I am not claiming to be an Adam Gussow or Jason Ricci with my overblows, but just wanted some insight as to if I am on the right track with these. I am attempting to overblow holes 4-6. This is literally the first time I have put any effort/practice into overblows. This video is after about 15-20 minutes practice and I am using an OOTB Seydel Steel session in key C. Thanks!
Yep, you got 'em. I'd say 99% of overblows is related to setup. Have a look at the video Joe Spiers put on YouTube about gappng if you haven't already.
Not bad at all for your first go at it. Having a harp that has been set up properly for overblows makes a big difference. They will be much easier to hit and to sustain.
That all moved so quickly that I can't give you an honest response. You hit all three OBs, I think, but I also feel like somebody who has just seen a game of three card monte go down on 43rd street.
Upload another video in which you start on the 4 blow and play chromatically upward until you hit the 7 draw.
Adam is right, your video is too short to tell and if i may add, your not playing loud enough ! That being said, since you still want advice i'll do my best to oblige but it is hard to tell and i am probably wrong a lot here.
Now that you got them to sound. Hit them longer, maybe for 4 to 8 bar. Once you can hold them steadily... Well work on getting you Bb/6° cristal clear faster 'cause right now, you have lot's of air leaking on that note. That can come either way from your harp not being air tight enough or yourself not using your diaphragm as much as you should. It may be more about your diaphragm than your harp. As for the notes themselves after quite a few dozens of time listening, i think your Eb/4° and Bb are out of tune slightly, a coma or two. Not that much. F#/5° may be ok. It sounds less funy to me than the other two. If your F# actually is on tune like i think it is, I would suggest memorising how your tongue is positioned for that note and then trying to understand on it moves differently on the other 2 notes. That and use more your diaphragm. Using it make you able to get a clear overblow and also a louder one. Tuning the harp help but once you got the technics down, it just make it easier, it doesn't help you getting them. Never forget that too.
Thanks for all the comments/suggestions. Here is a quick clip of an attempted chromatic scale using overblows(poorly) on holes 4-6 on an OOTB seydel in C.
You are getting them. Yes, you're technique needs refining and yes, they need to be more in pitch, but the main thing is your on track. It'll take time to get them more precise and to be able to play them fluently and on pitch. The main thing is to not get discouraged. As long as you keep practicing them, they will get better and better. Learning how to set up your own harps will help you immensely. I suggest following Joe Spiers videos on how to do this. His YouTube username is choppajoe.
Last Edited by on Dec 30, 2012 1:24 AM
@kingsley Thanks for taking the time to respond, for the tips, and also for the video links to Joes YouTube channel. I will check the videos and keep on practicing these OB's. Thanks again!
Thanks for that! Yes, you've definitely gotten all three. So you've crossed the bridge and are now standing on the dark side. I think you might spend a few days just working that particular chromatic scale until it becomes automatic. Just play it from bottom to top, and make it smooth. Tap your foot; do it in time. Speed it up; slow it down.
The next step would be to play some useful licks.
4d 5b 5d 5ob 6d 7d 8d is a good one, with the 5ob on a downbeat: a-4-a-ONE a-two-aahhh.
Then: 4b 4d 4ob 5b 6b 6d 7b, in the same rhythm.
Those are foundational licks for the V chord and IV chord, respectively.
When you're doing those licks smoothly, you might try playing the original chromatic scale down from the 7b. It's much harder hitting those three ob's when you're heading down than when you're heading up the scale.
Nice job, though. You've made it onto the dark side. :)
Last Edited by on Dec 30, 2012 5:42 AM
Playing them as a chromatic scale is your entry level ticket to the dark side.
In order to remain on the dark side, you will have to pull those OB's out of a chromatic scale and treat them as another note choice.
Put the harmonica down, pick it up and immediately play 6 OB.
Once you are able to do this, sustain the OB and play with the pitch - raising and lowering it slightly until you get a good sense of playing this note in tune rather than a little on the flat side.
The final aspect is trying to get this note to sound as equal as you can to all the other "given" and "created through simple bending techniques" notes (which is the hardest challenge of all). This is something you should work towards over time.
The idea is for the listener to not know if what you are playing is a "given" note or one created through a technique. They should all sound relatively equal.
This is the ultimate challenge of the dark side and only a very few have approached total success.
While you are keeping this aspect in the back of your mind, try playing a song like "Peg O My Heart" in second position, which really puts to task your ability to create the 5 OB, or any other song which uses just one (or maybe 2) of these newly acquired OB's.
I don’t think of it as the “dark side” (I understand the humor though)…but more in the vein of- do I long for these extra notes – to express, expose, and entertain myself and others?
If you feel something is lacking in your imagination as a player and feel the notes achieved by OB/OD will invigorate and inspire you to become the player you dream you could and should be then…That is a Bright Side to pursue…
Obviously – integration of OB/OD into a players style can create some of the most exciting harmonica music to be heard today!
There are a lot of ob/od Players on the scene today…Some of which have gotten my attention BIGTIME with what their putting down musically.
So…there are amazing recorded examples of what can be accomplished by using them properly, intelligently and with conviction.
And it seems that these Players are of the “highest caliber” of musicianship – which helps them immensely with using ob/od notes almost seamlessly and with the utmost integrity.
I said all that to say this…NOTHING about the harmonica is “elementary” and becoming a [persuasive] harmonica player is by no means handed to anyone…
And I am sincerely impressed when I hear a player use ob/od “persuasively” – it is wonderful to hear and behold ?
