|
Dirty-South Blues Harp forum: wail on! >
UPDATE: The Mission Chicago Harp Amp
UPDATE: The Mission Chicago Harp Amp
Page:
1
Rick Davis
399 posts
May 13, 2010
7:33 AM
|
The new Mission Chicago Harp Amp is about to ship. To all of you who have placed orders for the amp, Bruce Collins thanks you for your confidence and patience. Your fantastic new harp amp will be arriving on your doorstep soon.
Most vintage style combo amps, including the Mission Chicago and other familiar harp amps, have two bolts on the top of the amp that secure the chassis to the underside of the top of the cabinet. The transformers hang off the side of the chassis, toward the front of the amp. Since the production version of the Chicago amp uses massive transformers, Bruce Collins decided weeks ago that the amp must have a brace to prevent the torsional stress of the heavy transformers from acting upon the chassis mounting points. This is particularly important for customers whose amps will be shipped overseas. It can be a rough trip, and you don’t want your amp in pieces when it arrives.
The fabricator has experienced delays. The stainless steel braces have been cut but not yet bent. The braces will be finished in a few days and the amps will begin to ship.
The picture above is of the prototype amp without the brace. There will be a third chassis-mounting bolt visible on the top left side of the amp. Some amp makers rely only on the two bolts at the ends of the chassis, but that is an invitation for future problems with your amp. When you are thinking of laying out your hard-earned cash for an amp, always look for this third bolt in the top or side of the amp cabinet.
This prototype amp also lacks the professional inking of the heavy chrome production chassis, and the switching hardware will be slightly different. In this photo you see labels from early design testing. You also are looking at an amp I have gigged hard.
Here is another feature of the Mission Chicago amp that you should be aware of: The eyelet board upon which the circuit is mounted is hand-fabricated from a fiber-reinforced polymer sheet. Vintage tube amps used a composite eyelet board that buckled when exposed to moisture. Anybody who has spent time with old tube amps has seen these buckled circuit boards, and the problems they cause such as noisy cracked solders. In fact, some makers of expensive amps use un-dyed versions of the same old composite boards, another invitation to future problems. The circuit boards in the Mission Chicago amps are impervious to moisture and heat.
The Mission Chicago Amp is offered for only $999 for a limited time. 32 watts of outstanding vintage tone in a 34-pound package. Loud enough to do battle at a blues jam without any PA support. Two Amps in One: It is switchable from Fixed Bias to Cathode Biased. DEEP switch for fatter tone. Details and videos are at www.missionharpamps.com.
----------
-Rick Davis
Blues Harp Amps Blog
Roadhouse Joe Blues Band
Last Edited by on May 13, 2010 7:39 AM
|
Joe_L
246 posts
May 13, 2010
8:25 AM
|
Rick - No sarcasm intended here.
Considering you have no vested interest in Mission Amps, you may want to consider putting your marketing techniques to use at a non-profit organization. I'm sure that some of them could use the assistance.
|
Rick Davis
405 posts
May 15, 2010
10:08 AM
|
Joe, I don't understand your point.
These threads have generated a ton of email inquries about the amp. They've also driven traffic to the website: www.missionharpamps.com
No matter where you go there will be a small noisy cadre of people who object to your product, especially if it takes on the market leaders. If every new product gave up because of these screechy attacks there would never be any innovation in anything.
The Mission Chicago amp is an excellent product for less money. It compete on features, price, and consumer taste. It will do very well. Thanks for you comments.
----------
-Rick Davis
Blues Harp Amps Blog
Roadhouse Joe Blues Band
|
JDH
79 posts
May 15, 2010
10:28 AM
|
Rick, I never read any objections to the product in any of these threads. The amp may well be a real winner, I think most of us are hoping it is. There is always a market for economical solutions if they perform.
I can only speak for myself, but as being one of the "screachers" my only objections were to your presentation and lack of willingness to reason logically, and present things in what I consider a fair light. Right or wrong that's my opinion and NOT A CHALLENGE.
