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Dirty-South Blues Harp forum: wail on! >
My First Jam (eva)
My First Jam (eva)
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oda
443 posts
May 05, 2011
7:19 AM
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I saw that one of my fellow forum members (geordie) lost his harmonica jam virginity. I was inspired to let you all know that
I must confess, I, too, lost it. It was raining. And I hadn't combed my hair, but anyway;
This is my first jam ever. I have been "playing" for 2ish years. I'm not very musical. I just know I really love the blues and the sounds of the harmonica turn me on -- which is why I spent most of these 2 years making sure I can get all the notes, had all my bends, overbends, etc. The problem is, I have no idea WHERE/HOW/WHY to use them in a song. It's like having money you can't spend.
I also have absolutely terrible timing. I can't keep time, admittedly. Maybe I have a short attention span? or I don't have a good technique of time-keeping (is there one?) and I feel like I had nothing to say..
I have many friends who are excellent guitarists/musicians but I don't really jam with them as often as I should, because I'm intimidated and I feel like I just don't have it in me.
How did YOU start jamming?
How do YOU keep time?
How do YOU keep things fresh and come up with new ideas?
What do you think? tip away!
Click here to listen to My 1'st Jam
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I could be bound by a nutshell and still count myself a king of infinite space
OdaHUMANITY!
Oda's YouTube Channel
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Last Edited by on May 05, 2011 7:23 AM
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KingBiscuit
43 posts
May 05, 2011
7:30 AM
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How do you start jamming? Sounds like you already figured that one out.
How do you keep time...I just listen to a lot of blues. Something on my body is always moving in time with it...tapping a foot, finger, whatever. If you know the I, VI, V start taking notice of when the chord changes...usually the drummer and/or bass player give some indication.
Coming up with new ideas is tough for me...I've been listening to a lot of James Cotton lately trying to steal his licks. Once I'm comfortable enough with a lick, it starts slipping in.
Hope that helps,
Dan
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Barry C.
250 posts
May 05, 2011
8:52 AM
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as for how to start jamming - you already did - jumping right into the cold water is the only way to get wet!!
as far as timimg - make sure you are tapping your foot to the beat.
as for what to play when - you need to learn the 12 bar blues format (1-4-5) and at least the 'blues' scale.
as for ideas; listen listen listen - to the other jammers and as many good cd's as possible.
this is a long (but enjoyable) process so stick to the fight when your hardest hit!!
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~Banned in Boston!
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ridge
254 posts
May 05, 2011
9:01 AM
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Oda,
- Don't be afraid of resolving up to the 6 blow instead of 2 draw.
- Don't bend your 3 draw down so far ( 1 and a half step bend).
I'll try to catch up on Skype with you and give you some ideas.
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Joe_L
1231 posts
May 05, 2011
10:00 AM
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Q. How did YOU start jamming?
A. My first time at a jam was at a 50's themed bar in suburban Chicago. It wasn't a blues jam, but the band leader was a guy named Mark Wydra. He is a great guitar player. He had performed Chuck Berry, Bo Diddley, Eddy Clearwater, Carey Bell and many others.
I went there a bunch of times and signed up. He saw me attempting to play Blues and suggested that I come to another one of his gigs. It was a Blue Monday party at a dive bar near Chicago. That sort of started it for me.
The people that were playing and sitting in were some amazing local players that you never heard of (and that I never saw again outside that club.) Most of those guys worked for the railroad or the corn processing plant. The smoke was so thick you couldn't see your feet. Those people knew the Blues. I was hooked and went back until they lost the gig. I had a lot of fun at that place.
Q. How do YOU keep time?
When I started out, I was very rhythmically challenged. People that know me would probably still say the same thing.
I was reading an interview with Luther Allison. His recommendation was to listen to a lot of Jimmy Reed albums. Eddie Taylor and Earl Phillips were human metronomes that cut a groove as deep as the Grand Canyon. I started listening to a lot of Jimmy Reed. I had an old Walkman and I recorded a 90 minute cassette tape full of Jimmy Reed tunes. I probably listened to that tape every day until the tape broke, then I made another and listened to it again. Eventually, you'll learn to feel the changes.
