TetonJohn
153 posts
Nov 10, 2013
10:49 AM
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Messing around in the house today. Lined out my MA17 to my SJ410 -- bad donkey!
Wondering if there is any risk in putting the AFB+ between them? Yeah, I could put it in front of the MA17, but I want to experiment -- but don't want to risk the expensive pedal.
Based of the fact that the 410 volume knob is on 2 (1=off) and close to feedback, I think it is safe to say that the line out signal is stronger than a typical HiZ microphone signal -- should i err on the side of caution and forget the experiment
EDIT: If you tell me "GO FOR IT, and report back in," will you share the cost of replacing the AFB+? ;-)
(Oh, I guess that would give me a real good reason to try the new anti-SQUEAL.)
(One reason to put the AFB+ between them is that, in theory,I could mike the MA17 speaker to get that signal big into the house (not my house!) and have the 410 providing huge stage volume.)
I have no specs on the line out except to say "Skip did it."
Last Edited by TetonJohn on Nov 10, 2013 11:40 AM
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Rick Davis
2667 posts
Nov 10, 2013
11:46 AM
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The signal level from a bullet mic is often much higher than line level.
But... I've read your post a couple times and still can't understand what you are trying to achieve.
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-Little Rick Davis
The Blues Harp Amps Blog
The Mile High Blues Society
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Kingley
3262 posts
Nov 10, 2013
11:58 AM
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I agree with Rick. It seems unclear what you want to achieve. If I understand your post correctly it sounds like you want to run the MA17 into the AFB and then run the AFB into the SJ410…? What I can't understand is why? If you want the tone of the Masco with the volume of the SJ410 then just mic it into the PA. You could of course line out the Masco into the SJ. Or you could always use a Y splitter cable from the mic into both amps. You might even be able to use a Y splitter into the AFB then into both amps. I wouldn't use the AFB for linking the two amps though. I don't think that's a good idea at all. Simply because that's not what it's intended for.
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1847
1292 posts
Nov 10, 2013
12:21 PM
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i vaguely remember trying that
i dont care for the sound of the champ
with the antifeedback pedal.
the bassman however sounds awesome with that pedal.
if i remember correctly it did not work.
i simply unplug the champ, and use only the bassman if i need to play that loud
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i get a lot of request when i play my harmonica
"but i play it anyway"
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SuperBee
1523 posts
Nov 10, 2013
12:37 PM
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I think I understand, but I don't know the answer.
You want to play into the masco, and have that sound for the house, but you can't hear it on stage and feedback would be a problem if you put it in the monitors, so you basically want to mic the amp, and also run a line out to a bigger amp to use as your stage monitor. The quality of the sound on this is non-critical; you just need to hear it, so the idea is to put the AFB on the line into that amp in the hope it will allow you to maximise the volume. Yeah?
But you're concerned the signal strength on the line out of the masco may be too high and could damage the pedal?
I kinda doubt it but I dunno. Got any cheap pedals you don't mind trashing? I mean, it's not damaging your bassman right? It's a line-out not a speaker out...
Or, ask skip?
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TetonJohn
154 posts
Nov 10, 2013
12:40 PM
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Thanks for the thoughts, guys.
Clarification (maybe): I'm just "messin' around" today -- never thought before to use the MA17 line out to get more volume via a larger amp (when I gig with the Masco, I mike it to the PA, have never actually used the line out -- just had Skip install it because it seemed like "you never know...").
Experimenting at this today, there is still feedback that limits the volume you can get from the 410 (of course). In a way, the experiment is to see how much volume I can get by doing this. So, raising the feedback ceiling on the 410 seems like a reasonable idea -- and raising the feedback ceiling of a tube amp is what the AFB+ is designed to do -- but not via a line out -- hence the question regarding risk.
My thought about miking the MA17 into "the house" and using the 410 for big stage volume was more of an afterthought -- thinking about some potential practical application rather than just the "experiment."
But, today, the experiment is the thing.
I hope that helps.
I certainly could put the AFB+ in front of the Masco and use it as designed -- I just figured the final product (what's coming out of the 410) might be different based on where the AFB+ is in "the chain."
Thanks, again.
Edit (post-SuperBee): yeah, you got it, except the practical application is more of an afterthought. (It may be that I just want to see how frickin' loud I can get that MA17 today -- my little PA is old and crappy and I'd rather not hook it up -- also I'm feelin' bad for my 410 that hasn't gotten much use lately.)
Last Edited by TetonJohn on Nov 10, 2013 1:04 PM
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Rick Davis
2668 posts
Nov 10, 2013
12:49 PM
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Does the Masco have more than one mic input jack?
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-Little Rick Davis
The Blues Harp Amps Blog
The Mile High Blues Society
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1847
1293 posts
Nov 10, 2013
12:50 PM
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The quality of the sound on this is non-critical;
the quality of sound is always critical.
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i get a lot of request when i play my harmonica
"but i play it anyway"
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TetonJohn
155 posts
Nov 10, 2013
1:01 PM
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Rick -- no, just 1 mike input on the Masco -- but I think I hear where you are going -- just chain to the 410 via the second (unused) mike input (except I'm really trying to utilize the MA17 signal to the extent possible -- knowing of course the 410 will color it some (as would the AFB+ between the amps).
Last Edited by TetonJohn on Nov 10, 2013 1:02 PM
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TetonJohn
156 posts
Nov 10, 2013
2:18 PM
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Apart from opinions about the usefulness; this is what I hear about potential damage to the AFB+:
1847 -- tried but did not like (apparently did not damage).
Rick -- bullet mic signals often stronger than line (so probably ok)
SuperBee -- damage? -- doubt it (but not sure)
Kingley -- wouldn't do it (not its design).
Hmmm...what to do -- heading out for a walk right now, so it won't happen right now -- maybe Jason (of Squeal) knows how his device would handle it??
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Rick Davis
2669 posts
Nov 10, 2013
2:23 PM
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Tetonjohn, I *KNOW* you know your way around amps and I don't mean to imply you don't, but make sure the line out on the Masco is not actually an auxiliary speaker out. That might fry the Kinder pedal.
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-Little Rick Davis
The Blues Harp Amps Blog
The Mile High Blues Society
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TetonJohn
157 posts
Nov 10, 2013
3:30 PM
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Rick,no offense taken -- I KNOW you are just trying to save my gear -- thanks. I do know for sure Skip built it to be a line out (and because it didn't fry my 410 earlier toady, I have even more confidence in that).
I'm still undecided about trying the AFB+ though. Because the AFB+ can (presumably) be anywhere in the signal chain between the mike and amp, including presumably after a Harp Attack, I really expect it could handle the Masco's line out.
If it sounds great, that's a fine result of the experiment. If it sounds like crap (or not at all), that's fine, too.
If the pedal fries, not so good!!
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1847
1295 posts
Nov 10, 2013
6:20 PM
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(presumably) be anywhere in the signal chain between the mike and amp,
i am pretty sure it needs to be first in the chain
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i get a lot of request when i play my harmonica
"but i play it anyway"
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TetonJohn
160 posts
Nov 10, 2013
7:08 PM
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I've definitely used it (AFB+) other than first in the chain after the mike (though maybe I wasn't following directions!).
Let's see...I've got some notes showing it after a LoneWolf Tone+ into a very early HarpGear Champ -- the Tone+ added some bass to the Champ, and the AFB+ allowed more volume and got it farther into the crunch zone. I expect I tried the pedals in different orders and settled on the order I liked best -- that would be the routine.
Last Edited by TetonJohn on Nov 10, 2013 7:34 PM
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