So here you have my public apology for anything I may have said that cast a negative view of the amp. It seems many of us will need convincing that a single 12" speaker amp can do the same job as a larger amp with multiple speakers. The proof will be in the pudding as they say, arguing over it gets us nowhere, although it seems to entertain some.
That's great that amps are shipping, we'll be hearing feedback from the new owners soon, I'm sure. JD
Last Edited by on May 15, 2010 10:30 AM
|
Ev630
436 posts
May 15, 2010
10:47 AM
|
Yes, I agree.
Hey Rick, did you see I sent you that link to a Beaufort for a grand? Treat yourself!
|
Rick Davis
407 posts
May 15, 2010
10:54 AM
|
JDH, thank you for your thoughtful post.
For many players the smaller powerful amp is exactly what they have been looking for. For others, only the big amps will do. If you look at the harp amp cottage industry you see movement toward smaller giggable amps to respond to this shift in consumer taste.
As for my "lack of willingness to reason logically..." Um... perhaps I just came to different conclusions than you?
----------
-Rick Davis
Blues Harp Amps Blog
Roadhouse Joe Blues Band
|
Rick Davis
408 posts
May 15, 2010
10:56 AM
|
EV, no I didn't get it. Why is it selling so cheap?
----------
-Rick Davis
Blues Harp Amps Blog
Roadhouse Joe Blues Band
|
Ev630
437 posts
May 15, 2010
11:06 AM
|
No reverb, no attenuator, Weber instead of Celestion Blue. Probably the basic model with a non-Clark cab. But priced right!
|
Rick Davis
409 posts
May 15, 2010
11:11 AM
|
EV, sounds like a standard $2250 Beaufort with a Weber. I don't see anything on the Clark website about this. The Weber is about $150 less than the Celestion Blue. So, why so cheap? Is this a used amp?
----------
-Rick Davis
Blues Harp Amps Blog
Roadhouse Joe Blues Band
Last Edited by on May 15, 2010 11:19 AM
|
JDH
81 posts
May 15, 2010
11:11 AM
|
Yeah, you know Micheal sells those chassis on Ebay for around $500, frequently. Pretty sweet deal for such a fine amp. JD
|
Ev630
438 posts
May 15, 2010
11:17 AM
|
The standard has a Blue.
Bear in mind, Rick - the amp is 2nd hand, as you would know if you went to the link I posted. Who knows how old it is. I also understand your country is in a dire economic state. Sadly, a good time to buy amps on the 2nd hand market.
|
Rick Davis
410 posts
May 15, 2010
11:17 AM
|
I've played the Clark Beaufort. Nice amp. I prefer others, though...
This brings up an interesting topic though... Resale value of harp amps. Some harp amp makers claim their amps are investments that retain their value year after year. I haven't seen this to be the case.
So, as an amp consumer do you expect your amp to retain its resale value? Are you dissapointed when it does not?
----------
-Rick Davis
Blues Harp Amps Blog
Roadhouse Joe Blues Band
|
Joe_L
259 posts
May 15, 2010
11:19 AM
|
Rick - My comment wasn't a slam. You write well and you are passionate about the topic. You've marketed Bruce's amp without much input from him. I was impressed.
|
JDH
83 posts
May 15, 2010
11:21 AM
|
I bought a HG35 for the introductory price which I think was $1149, I sold the amp a couple of years later (about 2 mos ago) with one post on harpL in less than 24 hours for $1100. Try that witha new Fender! JD
|
Ev630
439 posts
May 15, 2010
11:21 AM
|
No and no.
But I've never lost money on reselling of an amp: SJ1, Meteor, HG DT, etc.
I made a major profit on a 63 Concert, however!
With the Clarks - I will NEVER sell the Piedmont or Penrose. That's a first, as I have owned and enjoyed dozens of amps. These amps are keepers, as is my Simmons Masco.
