Charles.Doughty
40 posts
May 12, 2014
12:47 PM
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We just added a saxophone to the group and my harp was totally getting drowned out at the last gig. First set I just lived with it and second set I added a line out. We kept bumping up the level on my harp throughout the night because I was still getting drowned out. Anyone have an y suggestions on how to set the levels right at the beginning of the night so this doesn't happen the next time? We play a lot of bars and clubs and run our own sound. Never had the problem with a gig with a sound guy although I have had to learn to ask for my levels to match the guitar. We are a mostly jump blues outfit and I'm usually blowing horn lines when I'm not singing. Share some tricks if you have them. Thanks!
Chuck D.
Www.facebook.com/thegethotband
Last Edited by Charles.Doughty on May 12, 2014 12:48 PM
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barbequebob
2553 posts
May 12, 2014
12:56 PM
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What's the overall level for the entire band in the monitors??? Why? If everything is getting miked up, the monitor level can be too loud to begin with.
One other thing to remember, from personal experience, the level you hear on the bandstand, based on room acoustics, can often be FAR different than what the audience actually hears and there have been gigs I've done where on the bandstand I felt drowned out, but when walking into the audience using a wireless setup, I had been shocked to hear that I was actually much louder than everyone else and that's no BS.
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Sincerely,
Barbeque Bob Maglinte
Boston, MA
http://www.barbequebob.com
CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
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Charles.Doughty
41 posts
May 12, 2014
1:05 PM
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The monitors are pretty much set up for vocals , at least at the last gig . Guitar had no need for monitor. Just me on vocals/ harp and sax. Sax is direct to the pa of course.
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Greg Heumann
2719 posts
May 12, 2014
2:32 PM
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Bob's comments are right on the money. The sax player needs to hear him/herself in the monitors. What you perceived as being drowned out may not have been so out front. The best way to know when you do your own sound? Go wireless. Walk out front and hear for yourself how it sounds out there. The sax can go wireless too. (I do.)
Levels change during a show. If you have a volume control on your harp mic you can always setup to leave yourself a little headroom and turn up if necessary.
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***************************************************
/Greg
BlowsMeAway Productions
See my Customer Mics album on Facebook
Bluestate on iTunes
Last Edited by Greg Heumann on May 12, 2014 2:32 PM
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The Iceman
1649 posts
May 12, 2014
2:49 PM
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This problem can be eliminated by buying 2 Bose L2 systems for pa for the band. Bose is placed behind the band. What you hear on stage is exactly what the audience hears. When a band gets used to them, they usually play at a lower volume on stage.
They eliminate having to use monitors.
Pricey, but worth it.
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The Iceman
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Charles.Doughty
42 posts
May 14, 2014
12:31 PM
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Last show we had one monitor. I was out in front if the pa speakers so I could hear both the speakers and the monitor. Is there a trick to matching the harp and sax volumes. Sax is a bit deeper of an instrument but I'd like to get the levels right next time. Sax was next to one of the pa speakers and was not using the monitor at all. Only for vocals. This bar is kind of a glorified closet but they pay well and it gets really packed.
Last Edited by Charles.Doughty on May 14, 2014 12:33 PM
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Littoral
1077 posts
May 15, 2014
8:46 AM
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Iceman: A friend of mine is in a group that uses the Bose L2 systems for pa and it really does work great. It solves a lot of problems.
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Greg Heumann
2722 posts
May 15, 2014
8:52 AM
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Is there a trick? No! You're there, you're in front of the speakers - I don't understand why setting the levels on the PA until they're where you want them isn't enough? Maybe I don't understand your question.
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***************************************************
/Greg
BlowsMeAway Productions
See my Customer Mics album on Facebook
Bluestate on iTunes
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S-harp
210 posts
May 15, 2014
11:41 AM
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Is there a trick? Well, no ... set the levels straight and go. We start with the stage first ... so it sounds ok on stage, keeping the volume down ... then we set the PA. At smaller gigs the floor gets a mix of stage sound and PA and at even smaller gigs its just stage sound except singing.
Sax and harp can sound about the same ... they can share the same eq so to speak, as slide guitar and harp also can do sometimes. This makes it a question of what and when you play ... together in horn lines works excellent and is great fun. Playing over each other doesn't always work that great.
So maybe it isn't about volume, perhaps it's about separating your playing at times, and joining up in horn lines.
But I hear you ... sax can be loud as hell ,,, it easily fills the room without PA by it self at smaller gigs.
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The tone, the tone ... and the Tone
Last Edited by S-harp on May 15, 2014 11:44 AM
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barbequebob
2558 posts
May 16, 2014
12:55 PM
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@Charles Doughty -- Part of your problem here is your own inexperience working with horns and horns unamplified are going to be putting out more volume than an unamplified harmonica in a heart beat. You are gonna need to start woodshedding personally just to get used to working with them and too often the average harp player is totally unused to that and also to become much more musically disciplined and learn how to work together as a section.
I've played in plenty of situations with horns, including one band where it had 2 tenor sexes, 1 bartione sax, 1 alto sax and a trumpet and if you think just the one sax is too loud, that's child's play when compared to what I worked with and you just can't riff all over the place and you have to learn how to be part of the section, and I had to not only learn the lines they were playing, but also the dynamics and get intonation and articulation EXACTLY right and so it's more than just the notes alone, plus there's gonna be times where you're gonna need to learn some basic music theory because often times it isn't just playing the lines in unison (for those who don't know what that is, it means playing the exact same notes together with everyone else), but often times in harmony, meaning one player starts the line with the toot note, one starts at the 3rd of the chord, on at the 5th and the line is totally harmonized, so altogether it's basically chorded harmonies.
Bottom line, there is no such thing as a trick, and the thing you need to do is to learn how to work with them and listen to everything in much greater detail than ever before.
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Sincerely,
Barbeque Bob Maglinte
Boston, MA
http://www.barbequebob.com
CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
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jpmcbride
52 posts
May 16, 2014
3:31 PM
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I played acoustic guitar in a band that used one of those Bose systems that Iceman is talking about. It was great. No monitors and and what you hear on stage is what you hear in the audience ... except for the bass. You need the sub-woofer from Bose to go with the system and it behaves just like a regular bass amp. Directional, and you have to get 10 feet or so in front of it before it spreads out and reaches full volume.
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Jim McBride
www.bottleoblues.com
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