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Dirty-South Blues Harp forum: wail on! >
taking music seriously
taking music seriously
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kudzurunner
4844 posts
Aug 06, 2014
5:29 AM
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In some ways this is a semi-OT thread, but given several recent discussions here, I think it deserves our attention.
Earlier this week, The New Yorker (I'm a subscriber) featured a column, "In His Own Words," in which Sonny Rollins essentially said that his life as a jazzman was a mistake. Although it now begins with an italicized editorial note saying "this article...is a work of satire," that note was not part of the original article:
http://www.newyorker.com/humor/daily-shouts/sonny-rollins-words
A lot of us assumed that it was, in fact, Rollins's own words, and were dismayed, confused, and saddened. Jazz journalists and bloggers went nuts. Finally, Sonny himself took to the web in a half-hour broadcast in which he set the record straight:
Here's a story about the dust-up:
http://www.laweekly.com/westcoastsound/2014/08/05/sonny-rollins-fans-go-ballistic-about-new-yorker-article
The underlying questions are profound. When are satire, and comedy, important and needed things that contribute to spiritual and social vitality, and when do they become toxic? Has technology made it easier to confuse reality with falsity? Isn't jazz grounded in play--humor--and if so, why should jazz, and jazz people, object to being mocked?
I'm most struck by the first 7 minutes of Sonny's broadcast, in which he describe how he went from thinking the piece was OK to deciding that it was toxic and needed to be answered.
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JustFuya
371 posts
Aug 06, 2014
6:46 AM
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I expect satire in the Onion, not in the New Yorker. In the context of the Onion I find the article humorous. Looks like it was a slow day for originality at the New Yorker while the content editor was on vacation.
I love that Sonny subscribes to Mad Magazine. The other day, after reading through some recent threads on this forum, I wondered if Mad Magazine was still being published. There is a lot of room for humor if it is framed properly and doesn't upset the masses.
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Tuckster
1448 posts
Aug 06, 2014
9:34 AM
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I thought the article was a heavy handed and not particularly clever bit of satire. Maybe some jazz fans don't have a sense of humor. I would think that jazz musicians saw it for what it was.
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Frank
5056 posts
Aug 06, 2014
10:15 AM
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Obviously, that was hilarious "to me" ...
I laughed harder with each paragraph :)
Having Sonny's name and picture in the article made it that much more funny - 100 fold!!!!!
Comedy is that way...
It hurts :(
I started playing the saxophone when I was thirteen years old. There were some other kids on my block who had taken it up, and I thought that it might be fun. I later learned that these guys’ parents had forced them into it.
The saxophone sounds horrible. Like a scared pig. I never learned the names of most of the other instruments, but they all sound awful, too. Drums are O.K., because sometimes they’ll drown out the other stuff, but it’s all pretty bad.
Jazz might be the stupidest thing anyone ever came up with. The band starts a song, but then everything falls apart and the musicians just play whatever they want for as long they can stand it. People take turns noodling around, and once they run out of ideas and have to stop, the audience claps. I’m getting angry just thinking about it.
Sometimes we would run through the same song over and over again to see if anybody noticed. If someone did, I don’t care.
There was this one time, in 1953 or 1954, when a few guys and I had just finished our last set at Club Carousel, and we were about to pack it in when in walked Bud Powell and Charlie Parker. We must have jammed together for five more hours, right through sunrise. That was the worst day of my life.
We always dressed real sharp: pin-stripe suits, porkpie hats, silk ties. As if to conceal the fact that we were spending all our time playing jazz in some basement.
I remember Dexter Gordon was doing a gig at the 3 Deuces, and at one point he leaned into the microphone and said, “I could sell this suit and this saxophone and get far away from here.” The crowd laughed.
I really don’t know why I keep doing this. Inertia, I guess. Once you get stuck in a rut, it’s difficult to pull yourself out, even if you hate every minute of it. Maybe I’m just a coward.
If I could do it all over again, I’d probably be an accountant or a process server. They make good money.