I read another article about how a lot of players with good time approached things. The author of the article proposed that rhythmic patterns exist everywhere. The author stated that in manufacturing jobs there recurring sounds created by machines created a rhythmic patterns that musicians picked up on and that helped develop their sense of time.
Another guitar playing friend of mine who was born in Mississippi told me that he developed his sense of time by being around horses. When horses move their patterns are very rhythmic whether they are moving fast or slow. His suggestion was to move while playing and you'll start to feel it.
All of the above has helped me out.
Q. How do YOU keep things fresh and come up with new ideas?
James Cotton once gave me this advice. "Keep playing and listen to everyone."
Music is pretty inexpensive. Here is what I did. I started buying records. I did a lot of reading. I read a ton of Living Blues and Blues Unlimited back in the day. I read a lot about the players that moved me. I started listening to what they listened to. I talked to other harp players and found out what they listened to.
Listen to a lot of music. Try to copy what other players are doing. It doesn't have to be harp players. I've stolen stuff from guitar players and piano players.
I love the Blues. I listen to a lot of it. I try to steal from a multitude of sources. It doesn't seem like practice or work to me. I look at it this way.
I go out. I have a couple of drinks. I listen to some music. I socialize with my friends. I play a few tunes and steal their licks. A few hours later, the fun is over until the next time.
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The Blues Photo Gallery
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12gagedan
30 posts
May 05, 2011
10:05 AM
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Oda,
You indeed have the fundamentals (clean clear notes, decent bends, etc). However, you are right that you don't quite know how to put it together yet. It's going to take a while, but you're off to a very good start.
I think your timing is better than you think. You do some very solid stuff in the last chorus. I think nerves had a lot to do with your slow start. Jamming is scary for a while.
I was going to write how you didn't seem to hear the progression, but then I heard the very end. You finally hit the V chord on 3Dbb, just before the end of the tune. (awesome)
Tips:
1. The tip we've all received, and the best one you'll ever get: KEEP PLAYING. "It" will only come with practice and real live experience with a band.
2. Listen to more harmonica players for ideas. There are some who disagree with this (RIP Buddha), however I believe one does not need to re-invent the wheel. There's a lot to be learned about blues harp from the blues harp greats. You don't have to be a carbon-copy, either.
3. I make videos on youtube focused in your direction. Sorry for the self-plug, but for the most part, my lessons are geared towards the beginner end of the spectrum. I think my "low hanging fruit, licks" video may help you some.
4. The posts above, and no-doubt below, will all be right on the money. Don't let all that info overwhelm you. Take it in pieces and give it time.
Good luck,
dan gage
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Lmbrjak
41 posts
May 05, 2011
10:30 AM
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Sounds like you have lots of good licks stored in your memory bank. I think some of your timing problems may have more to do with confidence and trusting your ears. There were times that you started a very good lick but hesitated throwing the timing off. Other times it sounded like you tried to do too much.Try forgetting about your harp and focus on that guitar. Listen,respond with3or4 notes,listenfor afew beats respond again with a few notes,listen some more,maybe 6 or 7 notes.You actually played over the guitar at times here but their were some good parts here too,where you and the guitar go back and forth. If you focus on listening,I think those licks will flow out on time and in the right place.
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oda
445 posts
May 05, 2011
3:00 PM
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@Ridgeway,
Thanks! I appreciate the advice. I would love to talk about that on Skype. When you were on I was busy with school, and now you're not on so much. hehe,
catch ya on there.
@Joe_L
Jimmy reed is not too complex when it comes to his playing. And most of his stuff is straight-forward 12 bar blues. That's a good suggestion, I ought to stick
to one album and memorize the feel of it.
Thanks for passing the advice of Cotton! I'll take it to heart.
@dangage
I messaged you when I was first starting and you wrote me a whole page as a reply on YouTube! I was grateful then, and I'm grateful now. I'll defintely check out
your "low hanging fruit"
@Lmb
That's a good tip. I'll listen to the guitarist more, and play a lot less (I don't mind that at all!)
It's certainly exciting to finally get jamming and putting things together. I'll be sticking to it and getting together with people as much as possible.
I think I'll learn "Help Me"
Also, another question; At Jams is it usually improvised stuff? or do people say "hey, let's do ____" and if you can't do it your effed up the A?
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I could be bound by a nutshell and still count myself a king of infinite space
OdaHUMANITY!
