harpdude61
3 posts
Feb 09, 2010
1:38 PM
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I was a trumpet player in high school 25 years ago, so when I started harmonica 3 years ago I had a basic understanding of music theory. I have always followed several local bands, so when they found out I was learning to play, they told me to jump in whenever I was ready. I figurd my fastest way to jam with my friends was to learn simple parts and focus on learning a good tone. I was determined to get that big, open fat tone, even if I practiced nothing but whole notes..which I did and within 8 months I jammin along. Nothing fancy but they liked it.
At last March jam camp I discovered the world of overblows thru Adam Gussow. He taught a class on harp set-up and technique. One year later and I play 456 overblows on all my GMs from G to high F# I can do vibrato, bend them up, and my goal is to make the OB so "on" that you can't tell it is a OB. I also am using the 7OD on some harps and the 9OD in 3rd position.
My point is, I am damn glad I spent two years focused on tone and learning my way around the harp before I ever attempted an OB. Why would a new golfer focus on hitting a 300 yard high fade when he just started teeing it up?
I LOVE overblows and now overdraws. I do not understand the thinking of using them or not, lip purser or tongue blocker etc..etc.. I want to learn and absorb EVERYTHING this little instrument has to offer. Why limit myself?
Thanks amd this forum rocks.
"I WILL LEARN NO TECHNIQUE BEFORE IT"S TIME"
Duane "Catfish' Frye
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ZackPomerleau
708 posts
Feb 09, 2010
2:17 PM
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People are learning all of the techniques so quickly. I didn't learn any of that for about two years, and I was constantly trying to refine my bending and tone.
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conjob
5 posts
Feb 09, 2010
2:36 PM
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i've only been playing 8 months and i try to work on my overblows along with tone, bending, phrasing etc. the way i see it the earlier i learn overblows and overdraws, the more natural they will sound in my playing
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Buddha
1384 posts
Feb 09, 2010
3:04 PM
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""I WILL LEARN NO TECHNIQUE BEFORE IT"S TIME" "
Its wrong to assume the OB is a difficult technique. It's not any harder than a bend. Learn them all at the same time or best results.
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"The privilege of a lifetime is being who you are." - Joseph Campbell
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harpdude61
4 posts
Feb 09, 2010
4:44 PM
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It may be great to learn all aspects as you go, but my point was if you want to sound good, sooner with friends or whatever, focus on tone and learning simple, yet effective riffs. Master the 1-6 holes and the draw bends, learn a few riffs, and move on when you are ready. A lot of players will tell you they learned on holes 1-6 without OBs.THey learned to make good stuff come out of the harp and then worked their way into other stuff.
This way you will be ready to play good sounding stuff along with Adams jam tracks fairly soon....and every time you play for friends and family you might have a new lick, OB, split, blow bend...etc...to dazzle them with.
It is also the time to learn 1st positon as well so you can learn a few basic tunes to play for someone that might not be into blues. A lot of people like to hear familiar tunes in 1st position. 1st position also teachs you (or lets you teach yourself) how to "pick out" a song. Most of these songs are more structered than ad lib blues. Great ear training.
Just my op.
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Kyzer Sosa
116 posts
Feb 09, 2010
4:59 PM
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buddha, i think they are harder than bends. my reasoning? every OTB harp Ive ever touched could bend right out of the box... but OB's? nah...of the dozen harps i have, only a few could do it without tweaks of some kind. if i was lucky, i might get the 6 hole OB out of the box, but rarely.
by default, if i have to take it apart and change something to make a certain sound...it decreases the probability, as a beginner, that I will attempt to do so.
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Kyzer's Travels
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ZackPomerleau
711 posts
Feb 09, 2010
5:34 PM
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I think what many do is they learn to overblow and everything, and then go and play but they seriously have no tone or intonation. That is something that needs to be practiced, also.
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ElkRiverHarmonicas
377 posts
Feb 09, 2010
5:47 PM
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At age 30 or whatever, I had a tough time learning to overblow. When I was a kid, messing around on harps, I would do stuff to change tone and get right to the point where the blow reed would shut down. I taught myself to pull back. Fast forward 20 years.. It's really hard to learn how to do something you've taught yourself NOT to do.
Don't forget how hard BENDING is until you've done it.
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www.harrisonharmonicas.com
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conjob
6 posts
Feb 09, 2010
5:57 PM
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i have a couple of exercises that i do with them (a few minutes worth each day) and when i'm just playing i'll try to incorporate them. i'm by no means an expert, and i agree with kyzer i find them harder than bends because i play unmodified harps, but i dont see the distinction between overblows and other harp techniques.
i also wonder if i could just leave them alone for a few years. thats a lot of discipline.
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Buddha
1385 posts
Feb 09, 2010
6:01 PM
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I started with unmodified harps.
I teach all of my student how to OB at the same time I teach bends.
I believe it's all in your head that it's more difficult.
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"The privilege of a lifetime is being who you are." - Joseph Campbell
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jonsparrow
2186 posts
Feb 09, 2010
6:05 PM
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i kinda agree with buddah. it only took me a couple of weeks to learn to overblow an a couple of months to be able to hit them on command with no effort. i learned how to do it on a custom harp, an once i figured it out i was able to do it on stock harps too.
