Bobbyboy
1 post
Apr 20, 2016
4:09 PM
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I'm fairly new to blues harmonica but have been playing folk in 1st position for a long time.
I started a few months back with a Lee Oskar in D and quickly learned to do all the draw bends in all the holes. Then bought a special 20 in C and again it all came very easily. Then I bought a Suzuki promaster in A and all of a sudden I just couldnt do the same things on this harp, the third hole is particularly troublesome although I do love the tone and solid feel of this instrument. It occurred to me, are the lower keys just harder to play or is it this harmonica in particular that doesnt bend so easily?
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SuperBee
3626 posts
Apr 20, 2016
7:03 PM
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In your case I'd lay money it's the harp, but in general...
'Harder' is a relative term. I find anything below the G harp takes it out of me and the lowest chamber on a Lo Eb is the limit...I can't play that bend in a song but I can get it given enough time.
On the other hand, I used to struggle with 6 draw on D and above.
Generally I think the blow bends are considered easier on lower keys and draw bends harder in lower keys.
But I'm confident you problem with the 3rd chamber of your Key of A Promaster is harp-specific.
I don't have a solution for you, beyond mention there may be a warranty.
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Killa_Hertz
1122 posts
Apr 20, 2016
8:00 PM
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Yes. Im afraid Bee is right. It seems to be a problematic harp. Infact there was just a discussion on that very thing.
Here it is
Promaster 3 Draw Issue----------
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SuperBee
3627 posts
Apr 20, 2016
11:04 PM
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Really there are just too many possibilities, but an A harp is one of the easiest to play I think.
If you have access to a warranty replacement or repair, don't void it by taking the harp apart and attempting to fix it.
If you don't have an applicable resort like that...we could start looking but it can be tricky with some harps
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MindTheGap
1507 posts
Apr 20, 2016
11:49 PM
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I expect they are right, and it's the harp.
But I'll add that a teacher I saw said that some of his students found high keys easier to bend, some found low keys easier. I find low keys easier, particularly on that 3D.
It would be good if you could report back when you've found the answer.
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Bobbyboy
2 posts
Apr 21, 2016
2:18 AM
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Wow, thanks for such a fast response. I read with interest the other thread on this issue. In a way I'm glad its not just me. Everyone appears to love the quality feel of the promaster but have these same playability issues.
I did email the Suzuki people about my problem and they were not very helpful. Basically they said that I just should have bought the valved version! Not good enough really. I will try doing some work on it and see if things improve. It may just end up as a folk instrument. As I'm newish to blues playing I'm trying out as many brands as I can to see what best suits me. So far the special 20 seams to be the easiest to play but they have a cheap and nasty feel about them, like it came out of a christmas cracker! I have just ordered a Golden melody so will see how I get on with that. Thanks for the helpful comments. I think I am going to enjoy this forum.
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Harmlessonica
228 posts
Apr 21, 2016
2:48 AM
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Hi Bobbyboy, and welcome.
Personally, I've found the lower keys easier to learn bending on. You tend to have larger tolerances for the tongue movements so they can be more forgiving. I think I first learnt to bend on a Suzuki Overdrive in Low F. Then I bought a Manji in A but found the same stiffness you mention. After some perseverance however, it seems a lot more playable now.
So whether I just got used to the harp or it needed breaking in, I couldn't say. I'm sure folks here would say the former. :)
I'd advise you to enjoy your other harps for now and come back to the Promaster at a later date - who knows, maybe you'll be pleasantly surprised...
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SuperBee
3630 posts
Apr 21, 2016
4:38 AM
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if you post up on the main forum with a provocative title like 'suzuki problem; warranty issue?', gary lehmann will pop up and offer to help.
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Bobbyboy
3 posts
Apr 21, 2016
10:11 AM
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I think I will have nullified my warranty if it was worth anything in the first place. Today I flattened the comb, de-burred the reed plates and reassembled. No difference at all. Took apart again a smeared a little beeswax between comb and plates and again, no different.
Think I will give up on this one.
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Bobbyboy
7 posts
May 07, 2016
8:12 AM
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Just an update on my Proharp woes. I finally gave up on it after reading of so many others having the exact same problem I was having with it. I sold it on evilbay and with the retrieved funds bought a Suzuki Bluesmaster in the same key of A. In my humble opinion this is a much better harp and I'm happy with it.
