Fil
281 posts
Feb 26, 2017
7:32 AM
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My hearing already is compromised. The jam I play normally is pretty moderate in volume, but last time it was LOUD. I kind of ignored the volume level, played my set. I've noticed since then that it seems to have impacted my hearing. Shit.... I have 'musician's' ear plugs that filter about 15 decibel of volume. (Didn't have them with me.) I've never used them on stagebut intend to start. Has anyone here used them? How'd it go? I'd hate to give up the jam, but will if I can't get folks to turn the volume down a bit.
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Phil Pennington
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MindTheGap
2174 posts
Feb 26, 2017
7:42 AM
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I'm with you on this. I'm keen to preserve my hearing and so I use earplugs. I always take them when I'm in an audience too. I can't believe the 'normal' level of volume used and people tolerate - I think it's especially band in small venues.
When playing, all it takes is a few loud cymbal crashes, or some over-enthusiastic guitar chords, and you get the ringing ears = damage.
15dB takes the edge off. I happen to use the 25dB 3M E.A.R. ones. If it's not so loud I can put them in loosely, it's still protects against the worst.
Last Edited by MindTheGap on Feb 26, 2017 7:45 AM
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Fil
282 posts
Feb 26, 2017
7:45 AM
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MTG, thanks. How do they, or do they, affect your playing? Can you still hear yourself? That's been my concern.
Cymbals? Yup, and next to drums in front of the lead gutar's amp. I was an idiot.
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Phil Pennington
Last Edited by Fil on Feb 26, 2017 7:47 AM
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MindTheGap
2175 posts
Feb 26, 2017
7:49 AM
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Fine I think, I'm not wincing so I'm more relaxed. People say there's a danger in everyone having earplugs as you all turn up to compensate! So don't do that :)
Since I'm playing drums at the minute, I feel it even more keenly as I'm nearest to the cymbals. Certain frequencies are more unpleasant - not sure if they are more damaging, but it feels like it. For me it's the sharp sounds, cymbals and loud guitarists chopping away at Telecasters on the bridge pickup.
Basically, if I experience any ringing afterwards, I know I need more earplug. If I don't I can tolerate a bit less.
The old expanding foam ones I used to use years ago were pretty muffly. But these new ones are much better I think.
Last Edited by MindTheGap on Feb 26, 2017 7:51 AM
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MindTheGap
2176 posts
Feb 26, 2017
7:52 AM
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Ha, next to the cymbals and in front of the lead guitar! Get those plugs in man! Quick!
You can't control what other people are doing, or sometimes where you stand. At least with earplugs you can take some control back.
Last Edited by MindTheGap on Feb 26, 2017 10:22 AM
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Killa_Hertz
2247 posts
Feb 26, 2017
10:51 AM
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I have pretty bad eyesight, but my hearing is pretty darn good. Almost supernatural .. lol. Seriously. So I try to protect it aswell. Because if I'm half Def and blind, I'm in trouble.
I wear earplugs to shows and concerts. They have some pretty decent ones out these days. I like the grey 32dB Hearos, but anything is better than nothing.
I even bought some cheap ones from walmart. They are Remington shooting earplugs. But they are the style with the three cups (just like my hearos) and they were $10 for 3 pairs. They work pretty great too. I think the cup style works best and really helps retain some of the high frequency. So you can still hear the dynamics of the music. Whereas the foam type really muffles everything much more.
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SuperBee
4543 posts
Feb 26, 2017
12:24 PM
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That's what I need. I can't stand playing in foam earplugs but I really need hearing protection. Although I think the drummer I've done the last 10 gigs with has played his last gig with us and his replacement will be less loud and fewer cymbals. I'm really hoping for a lower volume stage from now on. Yesterday the venue manager was pretty constantly on our case to play quieter, and effort was made but it was still pretty loud where I stood.
My ears are still hissing as I type.
I've been thinking about trying this product in the link below. Has anyone tried it?
isolate
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Fil
283 posts
Feb 26, 2017
12:28 PM
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The ones I have are custom molds, so fit great. The plugs are changeable, so I could put 25's in if necessary. The audiologist, to whom I've described the setting and music, thinks that the 15 db filter is sufficient. They are actually called music plugs. I'll give them a shot. In any case, I was stupid. You don't get a second chance with the ears. Having eye surgery in a week that will keep me away from harp for 2-3 weeks. I will report back on how the plugs worked after that.
As an aside to Killa...don't get old.
Bee, away from home, so don't have the brand. Were I to do it again, I would go for off the shelf plugs as Killa has done. What I have were quite expensive, what I thought was the price for the pair was the price each. Live and learn.