The Beaufort is a purchase to suit my current requirements, so I may sell it when I get back to Oz. But I'll let you know once I've played it.
|
Rick Davis
411 posts
May 15, 2010
11:25 AM
|
JDH, how did you like the HG35?
----------
-Rick Davis
Blues Harp Amps Blog
Roadhouse Joe Blues Band
|
Ev630
440 posts
May 15, 2010
11:28 AM
|
Wasn't a patch on the Piedmont, eh James?
|
Rick Davis
412 posts
May 15, 2010
11:28 AM
|
If you watch eBay auctions for expensive boutique harp amps, you see they typically lose a significant amount of value when first re-sold, and then stabilize after that if well maintained.
----------
-Rick Davis
Blues Harp Amps Blog
Roadhouse Joe Blues Band
|
JDH
84 posts
May 15, 2010
11:45 AM
|
It was beautifully built, loud and relatively feedback resistant. It sounded like most new amps sound to me, a little too new. I had it two years, gigged with it twice, just didn't think I would ever play it much. I own 30 or 40 vintage amps, I have no major dislikes for the amp, just so many amps I like more. I'm sure the HarpKings, Super Sonny's, Avengers and Crunchers are great amps, I just don't have the need. I don't play a lot anymore either. Only if I think it's really going to be fun. I guess if I had been a pro, you could say I'm retired. I'm beginning to have some physical limitations that come with age.
The only new amp I've played through in the past 30 years that really impresses me is my Clark.
I bought one of my super reverbs new in 1966, it impressed me then, and it still is the best guitar amp there is for a guy like me. My opinion is there just aren't any new amps that sound as good as the really good old ones.
That's why I sold the HarpGear.
Last Edited by on May 16, 2010 7:39 PM
|
Rick Davis
414 posts
May 15, 2010
11:58 AM
|
Wow, JDH, that's a lotta amps!
I like the HG35. In fact, I'm impressed with all the HarpGear amps except the Rock Bottom. I think the HG2 is a great harp amp.
The best true vintage amp I've ever played was a 1959 Fender narrow panel Pro. In my blog I posted a story about playing a 58 Fender 5E3 and a 58 Gibson GA-6 side-by-side. The Gibson was MUCH better sounding. It blew the tweed Deluxe away. My list of favorites would also include my 1953 Masco ME-18.
----------
-Rick Davis
Blues Harp Amps Blog
Roadhouse Joe Blues Band
|
JDH
86 posts
May 15, 2010
12:22 PM
|
Yeah, love my Masco's, I should send you a picture of my 40's MA's. I have a couple of Gibson's that are great amps for harp or guitar. A GA-30 and a GA-5 skylark which is almost exactly the same circuit as a narrow panel tweed champ. I have a pal that has an early GA-6 with an octal input tube, maybe a 6SL7, don't recall, it's also grid leak biased I believe. I have played harp through it, it is a wonderful harp amp. The reason those amps are better harp amps than say a 5E3, is the MAJOR difference in the pre amps. If you don't mind me saying, I think you are kind of comparing apples to tomatoes there. A fairer comparison would be a earlier Fender Deluxe with a similar pre amp to the Gibson, I think then you would find they are both in there own ways great harp amps. I had a 5C3 that was the sweetest toned little harp amp I had at that time, but not an amp I liked to play guitar through at all. Where my slightly modded Mission 5E3 is a great guitar amp, but a bright, stiff feedback monster when you plug a mic in.
Or you could compare a Gibson GA-6 Lancer and find that it has the same issues you find with a 5E3.
The amps are just the tip of the iceberg Rick, I have guitars, hammond organs, slingerland and Ludwig drums, 100's of mics, PA and recording gear (tape and tube) I'm just a very sick man. JD
Last Edited by on May 15, 2010 12:23 PM
|
Rick Davis
416 posts
May 15, 2010
1:03 PM
|
Yep, I've tried Bruce's 5E3 amps with harp. My impression was the same as yours. They are guitar amps, not harp amps.
