|
Dirty-South Blues Harp forum: wail on! >
2x8" Mission Chicago Amp!
2x8" Mission Chicago Amp!
Page:
1
2
Joe_L
287 posts
May 26, 2010
8:24 PM
|
@htownfess - I agree, if you can get a nice sound out of an amp with a 520DX or Blues Blaster, that gets my attention. The sound you got out of a Superlux with the Valve Jr half stack and the Harp Tone+ pedal caught my attention.
@JDH - Skip is cool. I learned a lot while visiting with him for an hour. His Masco PA heads are killer!
|
Nastyolddog
793 posts
May 26, 2010
10:57 PM
|
if you are going on what other players want in a Harp amp from there demos not every player wants the same from the same amp"
So, what you're saying is, if Bruce can play harp, he'll build it to suit his taste.
YES
Same problem. Not everyone wants the same.
FREEDOM of choice but the best choice would be buy from a Plyer Bulider,
Learn to tweak your own, then you can buy almost any tube amp and dial in the sound YOU want.
NOT every one can do this thats why they will buy a spare parts bin Amp:)
Bruce is a respected amplifier builder who knows how to voice and design an amp:)
I don't know this so if i was a buyer i would go for the Pro that can Build and Blow:)
he listens to various players and designs an amp and tone stack with a range of sounds to accommodate
as many as possible.
WHO are these variouse plyers,,Accommadating all Players you would have to build a middle of the road amp wouldn't you:)
Fixed and cathode bias. Fat switch:) Fat tone would eliminate the need for a Fat switch:)
He can dial in, bass, treble,middle,compression,crunch,distortion etc ,etc
just by changing a few,resistors or caps to change frequency response or voltages.
This is impossible for a semi mass produced amp
ie i meen an amp for the masses:) not just one of Customs for customers:)
Another thing, many people drive cars,but don't know how they work or how to maintain them.
They should and not be lazy wackers:)
If they want to go faster they take it to an engineer who tunes it for them.
There Dum asses and should of bought a faster car from a pro to start with:)
The engineer might not drive a car, but knows how to do it.
Not likely he drove a car at one stage in his life:)
Or the moto gp engineer, who cannot ride a bike.
he would have had hands on experience at some stage in his life with engines cars bikes:)
Given the feedback from the rider tunes the bike, dials in the suspension etc,etc
this is a bike for one person not the masses the feedback will filter in to the production model but will be a far cry from what the Pro Rode,
A Production model:)
Most people have heard a Bassman, so it is a good amp to use as a base line to compare any other amp with.
So what you are saying and from what i have been reading from the threads on this amp,
and i have read every one from the introduction of this amp to MBH Forum
is we have an amp built from the spare parts bin, losely bassed on a Fender bassman,
from a guy that can't Blow Harp but will build an amp to your tast but is offering a amp to the masses,
does he play any instrument:)
:):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):P
|
5F6H
154 posts
May 27, 2010
2:07 AM
|
@ Nasty "So what you are saying and from what i have been reading from the threads on this amp,
and i have read every one from the introduction of this amp to MBH Forum
is we have an amp built from the spare parts bin, losely bassed on a Fender bassman,
from a guy that can't Blow Harp but will build an amp to your tast but is offering a amp to the masses,
does he play any instrument:)"
The Mission is not a bassman style amp, this was established in the various threads on the amp. I know few harp players who can build a decent sounding amp, they do exist but you can count them on one hand - most amps used by harp players are NOT designed, or built by harp players. No evidence I have ever read suggested Leo Fender played harp, nor Mark Sampson (Masco), Everett Hull (Ampeg), Nathan Daniel (Danelectro), Valco...etc, etc...
Amp builders build amps, harp players play harp, occasionally the 2 overlap. As 7LimitJI suggests, Moto GP riders win races, engineers build & design the bikes...I don't expect a Michelin starred chef to design my toaster, I'll leave that to someone who designs toasters.
|
7LimitJI
166 posts
May 27, 2010
3:16 AM
|
@ nasty
"i would realy be scratching my arse thinking how could you know what a Harp Player wants,"
You asked this and I answered it above.
