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Dirty-South Blues Harp forum: wail on! > Do you find scales to be boring or useful?
Do you find scales to be boring or useful?
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Killa_Hertz
1432 posts
May 19, 2016
1:51 PM
Well said. What are some good ways to practice time? Metronome only seems too obvious. Surely you have some cool trick ways that can make it more fun.


(Sorry i know i should have made this a new thread)
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STME58
1710 posts
May 19, 2016
2:11 PM
Check out these tips from Victor Wooten on using a metronome. I particularly like the idea of setting the metronome to click every 5 beats in 4/4 so you can check one beat per measure and a different beat every measure.
Killa_Hertz
1443 posts
May 19, 2016
3:35 PM
Yea. Wow that's great. Great example too. I see what yall mean now. Dude is Timex. His timing was Solid.

That's the dude from the Bassoon video band. He was great in that. Imma have to go back n look them up.

That got tricky there at the end for sure. The bass is a little more subtle than a harp. I might have to run a metronome thru an amp. Or use headphones to be able to hear it. Lol. But that's good stuff. Thanks Alot, like I needed MORE stuff to work on.
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BigBlindRay
263 posts
May 20, 2016
4:16 AM
You can play music without having to learn scale, chord theory et al and get by. To a certain extent.

In much the same way you can get by knowing how to converse with people in any given language without knowing how to read or write it.
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- BigBlindRay

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dougharps
1233 posts
May 20, 2016
12:32 PM
@BigBlindRay
I like your post! I like the language metaphor. It says a lot, and the "To a certain extent" is exactly right.

With regard to using scales, I usually limit my playing to using the chromatic scale, except when I use microtones. (a joke, sort of)

Recently at a workshop Jason Ricci (who is a big advocate of playing in the minor pentatonic and major pentatonic scales most of the time, depending on the music) pointed out that in some major pentatonic songs when using speed runs I was interjecting a note from the mixolydian scale, and it sounded "jiggy" like Irish music, not really fitting the song.

He was right, I WAS doing that. I had noticed that a part of my speed runs were not exactly sounding right with the song, but had not really figured out why. My excuse to myself had been that it was a passing tone, so why worry.

Jason advised me that on major country and bluegrass songs I should stay in the major pentatonic scale EXCEPT when I wanted to use a note outside the scale SPECIFICALLY to make a statement and to emphasize the note. He demonstrated how he could use the same note, but emphasizing it. Jason had it right.

What showed me the depth of Jason's understanding of scales was that he picked this out of me playing fast at a jam and he identified it, and presented it to me in a constructively critical way.

Woodshed time...
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Doug S.
boris_plotnikov
1097 posts
May 20, 2016
1:49 PM
I LOVE playing scales along with other excercises.
It is very useful to play them in different note sequences (like leap frog or similiar) and different rhythms.

My teaching experience show that students who love excercises progress triple better than students who love melodies and other stuff.
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barbequebob
3223 posts
May 21, 2016
8:20 AM
Learning scales (along with some theory) as well as getting your time straight not only improves your playing skills, but it also improves your listeng skills as well and when you learn scales, then apply them to different positions, it forces you to get the intonation and articulation of both your bends and overblows to be 1000% more dead on accurate and so positions that fall naturally in minors can be made to play major quite easily.
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Sincerely,
Barbeque Bob Maglinte
Boston, MA
http://www.barbequebob.com
CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
hvyj
3043 posts
May 26, 2016
9:37 AM
Well, I guess if you've got a good enough ear, scales and theory aren't as important. But for the rest of us, scales tell us where the notes live and that helps us find the right notes for the tune being played.

Scales are also the the the key that unlocks the door to playing multiple positions and enables you to play in different styles by knowing what scale(s) to use to play in particular idioms and sound stylistically correct.

Scales include modes, which, of course, are diatonic. Understanding modes helps you select what position to use to be able to play the scale(s) you need. Some scales are a lot easier to play in positions other than second. Those who are addicted to playing ptimarily in second are probably playing breath patterns rather than scales or notes as such. I guess it all depends on what your objectives are....
mr_so&so
1027 posts
May 26, 2016
9:58 AM
There have been a lot of very informative posts on this thread. Thanks to all who've contributed. In my practice this past week, I've revisited the tired old blues scale in 2nd position that I thought I'd put a lock on years ago. But as I play those notes right from the bottom to the top of the harp, I find I'm breathing new life into my playing, in exactly the ways I outlined in my initial post.
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mr_so&so
barbequebob
3225 posts
May 26, 2016
10:39 AM
Look at it this way. Just on blues playing alone, if you're just playing a more downhome blues, you're mainly playing a pentatonic scale, which is a five note scale, but if you're playing blues in a much more jazzy context, you can't just play a minor 3rd in a major and you'll need to know how to use major 3rds, 6ths, and major 7ths and here's where knowing the scales come in and these different notes totally changes the complexion of what's being played, even down to just a single note.

Most of you probably don't remember anything about your pre-kindergarden, kindergarden or first or second garde years, but the teacher often had children sing do-re-me-fa-so-la-ti-do, and what they were secretly teaching you was the major diatonic scale but you weren't aware of it one bit.

For the vast majority of music being played in the last 50 years, three basic scales have been used, the major diatonic scale, the harmonic minor scale, and the melodic minor scale.
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Sincerely,
Barbeque Bob Maglinte
Boston, MA
http://www.barbequebob.com
CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
Gnarly
1820 posts
May 26, 2016
10:42 AM
I have noticed lately that a lot of popular melodies are largely pentatonic.
I'm talking about the ear candy stuff, contemporary popular music.
Most riff based melodies are pentatonic too, aren't they?
Goldbrick
1487 posts
May 26, 2016
12:34 PM
Pentatonic is pretty much the universal scale

hvyj
3044 posts
May 26, 2016
1:28 PM
In light of recent events, there have been at least a couple of YouTube vids posted with tortured sounding harmonica versions of PURPLE. RAIN. However, that tune lays out really well using a major pentatonic scale in second position, except for the closing guitar riff which employs a minor third and minor seventh. If you know the right scale to use and how to play it, some tunes almost play themselves.
BC
56 posts
May 27, 2016
6:40 PM
Perhaps a bit late to the party here, but from a recent jam experience I can attest to the importance of scales and music theory knowledge in general. A new jam started, pretty loose. I was told the first jam did not go well as they could not find common songs to play. I was like, it really doesn't matter what song you pick, I'll likely improvise anyways. The other musicians seemed to be impressed at my improvisation (and I don't consider myself to be any sort of great harp player). I traded licks with a guitarist and even hung in and laid down some slick horn lines when they were playing rock songs. They seemed equally impressed when I started spouting off music theory on scale degrees(and from a harmonica player!). I even played some bass lines for one guitarist to mimic until a bass player showed up. Then I riffed off of it. End all if I did not have the theory backing me up, I might have been pretty well useless. By bucking up and studying the so called boring stuff it paid dividends on the stage.
"Practice Hard, Play Easy"

BC


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