Sandy Weltman - hot jazz, americana, Klezmer and some blues
uh, (koff) me.
The three of us all studied at the same time under Howard Levy at Augusta Heritage experience in the early 90's.
Jason Ricci - high velocity blues
posthumously - Chris Michalek - an entity unto himself
Kudzu - blues based
also the fantastic younger European players who have embraced this technique as part of the core of learning diatonic.
(as an aside, when I teach those that have never played harmonica before, I introduce them to OB/OD pretty early on, as soon as they have absorbed and can bend traditionally and to pitch. I've found that beginners find OB not any more difficult than traditional bending techniques) ---------- The Iceman
Last Edited by on Dec 30, 2012 7:22 AM
Here is a bit of my experience in teaching (w/my Zen like approach).
Be careful of the words you use in your own internal dialog. (How you speak to yourself in your own mind, as well as out loud).
When you state "EVERYTHING on the harmonica is difficult to "master" ", you create a self fulfilling prophecy for yourself.
I've seen this time and again with my students. They come to me with similar sentences. One part of my teaching approach is to have them start to change their own internal dialog regarding their abilities.
Sometimes it's hilarious. They start out by telling me how hard it is for them do a certain thing - where I will interrupt them, tell them to stop talking and just play. Often, they will rip through whatever they claimed to be hard for them. Then I tell them "That was excellent. Now, am I to believe you telling me how hard it is for you to do, or should I believe in your ability and what I just heard you do easily? Which one are you, really?"
I learned this from my piano teacher so long ago. In working on a classical piece, I would be staring at the music and fumbling my way through. He would suddenly snatch my music book off the piano, close it and say "Now play it". I would protest that I couldn't play it without the music. He would insist that I do, as I already really knew the music. Of course, there would be a little verbal tug of war, but when he told me to shut up and play, to my amazement, I could play without the music. He would say "Do I believe what you say or what you play?"
For instance, in your case I might suggest saying "EVERYTHING on the harmonica is easy to "master" once I decide it's what I really want and agree to put a little time and effort into it."
I'm not suggesting that this is an instant fix, but it does go a long way to success in an endeavor.
Controlling one's own internal dialog is an important piece to the overall learning puzzle. ---------- The Iceman
Last Edited by on Dec 30, 2012 10:00 AM
Agreed, internal dialog can make you or break you…I comprehend the logic…
I believe that this thought ("EVERYTHING on the harmonica is difficult to "master") will not dissuade the new student who has the MASTER living within their heart.
They will comprehend the hidden beauty that waits them in things that are difficult…thus, that phrase – would not cause them unnecessary stress!
Last Edited by on Dec 30, 2012 10:25 AM
I've been messing with OBs now and again throughout the year. I can 6OB pretty well and can even incorporate it into a tune! (The Red Dwarf Theme!) But this thread inspired me to try the chromatic scale and unbelievably I found I can do it. It's wheezy and slow but it's all there! Now, for the people just starting down the road of OBs (and many other areas of harp playing)what I've discovered is the hardest part of it is getting that very first OB. It's almost as if you need proof that the instrument can actually make the noise, then suddenly it becomes slightly easier to do. Plus I can get OBs on a Session Steel, MS ProHarp, and a GM but get nothing out of a MB. Not even a feeling that it is capable of doing it. Weird eh?
I think it sounds great if these are seriously your "first" attempts. The more time goes by, the easier I believe this technique is to pick up now that there are more recorded examples.
To piggyback on what Iceman said, I've encountered people personally who say they can't do this technique and then after coaching them, 15-20 minutes later, they are able to pop a few overblows out.
Kudzu has given you some great licks to work with. I will throw another in (taken from Kudzu)
Use this on the V chord in 2nd position 6d 6d 5d 5ob 4d
Thanks for taking the time to view the videos and provide your insight, suggestions, etc. That's one of the problems I have now, I don't know how to incorporate the OB into cohesive musical phrases, but thanks for the sample riffs. I will practice those and build from there.
@ridge
Yes, this is really the first attempt at OB. I don't really have anything to gain by pretending they aren't-lol. I think I have always been "OB" but not really knowing it. I play with pretty strong breath force( I know, I know, play softly-lol) and before realizing I was at the beginning of an "OB", I would get the strange squeaks on the blow notes of the middle register. Somebody on a YouTube video(I think it was adam) mentioned that if your getting that "squeal", that you are in the vicinity of an overblow, or something like that. I just recently watched Jason Ricci video on overdraws, and those seemed to come pretty natural as well. I guess the description of drinking a McDonalds milkshake through a straw just made sense.
Anyway, I am finding in this short period of time that getting to play an OB is now easier than figuring out what to do with them-lol
If you want to really get some overblows in and really feel awesome about your overblows, and play something where they are super easy to work in, try blues in first position. The overblows all line up to flatted blues scale notes. In C, your 4 overblow is a flatted third, your 5 overblow is a flatted fifth and your 6 overblow is a flatted seventh.
---------- David
____________________ At the time of his birth, it was widely accepted that no one man could play that much music so well or raise that much hell. He proved them all wrong. R.I.P. H. Cecil Payne
I took your advise and started to concentrate on first position to practice those overblows. They are coming together nicely, and I am really digging first position playing. The overblows are really rewarding and definitely add a new dimension to my playing. I havent been this excited about playing since my first bend. Thanks for the tip and I'll try to post a vid of my progress. Cheers! -Carl