If you go to a good amp builder and tell him what you want from an amp, he can re-voice it.Within reason!!
You cannot do this yourself,then
"You should and not be a lazy wacker:)" ;o)
All tube amps work on the same principals and are built mostly in the same way.Its not rocket science.
They are easy to modify.
There is lots of info on the net regarding this and our own resident expert 5F6H is always willing to help :o)
Most of the writing on this forum about Mission , has nothing to do with Bruce Collins and the actual amp, but more to do with Rick's rhetoric and sales pitches.
They say all publicity is good publicity, but in this case I'm beginning to wonder ???
----------
Those Dangerous Gentlemens Myspace
Due to cutbacks,the light at the end of the tunnel has been switched off.
|
Nastyolddog
795 posts
May 27, 2010
8:22 AM
|
Bro's you could of just said no he don't play harp:)
I'm sure Bruce Collins is a nice man and I'm not wishing to cast doubt upon his reputation as a builder:)
i know he has to shift his unwanted parts in some form or manner why not make a amp:)
the spare parts bin comment was deliberat sacasam:)
But Iv'e always been a inquizative basterd and it hard for me to get my head around the fact if,
a person works in an industry for many years why they haven't taken the time to at least learn the basics of there chosen feild:)
at least get some ground base knowlage of the instruments to be used to build your Product:)
So Bro's that just me I'm not going to suck ass all night I'm not Bagging your Bro good luck to him i hope this amp does him proud:)
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////
Next Question!!!!Hay Greg is there a Harp Builder
that don't play Harp?
does he sound like a used car sales man comes bursting through MBH doors with danceing girls a big brass band?
saying have i got a deal for you every time someone mentions they might want to buy a Harp mic?
whats he play Guitar or somthin?
|
5F6H
157 posts
May 27, 2010
8:40 AM
|
"But Iv'e always been a inquizative basterd and it hard for me to get my head around the fact if,
a person works in an industry for many years why they haven't taken the time to at least learn the basics of there chosen feild:)" Well, sometimes it's handy and sometimes not necessary...Leo Fender didn't play anything. He developed amps based on his intuition, lots of experimentation & customer feedback. Really, it's down to the musician who wants to develop an instrument to describe what they want, then for the tech to make it happen (the players "industry" is performing, the tech's is perfecting the tools to allow that)...of course, if the tech & the musician are the same guy it eliminates a link in the chain, but if the player/developer is limited in their playing ability, or likes a very specific sound, it doesn't necessarily mean a great product will come out of it.
Everett Hull, who founded Ampeg, was a keen accordian player...all his amps had to be acceptable for that purpose...some blame that fact for Ampeg getting left behind in the 60's push for higher gain guitar amps!
Think of it this way...when you fly off on holiday, who do you want at the joystick...a pilot, or a draughtsman that draws aeroplanes, or the guy that bolts them together!
"Next Question!!!!Hay Greg is there a Harp Builder
that don't play Harp?!" - Antony Dannecker.
|
Nastyolddog
797 posts
May 27, 2010
8:46 AM
|
Antony Dannecker. Don't know him either link please:)
|
5F6H
158 posts
May 27, 2010
9:05 AM
|
@ Nasty - "Antony Dannecker. Don't know him either link please:)" That's odd...he speaks very highly of you?
Son of Willi Dannecker, who used to look after Larry Adler's harps, as did Antony before Larry passed. Don't you have search engines in OZ?
|
Harpaholic
144 posts
May 27, 2010
10:02 AM
|
Keith Robb doesn't play harp!
Keith was the designer, and builder of the SJ 410, and designer and prototype builder of the Cruncher. He's been a amp tech for over forty years. The SJ amps he designed were built according to what Gary wanted, he listened!
He has modded over 30 amps of mine for harp. I don't usually tell him what I want, unless it's a extra mod, like a line out, or speaker output jack, or power cut switch, etc:
He just knows what to do to get the best out of any amp for harp.
