for me it clicked when i changed models.i played 270 super chromonicas for years,because that's what i thought george smith and of course little walter used. a friend of mine had a broken example of another model that i had no interest in,but bought just to help him out. i fixed it and holy @#$% my playing took off.now i soup up those old 270's and enjoy a little chromatic playing along with my regular diatonic playing. ----------
Most chroms are so leaky it's just hard to get any soul out of em'. Like shakey said if you get one that has been tightened up it opens up a whole new world. Also the flat truth is chroms aren't as loud. OCTAVES! You have to learn how to play octaves on the chrom!
I've had pretty good luck with Hering and more recently Suzuki. Not so leaky. It's a fact, chromatic playing is very different than diatonic, but once you work out some 3rd position stuff you will likely get hooked like I did. Wm. Clarke, George Smith, Carey Bell, and several others have informed my playing. If you want some cool new stuff for your trick bag work on 3rd with a good chro. ---------- http://www.reverbnation.com/jawboneandjolene
yes J-bone,hering does make a nice chromatic.i have some chromatics that are mixed hering and hohner parts.so fun!! ----------
Last Edited by shakeylee on Feb 14, 2015 10:36 PM
The Hohner 270 is the industry standard for chromatics. Octaves are the big thing if you want to play in the George Smith style. Also don't forget that playing octaves on the chromatic requires blocking over five holes and not four like on the diatonic. Bending notes on the chromatic is different to the diatonic and many techniques like the tongue flutter are harder to make sound effective on the chromatic. If you want to sound like Dennis Gruenling does on chromatic, then you're going to need to practice a lot and listen to horn players, not harmonica players. In fact to get good on chromatic at all, you're really better off listening to horn players and practice a lot. When you play in what diatonic players refer to as third position D, Dm on a C chrom with the button out. You need to remember that in it's simplest form holes 3, 7 & 11 on a 12 hole chromatic are your blow notes and you can use the slide pushed in (G#) here on the blow notes as well. Once you get the hang of that you should be fine and be able to progress from there.
Last Edited by Kingley on Feb 15, 2015 1:23 AM
Maybe it's time to look at the chromatic in a different way. Everyone tries to play in the old style but there is more expression there you just have to find it.
Little Walter never recorded with a 12-hole chromatic. He mostly played a 280 (16 holes) and once used a 10-hole slide harp tuned like a diatonic (the Koch 980).
Chromatic can be played just as loud as diatonic, but you need to have the right approach. Diatonic players often hit too hard when they pick up a chromatic. Unlike the diatonic, the chromatic doesn't let blow breaths leak through the draw reeds or draw breaths leak through the blow reeds. As a result, it's more sensitive to hard attacks. To play chromatic effectively, you have to learn to modulate your attacks. Once you learn to adapt, you can play hard and aggressively on chromatic. Like this:
Blue Chrome
Chromatic is not everyone's cup of tea, and if it doesn't speak to you as a player, that's OK - though I'm curious about what specifically isn't working out for harmonicanick. =========== Winslow
Chromatics are significantly different than diatonics and have to be approached with different techniques. While I often use 270 and Hering 12 holes in blues, soul, and a little jazz, I really like a 16 hole chromatic.
I find that:
1) 16 hole chromatics work really well for blues, giving you a massive sound in the lower octave, plus more room for octave and chord playing. When playing in D, third position, on the low end of a 12 hole chromatic I sometimes run out of room if I go to the 4 or 5 chord, G or A, in the bottom octave, and my octave and/or chord falls off the left end. It makes you play more at the higher end with higher notes on a 12 hole. A 4 octave chromatic gives you 3 octaves of room, a 3 octave chromatic gives you 2 octaves of room if playing octaves.
2) You cannot attack as hard, especially on single notes. If you are playing fat chords or octaves it is not as critical.
3) Bending is done differently.
I use 1st, 3rd, and 4th position more than others on chromatic.
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Doug S.