Once I played the Montreux Jazz Festival, in Switzerland, with Miles Davis. I walked in on him smoking cigarettes and staring at his horn for what must have been fifteen minutes, like it was a poisonous snake and he wasn’t sure if it was dead. Finally Miles stood up, turned to his band, and said, “All right, let’s get through this, and then we’ll go to the airport.” He looked like he was about to cry.
I released fifty-odd albums, wrote hundreds of songs, and played on God knows how many session dates. Some of my recordings are in the Library of Congress. That’s idiotic. They ought to burn that building to the ground. I hate music. I wasted my life.
Django Gold is a senior writer for The Onion.
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Honkin On Bobo
1225 posts
Aug 06, 2014
10:44 AM
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I found it funny.
But the first thing that jumps out at me is that a large number of Jazz/Rollins fans thought it was the real deal? Hey, I got some beachfront property in Kansas.....
I know hindsight is 20/20 but really? I'm not a Jazz/rollins fan but I tried to put myself in their shoes. I'm a HUGE classic rock fan and I subscribe to Rolling Stone. If an open letter appeared in there from say, Keith Richards, saying:
"I hated being a rock and roller, it's a stupid form of music. So is the blues, christ a 5 year old could play that crap. I once spoke with L:ennon outside a London club and he said to me "this is all bullshit, why in the world would anyone electrify a guitar, I'd like to stab Les Paul in the throat."
My FIRST thought would be OK, where's the camera? What is this, the literary version of Punk'd? I'd then let the dust settle for a while before I even considered it might be true. The above goes tenfold if I'd read this online somewhere as opposed to my actual physical copy of RS.
I laughed twice.....once at the satirical piece....and the second time at the jazz "bloggers" going apoplectic.
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jnorem
492 posts
Aug 06, 2014
4:07 PM
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I just can't see how anyone could think this was real. It isn't even the way Sonny Rollins really talks.
Then again, I'm occasionally an idiot. I say absolutely bizarre things on this forum sometimes--things that no person with half a brain would take seriously--and some f'tards take me seriously.
Why? I don't get it. Is it the drugs, Frank? Is that what makes you write the crap that YOU write?
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Call me J
Last Edited by Guest on Aug 06, 2014 4:19 PM
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kudzurunner
4846 posts
Aug 06, 2014
4:22 PM
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Ah: "guest." Does that mean that somebody put words into your mouth, J? But everybody realizes that it's just satire. I'm glad you're not disturbed!
Hah hah hahhah ahahaaha!!!
{not Kudz]
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kudzurunner
4848 posts
Aug 06, 2014
4:36 PM
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Whoa whoa whoa, everybody! J, you can't use language like that and remain within the almighty forum guidelines. I am the great Gussow and I proclaim that.
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Gussow
1 post
Aug 06, 2014
4:44 PM
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Speaking personally, I feel violated when somebody puts words into MY mouth. But I am a jazz man.
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Gussow
2 posts
Aug 06, 2014
5:59 PM
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“I just can't see how anyone could think this was real. It isn't even the way Sonny Rollins really talks.”
Satire is a troubling thing, isn’t it? Readers of a piece intended as satire don’t always get the point, and the person being satirized—the person who is having words they didn’t speak put in their mouth, against their will—may well not like it at all.
Welcome to the club, J.
I trust that everybody on this forum, reading Jnorems weird post above, has figured out what Jnorem insists the readers of the New Yorker piece figured out about the Sonny Rollins piece: some of the “in his own words” aren’t his words. They’re words that somebody else put in his mouth.
I completely understand why J wrote to me and complained. It’s just no fun—it’s profoundly disturbing, in fact—when somebody puts words in your mouth, especially when they own the shop and have the power to convince others that you said things that you plainly didn’t say.
Of course, everybody on this forum figured out right away that J hadn’t lost his mind or used uncharacteristic language. Right? You all figured that out. I’m sure you did.
I violated J’s integrity to make a point: satire is a double-edged sword. It’s not always obvious when satire is in effect—even J wasn’t quite sure what was going on here, to judge from his email to me—and the person being satirized feels that something unfair has been perpetrated.
My apologies, J. I did it to make a point. This is the first time that I have ever put words into another forum member's mouth, and it will be the last.
Speak truth, Sonny!
Last Edited by Gussow on Aug 06, 2014 6:00 PM
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