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Oliver
144 posts
Feb 09, 2010
6:30 PM
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I have to say that I personally find an OB to be no more difficult than a blow bend. Also, to my ears anyway, I don't find they sound harsh or really all that different from any other note I can play. Certainly they sound better than my 3 hole bends...
It's just another note. Granted they were the last notes that I was able to play, but still.
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harpdude61
5 posts
Feb 09, 2010
9:17 PM
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I still say overblows are an advanced technique and overdraws even more so. 90%+ of players will tell you the same. Hitting the OB is one thing, while using it musically is another. ..Why would you be trying to learn the William Tell Overture, when you can't play Twinkle Twinkle Little Star yet? Learn to dribble the ball first...then go for the fancy shots.
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ZackPomerleau
715 posts
Feb 09, 2010
9:41 PM
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Overblowing is bending but blowing out. What's so hard about that?
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jonsparrow
2194 posts
Feb 09, 2010
9:46 PM
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i never even tried to overdraw yet. im not even sure about how to go about doing it. dont know if i even ever heard one.
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The Gloth
216 posts
Feb 10, 2010
12:49 AM
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I messed around a little with OB, but I find it hard to get them, and harder to control and use them. And, unless you totally master it, they have a different sound from other notes. It's a little squeaky, doesn't sound really good. Now that I've tried the half-valved harp, I think I won't bother to learn OB anymore.
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apskarp
129 posts
Feb 10, 2010
2:20 AM
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I think that OB is just another technique. It really isn't harder than other types of bendings, but in order to work it has little more demands for the harp itself - the gaps need to be playable in order to make it.
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phogi
241 posts
Feb 10, 2010
2:51 AM
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It took me awhile to figure out OB's. I think the main reason is like budda says, its alot easier with someone there to coach you into the proper technique. Now that I know them, I don't consider them hard. Good intonation on drawbends is much harder, in my opinion.
Overdraws I find difficult. I think part of this is that I don't have occasion to use them much. I can get the 7 od out of most my harps, but sometimes is squawks. Can't get 9 od except on certain harps on rare occasions.
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Ryan
134 posts
Feb 10, 2010
4:09 AM
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"Good intonation on drawbends is much harder, in my opinion."
I think getting all the overblows in tune can be quite challenging as well. I think too many people tend to think that the overblows naturally come out pretty close to being in tune, and maybe need to be bent up just a bit. But really I hear many people hitting several of their overblows extremely flat.
It's important to go through EVERY key harp and practice getting all the overblows at pitch, just like with bends. For myself I notice that some holes on some harps will overblow pretty close to being in tune and are fairly easy to bend up to the correct pitch. But on other holes/keys I find that the overblows come out really flat (if your not trying to bend the note up, sometimes you'll find some OB's can be as much as 50cents flat), and I have to bend up much further. On some of those holes, I can barely even get the note up to the correct pitch unless I have the harp set up just right. But with a well set up harp it becomes much easier to get the notes bent up to where they're supposed to be(and further).
I've noticed that the pitch that the overblows come out the strongest/fullest and easiest, unfortunatley, isn't the right pitch (I'm speaking for myself, this may be different for others). I think this may be the reason why a lot of people hit the OB's flat and don't seem to realise it, because that's where the note seems to come out best. This isn't to say you can't get good tone when bending it up to pitch, it just takes more practice.
EDIT: I forgot to mention, once you've learned to bend the overblow up to the right pitch, you should be able to hit the note already bent to the right pitch. Just like a normal bend. It's not like you need to hit the note flat and then bend it up. I'm sure most all of you realise this, but I figured I should mention it just in case.
And just like with bent notes, you should practice hitting the OBs already bent up to pitch.
Last Edited by on Feb 10, 2010 1:12 PM
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Andrew
891 posts
Feb 10, 2010
9:34 AM
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Maybe it's like tennis - if you take it up young, you learn to volley, but I took it up when I was 22, and to keep up with my peers I had to try out those spin serves asap, i.e. run before I could walk, lol!
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Kinda hot in these rhinos!
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Hollistonharper
159 posts
Feb 10, 2010
7:26 PM
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I'm still a relative newbie, having been playing for 2 years and still challenged to consistently hit my draw bends. I had no interest in learning to overblow under the theory that I could spend a lifetime in 2nd position just figuring out how to get traditional techniques down. But out of curiosity I screwed around with it intermittently and hit my first 6 OB last June. Unable to actually use it in a song, I declared victory and went home. However, I was recently trying to figure out a (non-blues) song (Blackbird) and realized I needed to use the 6OB. This motivated me to really want to learn it, and I've been working on it in earnest for about a week. Tonight I opened up one of my least favorite harps--a Blues Harp in Bb--and tweaked it pretty good. I can now play it really softly, get smooth draw bends and a decent 5 and 6OB (and a squawky 4 OB). Prior to this the harp was a POS. And a half hour ago I just played Happy Birthday with the 6OB (per Chris Michalek's often published advice)!! I can foresee being able to use it in a more sophisticated song with some more practice.
So the point of my post is, yeah learn to OB, average players can learn to do it too. Like draw bends, it's really only mysterious until you learn how to do it. Then it just sort of feels normal.
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