He's learned from listening, not playing!
Last Edited by on May 27, 2010 10:07 AM
|
tmf714
120 posts
May 27, 2010
12:20 PM
|
In moto gp,the techs and engineers give the riders what they THINK they need-then,everybody still gets hammered by Valentino Rossi-it's mostly the rider,the bikes are very similar.
As far as automobiles go-the average person does not have the tools,know-how or diagnostic computers to tune the cars correctly,so they take it to someone who specializes in that field. That's why me and my friend took his Z0-6 to Reeves Calloway for some massaging-190 mph just was not cutting it. Reeves is a friend of mine from the early 80's.
The same holds true for custom amps-any tech may be able to give you what he THINK's you need-but only a true harp player has the final word-just like Sonnny does with all his amps,and Rod Piazza with the HarpKing,and Kim Wilson did with the Meteor.
Last Edited by on May 27, 2010 12:23 PM
|
Nastyolddog
799 posts
May 27, 2010
7:29 PM
|
@ Nasty - "Antony Dannecker. Don't know him either link please:)" That's odd...he speaks very highly of you?
COOL
Son of Willi Dannecker? WHO:)
who used to look after Larry Adler's?
Larry Who?
Still scratchin my arse:)
we got Hasrry Who Down here but he makes cloths and is a part time comedian:)
Don't you have search engines in OZ?
i tell you what we do have Down here big mouth:)
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
:):):):):):):)Calm dowm Bro:)
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?a very wacky sense of humor it been great tugging you chain twisting your Brain mate:)
thanks for putting me on to Athony:)
there some very classy looking Harmonicas
why haven't his Custom Harps been introduced to the Forum befor:)
But you shure he don't play Harp he endorses Hohners
surely he has played Harp at some time he's probaly a closet Harmonica Player:)
Don't you have search engines in OZ?
Piss myself laughin:)
Bro i got one in my car :) :p
Good onya Bro's and i do find your informatiom most helpful at times:)
I'm out of this one Nastolddog Tongue Blocking Nazi:)
TB OR DIE SAY AYYYY!!!!
Last Edited by on May 28, 2010 1:12 AM
|
htownfess
104 posts
May 28, 2010
2:42 AM
|
Wow, what a lot of questions. Or question marks, anyway. Kinda impassioned, that seems to be OK around here :-). Ciao, Nasty; try to piss someone else laughing, as pissing oneself feels warm but takes some cleaning up.
To perhaps get rid of the digressive/pissy tendencies of the racing analogy, I have to point out that nowadays riders/drivers reach the top level partly on their ability to discern and articulate what's going on with the vehicle, so that the mechanics and engineers can make needed changes for better performance. Read the interviews: That comes with the job these days.
That puts us back at the combination of harp player/consultant working with a non-harp-playing amp builder. The result is going to reflect how well they communicate, and embody the preferences of the player. The only inherent drawback is inefficiency in development, as others have noted. I've worked up guitar amps without playing guitar (bad elbow), and it takes longer, but you can still get there. In itself, it's a non-issue, except if there's a price savings possible due to the player/designer/builder doing the development and assembly themselves. That part I don't know about, where boutique harp amps are concerned.
If people are skeptical about a new harp amp because of who the primary player/consultant seems to be, well, they can play the amp and decide whether their skepticism was justified. The proof of the pudding remains in the eating.
Something that puzzles me about the Mission amp hype is that Rick Davis keeps talking about how he helped develop the amp and all, but I searched all over the Net and there's no proof of him playing it--no videos, no audio, nothing in the newspaper archives, nada. One looks and listens in vain: nothing out there but other people playing the amp. Yeah, Bruce Collins says Rick came by the shop a lot, but Bruce is awfully vague about the dates and times. You know, on the Web anybody can claim they played an amp, or used to play with somebody famous a long time ago, without giving evidence, and I thought we were supposed to be skeptical of such claims. You know, speaking as a humble consumer advocate and all that.
;-)
|
Post a Message
|