Last Edited by dougharps on Feb 15, 2015 9:20 AM
WinslowYerxa 787 posts Feb 15, 2015 8:56 AM A couple of points:
Little Walter never recorded with a 12-hole chromatic. He mostly played a 280 (16 holes) and once used a 10-hole slide harp tuned like a diatonic (the Koch 980)."
i never knew this!! i always thought LW used a 270!! ----------
Other blues greats have used the 270 to play third position in various keys on chromatic. However, Little Walter's third position work is always in D (Except one tune where he held the slide in and played in Eb) and always uses the low notes below Middle C that aren't available on a standard 270 in C. He once or twice tried playing in C on a 280 ("That's It" and Muddy's "My Eyes Keep Me in Trouble"). Also, he was photographed with a 280 but never with any other chromatic. =========== Winslow
The one exception to this general pattern is That's It from 1953, a song in the key of C. Walter plays mostly in 3rd position on a diatonic (Bb) harp, but takes a quickly aborted (after 12 bars) chromatic harp break where, in my opinion, he is using a C chromatic to try and play in 3rd position, but he is doing it with the button in. My theory is that he knew he wasn't playing in D, which is the button out key for 3rd position on a C chromatic, so he tried playing with the button in. Unfortunately for him (and for the rest of us!) the song wasn’t in Eb either, which would be the button in key for 3rd position. He doesn’t seem to realize until it is too late that he is not in the right key. I am fairly convinced that Walter was not trying to play in 1st position here (as other harp players have suggested to me), simply because I think he would have done a better job of it if that’s what he was actually doing. Note: This song, which is really great but was unreleased almost certainly for this reason, finally came out in 1995 on the Blues with a Feeling CD
First of The song "That's It" SUCKS! This song isn't worth arguing about. I only have one version and LW starts the song off playing a Bb diatonic in third position then switch's to C chromatic playing draw notes with the slide in. This is the easiest way to play C minor. All the draw notes are the minor notes of the C scale and draw 4 and 8 are C. The root note. Play this simple blues scale: blow 1 draw 1 slide in draw 2 draw 2 slide in blow 3 draw 3 slide in and draw 4 slide in or blow 4 (both notes are C) Now just hold the slide in and slide from draw 1 up to draw 5 while drawing sounding all the notes. Then go back to draw 4 the whole time keeping the slide in. THERE are no wrong notes! and it sounds good!
Interesting theory. Never thought that he might have actually WANTED to play in Eb. Yep, those draw notes may well be ok over Cm but it all sounds pretty off in the context of this C major song. Guess we will never know for sure. But I do agree that it is not his finest hour. R
dougharps makes a good point about 12 vs 16 hole harps. I have been able to justify the expense of a 12, then had to turn around and get a baritone in that key to cover low octave. In future I may have to get a 16. At present I am almost set for the keys I need the most for what we do. ---------- http://www.reverbnation.com/jawboneandjolene
if the song is in C then anything he tries to play over it is by definition in C.
Note how he hangs for long notes on C or the C-Eb combination. And he frames his range mostly in the one octave between one C and another, playing riffs that descend to and end in the lower C.
In fact, he's more or less duplicating the same notes he focuses on when he's playing diatonic - C, Eb, Gb, and C again an octave hgiher - draw notes on both instruments. It works on the diatonic and logically should work as well on the chromatic but ends up sounding weird.
The distinction between C and C minor in blues is not always cut and dried. You can play a minor note against a major chord and it's a blue note - such as the Eb (minor third) against a C major chord (C-E-G). =========== Winslow
@tmf Yeah I know it was in C major, but what I said still works because it is BLUES! I agree it sounded like he wasn't sure what he was trying to do. Again this song isn't worth wasting time over!
"if the song is in C then anything he tries to play over it is by definition in C"
Can I quote you on that ? ;-)
Of course you can play minor over major, some even play major over minor. When I played this to my pianist, the response was immediately "He's in the wrong key". Interesting in as much as the notes he is playing are "more or less" right.
As stated above, the song is not really worth getting into. It takes a Piazza to cover it.