Interesting and useful thread. I think unfortunately some people see it as an argument rather than a discussion. Iceman brought out a reference to tai chi; now this is something I do know about, and it has relevance to the discussion. One of the central ideas in Tai chi is that if one part of the body moves, the whole body moves. A move which manifests in the hands begins at the foot and involves every muscle in the body.
I believe good bending involves everything from the diaphragm to the end of the tongue, and maybe even the lips. To try and say its 'this' and not 'that' misses the whole. ---------- Lucky Lester
Last Edited by didjcripey on Mar 05, 2013 2:04 PM
The topic says "why throat bending may be for you" and people directly says it´s worthless and that i don´t even exist. I seem to be so stupid that i can´t feel the differense betwen my glottis and my tongue. With that said i have to say i may have been a little harsh on iceman and i apologize for that. Lets say we agree to disagree? I certainly feel that i get a much bigger pallete of expressions when i got the throat bending down. It is not just the bending and vibrato that has improved for me but the whole "control" in the glottis. I can play staccato with my throat so i don´t have to take the tongue from the harmonica. My recomendation is to try to learn the technique and if you don´t like it dont use it.
@tmf714 The short videos with xrays are worthless. It´s a beginner player that don´t control the bends, the bends are sour and not at all steady.
So do we all actually agree that one can initiate (and subsequently control) bends from either the front of the mouth, or from deeper back within the "throat" (to whatever degree this involves the tongue)? Do we also all agree that the farther back you perform the bend, the bigger the resulting mouth/throat resonating chamber, and the better things sound?
To me that has always seemed to be the crux of the "throat bending" discussions of yore (where some would argue that all bending actually takes place in the "mouth") -- this thread seems to be just dancing around which specific muscles one wants to count as part of the tongue vs. the pharynx, etc. and how they are all interconnected.
"@tmf714 The short videos with xrays are worthless. It´s a beginner player that don´t control the bends, the bends are sour and not at all steady. "
Those vids really are not about he players technique-I thought they were informative information about how the glottis,soft pallett,tongue and lips are all involved in playing a wind or reed instrument.
@Harpdud-I think I have posted some great examples for everyone here to enjoy-if you see it as "topping"-so be it -but remember this part of the forum creed-I really do not consider you to be in any position to suggest I need "help"- We come here to share information, conspire with like-minded others, educate ourselves, cheer each other on, and maybe help each other deal skillfully with the rough changes that the blues-focused life can sometimes put us through. Vigorous, passionate conversation is fine. But please refrain from flaming, insulting, or otherwise impugning the intelligence or good intentions of your fellow board members, or from starting threads that seek to encourage that sort of behavior
Last Edited by tmf714 on Mar 05, 2013 2:31 PM
Tim Elf..I didn't start a thread to seek any kind of behavior. I shared the results of my experience and hard work. Read the topic line of the thread. I offered a choice that some may not have been aware of..but your mission from the moment you saw it was me, was to dispute and find fault...take the other side..no matter what you truly believe. Oh yeah...good luck on finding those like-minded others.
sez harpdude61: "Non-throat benders...can you control the pitch of the 3 notes available on 10 blow, adding a sweet vibrato, without closing your mouth any? zero..Closing the mouth is cheating on blow bends. You change the resonator size and the tone thins slightly."
I control those 3 notes with a more towards closed mouth than wide open. Total control. Good tone, etc. Forward area of my tongue does all the work.
So, there is always more than one way to teach harmonica technique..
Hey, how many of you posters are active teachers? How many years have you been teaching? Have you taught in group sessions or one on one?
The path I chose about 15 years ago was away from actual performance and more in the direction of active teaching....classes at Blues Week in Elkins, workshops at Jam Camps, one on one private lessons.
It was during these years and through learning the best way to teach that I arrive at techniques that are totally effective and accelerate student's learning curves.
It was not unusual to attend my advanced harmonica class at Blues Week for 4 years in a row and have me announce at the beginning of each year's first class "Remember those concepts I laid on you last year? Well, forget them. I've got a whole new direction now."
Always evolving and focusing my teaching ability to a razor sharp edge is my goal.
Now, the way I've described controlling bends w/tongue is what I've settled on as the best way to propel beginners into rapid development - way faster than what I was shown and how I learned.
It was always harder to teach these particular concepts to int/adv players, as they had already had their concepts set in their personal stones - good and bad habits ingrained already. Like an old dog with a towel gripped in his mouth, the harder you try to tug the towel out of his mouth, the harder he clamps down with his teeth was my experience with a lot of these players.
So, if you wanna bend from the throat and it works for you...cool. Are you able to teach this method to your students and get results like all notes bent to pitch (not including OB/OD) within one or two weeks of instruction? If you can, you are a good teacher like me.
We need more good teachers out there anyways. ---------- The Iceman
yes I saw this.....so my development came later than I thought.....but its no doubt I throat bend....its hard to imagine ever not doing it.....but throat muscles are conditioned now....no other explanation
hdude...yes, I remember this...however, never got an answer to my question from "throat benders"...
"Are you able to teach this method to your students and get results like all notes bent to pitch (not including OB/OD) within one or two weeks of instruction?" ---------- The Iceman
My first bends were made with the outer edges of my tongue against the top of my mouth. The bends were made by bending the tongue like saying yeee - yaaaw (similar to eeee-ohh described earlier)
I now can bend with tongue on the bottom of my mouth and constricting the throat, though I do use the tongue for the constriction. Similar to making the "Darth Vader Sound" ---------- theharmonicaclub.com (of Huntington, WV)