I'm puzzled why you and others here think comparisons should only be done between substantially identical amps. The Gibson and Fender I compared are both from 1958 with 2x6V6 tubes and a 12-inch Jensen speaker. I think it is interesting to see how the circuit differences manifest themselves tonally. In the blog post I pointed out the differing design philosophies.
Yes, you have way too much stuff! I'm going through a phase where I've thinned the heard a lot (but I never had anything like your collection, at least not all at once.) Now I have 4 harp amps, PA and recording gear, and a zillion odd tubes, harps, cables, and general junk.
----------
-Rick Davis
Blues Harp Amps Blog
Roadhouse Joe Blues Band
|
JDH
88 posts
May 15, 2010
1:31 PM
|
Well it's OK to compare a 5E3 to a GA-6, but you aren't comparing Gibson to Fender so much as you are comparing a great harp amp circuit (lower pre-amp gain) to a great guitar circuit, (higher gain). That is pretty old news to most of us that have been around. But maybe it is interesting to someone newer to amps, which I'm sure many of your readers probably are. I guess I liken it to comparing a ski boat to a house boat, they are just so obviously different I see no point. Where if the circuits are similar, you get the contrast of how Fender did things in comparison to how Gibson did things. (construction, pt to pt versus eyelet board, parts used, speakers used, cabinet design....etc. ) Comparing a totally different circuit that only shares power and rectifier tubes doesn't really tell me much. We already knew they were totally different animals.
I could do that comparison and raise you one, I'll play guitar through the 5E3 and harp through the GA-6, I'm being facious, but that's how much sense comparing those amps makes to me. There's certainly nothing WRONG with contrasting the two amps, I just don't find it interesting, where two amps with more in common, I would.
But you see, here we go again, me thinking your logic is flawed, and you will being unwilling to examine that possibility. WE already know how this goes from here, so I'm going out to mow the lawn, good day, JD
|
Rick Davis
419 posts
May 15, 2010
4:18 PM
|
Yes, those are important distinctions to make. In fact, I made them in great detail in the blog post. It sounds like you didn't read it.
Logic begins with acutally reading the arguments.
Think of the automotive press. Car magazines frequently gather together cars of a sporting nature and compare/contrast them. They all differ. That is what makes it interesting, no?
----------
-Rick Davis
Blues Harp Amps Blog
Roadhouse Joe Blues Band
|
JDH
90 posts
May 15, 2010
4:46 PM
|
Well, damn ya caught me, I don't read your blog. That's a cool little Gibson, different than either of the GA-6's I've played through. That was an interesting article, and damned if ya don't have me again, it was a Lancer, which of course I would have known had I read the article. The date of 1958, I thought was pre Lancer, I was wrong. There are some later Lancer's that wouldn't be as harp friendly, I don't believe. Sorry.
If you're planning to do more informative articles, and less info-mercials, I'll be reading you all the time. That was really well done. JD
Last Edited by on May 15, 2010 4:56 PM
|
walterharp
334 posts
May 15, 2010
4:48 PM
|
it seems to me that there is a for sale thread on this board that these promotions should be posted to. i think that straight out promotion on this board should be somehow relegated to a different level or controlled. rick seems to mean well, but his promotion of this amp seems to degenerate into bickering. even if he has no financial interest, he has some deep personal interest in making sure this is a successful product.
it seems like a great amp at a fantastic price,
rick, maybe you should just back off and let the amp do the talking, cause some perceive your posts as antagonistic.
i appreciate your point of view on amps, rick, and the blogs you have are informative and interesting. i like the fact that you are willing to take on perceptions that are incorrect, but if you do so based on this particular amp your objectivity seems questionable. it might be good to take a step back.
there are several other people on this board that sell harmonica related products or services, and they mostly tend to be pretty low key about it. this topic is getting regular bumps. compare to the bradical, the bumps came from potential customers and users, not from a promotional source.
|
Post a Message
|
