Calvin
40 posts
Nov 05, 2014
6:16 PM
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I have a Seydel Concerto octave harp that I got a few years ago, and I've been getting into playing cajun and zydeco stuff on it lately. The Concerto sounds really good, but every once in a while it would be nice to have the draw bends on the lower holes when I isolate the top row.
My question is-- would taking the valves off of some of these holes be a relatively simple procedure (for someone without a lot of experience adjusting harps)?
Which ones would I have to remove?
I remember a few years ago, David Payne was offering "bluesified" octave harps that (I believe) were pretty much what I am describing. I am under the impression that he is no longer in the business.
Any suggestions are appreciated!
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Mahcks
16 posts
Nov 06, 2014
5:59 AM
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My Hohner auto valve is half valved. If I was going to do it again, I'd half valve the top octave plate and leave the lower one fully valved. As for which ones to remove, I'd start searching for forum posts and videos about half valving.
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GMaj7
540 posts
Nov 06, 2014
8:46 AM
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You may remove the wind savers from the exposed row top/bottom very simply. There are advantages to removal, namely, wind saver problems are less prevalent the fewer that are on there.
Some will play just fine but others will not. It depends on the key/pitch. It is important to note that in an octave harp you are moving 2 reeds at once. Additionally, you are losing air out of the 2 non-sounding reeds. Wind savers cut down on this air loss so removing them will cause an increase. The best way to handle this is to start at hole 6 and remove that wind saver and try it out, then go to hole 5, etc. Stop when it becomes too leaky.
I agree with the advice on leaving the lower pitched octave played fully valved.
My web site has detailed discussion on wind savers and half-valving.
It is important to note that if you start executing bends on your Concerto, you will significantly reduce reed life.
I am able to repair the Concerto but the nature of octave harps requires some extremely fragile and unstable reeds be used. Bending will damage them quickly and repair is not easy/costly.
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Greg Jones
Seydel U.S. Tech
greg@1623customharmonicas.com
1623customharmonicas.com
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WinslowYerxa
712 posts
Nov 06, 2014
10:06 AM
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Greg -
Why would bending be more harmful to octave harps than other harps? I have a Hohner Auto-Valve that I de-valved 40 years ago and has never had a reed problem. Admittedly, I don't play it a lot.
On the other hand, I have a Concerto in C that I used to demonstrate what an octave harp sounds like for the new edition of Harmonica For Dummies, with no bending, and one reed died very quickly. (I have other Concertos that I've played heavily with no reed problems, though).
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Winslow
SPAH connects the world of harmonica
Deepen your playing at the Harmonica Collective
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Mahcks
17 posts
Nov 06, 2014
12:08 PM
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Greg, I was reading your article about mounting auto valve plates on a 260 comb. Was there a reason for not including the slide? Sorry if I'm traipsing too far from the topic.
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GMaj7
541 posts
Nov 06, 2014
1:09 PM
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Winslow,
Great question.
Octave harps are engineering nightmares. Essentially you have 2 reeds that are an octave apart and each is close to the outside of its functional pitch range. The low side is weighed at the end and thin at the base and the high side is heavy at bottom and thin at end. You have structurally week reeds that are very fragile.
The reeds on the Concertos currently out in circulation are just very sensitive. Seydel is improving the reeds on the Concertos and eventually, they will have some stronger ones out there but for those out there now, treat them gently. It is true the Auto Valves have some hardy reeds on them and I have several myself.
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Greg Jones
Seydel U.S. Tech
1623customharmonicas.com
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GMaj7
542 posts
Nov 06, 2014
1:13 PM
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Mahcks,
The custom Auto Valves featured on my web site are a design that Rick Epping uses.
The slide mechanism has to be removed because in an octave harp, you have a reed on top and a reed on bottom that have to speak. If we did not remove the slide, either the top or bottom would be isolated. By removing the slide, the entire chamber is open and reeds sound simultaneously.
BTW - Winslow, contact me off forum and I'll fix your Concerto for you.
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Greg Jones
Seydel U.S. Tech
greg@1623customharmonicas.com
1623customharmonicas.com
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Calvin
41 posts
Nov 06, 2014
2:53 PM
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Thanks for all the info, everyone. I had considered that perhaps bending wouldn't be good for the Concerto reeds.
There is already a draw reed on the Concerto that has given out. Maybe once a few more go I'll experiment...
Greg, you mention that half-valved playability can depend on the key/pitch. Mine's a C...
Also checked out your website and like the looks of your customized Auto-valve. Ihad no idea that Hohner stopped making Auto-Valves. I have one in C, and really like the sound, but the unsealed comb swells up and is brutal on the lips.
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GMaj7
543 posts
Nov 06, 2014
4:58 PM
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Calvin,
I think a (C) harp is at the higher end of the range of octaves so it is likely yours would play fairly well half-valved.
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Greg Jones
Seydel U.S. Tech
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