I'm slowly settling on a set of harmonica's in different keys that I'm happy with. So far I have a Special 20 in C, a Golden melody also in C with a custom aluminium comb fitted, a Lee Oskar in D and the Suzuki Bluesmaster in A. I'm now looking for another in G and I think that will cover all song keys my band plays in.
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ME.HarpDoc
146 posts
May 08, 2016
11:52 AM
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I love the Bluesmaster as well as the Harpmaster. To round out your choices, you may want to consider a Seydel in G. The Blues Session Standard (brass reeds) is pretty good at around the same price point but I think the Session Steel is a little better (stainless steel reeds). The different hole spacing takes a little getting used to but feel and sound is nice.
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Bobbyboy
9 posts
May 12, 2016
1:11 AM
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Thanks Harpdoc for the recommendation. I have not yet tried a Harpmaster so thats another possibility.
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Killa_Hertz
1328 posts
May 12, 2016
6:11 AM
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As said above, I think A is the easiest Key to play all around. But once you get down to G and lower the bending does get a little harder. Because the reeds are so long and you start to lose that ....hmmm.. something ... responsiveness. Higher keys such as Eb and F are tough because the reeds are so short that you lose that ability to really pull the bend way down. They are very responsive. So a happy medium is in the A - Bb Range.
The Session Steel Holes are similar to the Lee Oscar I think. I could be wrong. I love the Session Steel. By the models you have I would say that if you tried a Session Steel it would likely become your favorite harp. Especially with the 1847 covers. I like them both ways. The full length covers are nice, but the 1847 covers are just killer.
Also if you have yet to get a Marine Band, your missing out. The sound of a marine band is like no other. Im finding that Im gravitating back towards the marine bands more and more.
My main 3 Models are Manji, Marine Band ( 1896, deluxe, and crossover), and Session Steel. Between the three they pretty much cover all the bases.
Marine Bands for Chords, playing soft, and the ease of play is good for learning new things that are a bit challenging.
Manji just feels good to lay into. And it has its own unique sound aswell.
The Session Steel is somewhat in between the two. And is very comfortable to play TB. It also sounds very good amplified for some reason.
Anyhow I know im going way off topic here. So enugh outta me.
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Bobbyboy
10 posts
May 12, 2016
12:23 PM
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THat has not been my experience so far but that may just be my beginner status. I have found both my C harmonicas have been the easiest to play. So far I have tried three harps in A, the proharp, enough said, a Seydel session standard which I couldn't get on with and the Blusemaster which is much better than the other two for me at least especially on the third hole draws. I'm tempted to try a session steel but am afraid it will be just like the standard and hard for me to play. I have not tried a Marine band yet but did have a bluesharp which I moved on along with the seydey as it was very leaky and the second draw was very stiff. I am enjoying trying them all out even if it costs me a few bob. As said before we are all going to find our favourites eventually.
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SuperBee
3713 posts
May 12, 2016
4:15 PM
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Michelle LeFree said the best thing I've read about judging harps, that you can't rate the species based on meeting a couple of individual representatives.
Find the qualities you like. Playability can always be addressed.
You won't find consistent playing quality in any off the shelf harmonica.
I agree with what joe Spiers said in a recent thread which asked why so many pro customisers work on hohner marine band. Which is that they give up the good results with the least resistance.
But there may be other qualities you value, like full length covers, no side vents, recessed reed plates, thicker reed plates, steel reeds, welded reeds, bigger body, metal comb, Equal Temperament, quality construction,etc...
These are the things to settle on when it comes to selecting a stock harp model, IMHO. How well they play ootb is like a lottery, but that can always be addressed...see comments above re how easily it can be addressed though.
Hohner offer an 'artist setup' service. I've not tried it but it seems like a good idea. It's pretty much what I do for my clients who send me broken harps to repair.
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Killa_Hertz
1338 posts
May 12, 2016
5:00 PM
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Agreed. You have to set your reeds up right. If not you will likely not ever find a harp you like. What i mean is you ll never get a whole set of good ootb players.
I was rather pissed when i shelled out $109 for a seydel 1847 Noble and it was just as airy as any other $30 harp. Infact my first sp20 was the best ootb harp i ever got.
Anyhow, as Bee said ... if it feels comfortable and you like how the reeds feel and play than that's a model you should stick with. You don't have to go all out on the customising. A little proper gaping can go a LONG way.
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