Oda's YouTube Channel
Oda's Facebook
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Blues13
103 posts
May 05, 2011
3:00 PM
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Hi Oda,I've been playing for a little more than a year and I understand the timming problem. I have what I like to call a foot tapping disorder If I tap my foot and try to count time or figure out what beat I'm on I'm scewed. I try to lean everything by heart and if I have to stay on a note fo a few beats I count in my head. The other thing I do is when I buy one of Adams lesson I tap my foot with him and try to play the song with him but I think my problem might be talent.
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Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent.
Isaac Asimov
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oda
446 posts
May 05, 2011
3:15 PM
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When I hear Adam talking about playing things on the "upbeat" and something else on the "downbeat" I get frustrated...
I don't even know what beat I'm on, let alone when to play over what.
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I could be bound by a nutshell and still count myself a king of infinite space
OdaHUMANITY!
Oda's YouTube Channel
Oda's Facebook
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Tommy the Hat
11 posts
May 05, 2011
4:45 PM
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I don't want to hijack this thread but I have a question that relates. I thought I knew but now reading this I'm not sure. As far as timing and beats I always thought (and have done) that as long as you come back when you should what happens between the start and finish (of, let's say, the 12 bars) doesn't matter.....I'm referring to solo's here. So I would start on a note that fits, then build and play around, wail a few times etc and do whatever, as long as I finish up on time to come back to the music in time for the vocals or the song proper or what have you to come back. So I'm concerned only with the first beat and the last...usually down beats. Then again....I know very little about this stuff...lol.
Thanks
Tommy
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Joe_L
1232 posts
May 05, 2011
5:13 PM
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Get a Jimmy Reed album. Start with one song. Many of his tunes are mid-tempo shuffles. He almost always starts singing on the first bar of the progression. Listen to Earl Phillips playing the drums. He'll hit the snare drum on the second and fourth beat.
Start counting:
1, 2, 3, 4
2, 2, 3, 4
3, 2, 3, 4
etc...
Move to the beat. Snap your fingers. Tap your feet. Do something. You want to get to the point where you aren't counting. You'll eventually get to the point where you won't be counting.
Avoid playing the harp when you do this. It will de-focus you. Focus on listening and feeling the groove. Listen to the interplay between the drums and the guitars.
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The Blues Photo Gallery
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KingoBad
717 posts
May 05, 2011
7:44 PM
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Tommy the Hat,
You should always be in the groove. You can play behind, you can play in front. You can switch back and fourth and you can purposefully mess with it, but you ALWAYS need to know where the beat is.
A solo that is not conscious of time is like a noodle deluxe - not only are we forced to hear noodling, but without respect to the time it becomes unbearable. I suspect you understand time better than you think.
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Danny
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oldwailer
1601 posts
May 05, 2011
11:43 PM
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To develop better timing, I used this method with a couple of students I had and it worked well even with one guy who was horribly rhythm challenged:
Use a metronome--you can download about a dozen different ones--I like tempoperfect pretty well--available at
http://www.nch.com.au/metronome/index.html The software is free.
For ten minutes every day, before you practice--leave your harps in the case. Clap your hands to the beat--just start out with a straight on the beat and do it until you make the sound of the metronome go away--and you start to actually enjoy it--that takes a while. Then add the "and" just behind the 1st beat in a group of 4 and count and clap at the same time--"1 and 2, 3, 4. Then 1 and 2 and 3 and 4 and. keep at it--day in day out--keep adding shit in like "1 ee and a 2 ee and a 3 and 4.
have fun with it--it'll suck the first few times, then it'll get more fun--pretty soon you might start to like it. If your toe doesn't start to tap all by itself after a while you need to keep at it more--it'll come--that primal rhythm is in you--it's why you're alive.
Then, when you pick up a harp--just do the same thing thru the harp--just "1 and a 2 and a three and so forth. Then skip some beats--do a silent 1 then nail the "and a 2" Or pick it up on the "and a" just after the 4 and swing into the 1. Just get creative--invent your own drills.
This is the grunt work in music--but it can get to be a lot of fun too. I still need to do it to even out rhythm problems and I've been playing music for over 50 years. . .
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Always be yourself--unless you suck. . .
-Joss Whedon
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