it is not that easy:) ----------