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Phil Pennington
Last Edited by Fil on Feb 26, 2017 12:39 PM
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MindTheGap
2177 posts
Feb 26, 2017
12:47 PM
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SuperBee - those 'isolate' earplugs look different to the ones now sold as 'musicians earplugs'. The ones I've got and other ones I've seen are that 3-cup design like Killa says, with a very narrow, hollow tube down the centre. I understand it's the tube that does the frequency response bit, lets a bit of sound through, and also allows the static pressure to equalise as you insert them.
But the 'isolate' ones look solid with no venting hole. They say they work through 'bone conduction' (now for the science bit, deja vu... ha ha). I guess they mean that if you stick your fingers in your ears you can still hear low notes via your skull, so it's true.
So I think the thing about the 'hole in the middle' ones is that you get a bit of the higher notes too, so it's a more natural.
I'd be a bit nervous about inserting the 'isolate' ones because of the pressure, unless I've got that wrong about the vent. At least the old-style foam ones you'd scrunch up first and then they'd slowly expand to fit.
Last Edited by MindTheGap on Feb 26, 2017 12:53 PM
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MindTheGap
2178 posts
Feb 26, 2017
12:51 PM
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Fil - custom fit ones sound good to me. Expensive I guess, but then you've got them now. Some of the off the shelf ones are quite expensive too. The interchangeable bits seem a good idea too.
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SuperBee
4546 posts
Feb 26, 2017
1:23 PM
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The isolate plugs have foam tips in 3 sizes which are expanding like normal foam. They recommend starting with the small size.
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MindTheGap
2201 posts
Mar 10, 2017
1:54 AM
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How's it going with the earplugs? Did you get the 'isolate' ones?
I mentioned I use the 3M E.A.R. ones, which are the '3-cup' style that Killa described. Well, they looked like they needed a clean last night, so I tried using a pin to clear the inner tube. Turns out there is a thin, rigid pipe within the plug itself. Its own aperture is much smaller diameter than a pin, so the pin pushed it out. I used some very thin fuse wire to clean it.
But it made me think that maybe these could have a 'dual setting'. They are supposed to be -25dB OOTB, but I wonder if with the pipe removed what they would be, maybe -10dB or so, which might suit better for the not-super-loud volumes I'm dealing with. I only need something to take the edge off. Although for listening to live music I'd use the full nine yards.
I will experiment and report back. How exciting.
Last Edited by MindTheGap on Mar 10, 2017 1:57 AM
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Fil
286 posts
Mar 10, 2017
6:26 AM
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Hi MTG. What I have are the Etymotic ER15 custom molded plugs. There are 9, 15, and 25db interchangeable attenuators. They are designed to reduce volume evenly across all frequencies.
No, I haven't had a chance to try them with the band. We went of traveling for a week or so and on return I had to have eye surgery #6 or 7 on my right eye for "chronic detachment syndrome"'. That's keeping me off the harp for a while yet. Very frustrating.
I intend to report how they do (or I do with them) as soon as I can.
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Phil Pennington
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Phil Pennington
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MindTheGap
2205 posts
Mar 10, 2017
8:23 AM
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Fil, oh yes I remember you said that was coming up, I hope it went ok? #6 or 7 - you mean the 6th or 7th operation?
Re the plugs, I see yours look like they more sophisticated than just a narrow tube in mine.
https://www.etymotic.com/consumer/hearing-protection/erme.html
They seem to be modelling this like an electrical circuit tuned to a resonant frequency. You know what kind of resonance that is don't you....
Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaagh!
It actually is though.
Last Edited by MindTheGap on Mar 10, 2017 8:26 AM
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Fil
287 posts
Mar 10, 2017
8:54 AM
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MTG, yes 6th or 7th op. My grandbabies are working up a new blues nickname for me. Shxt happens. It's a forced break from blowing on a harp, not all bad.
It's been fun following your trek thru the resonance swamp. Edifying, certainly,
I would say..." Hamwurst" resonance?
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Phil Pennington
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MindTheGap
2206 posts
Mar 10, 2017
11:36 PM
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Re eyes, oh dear. Doesn't sound like you're looking for sympathy but you've got it anyway! I've not experienced it myself, but I know someone who've had detached retinas, but just one operation per eye. They had to lie still for some time afterwards - the thing about a bubble of gas.
Re resonance trek - 'fun', 'edifying'??? Hmmm. I'm aware I must now be coming across as a dog worrying at a bone. I've crossed that line now! But for goodness sake, I reckon half of what's passed off on MBH as fact is suspect, half is gold. The problem is working out which is which.
I reckon the vibe we have here is better - take SkullKid's recent question about the blue 3rd. Two Harp Grandees put up teaching videos where they taught the wrong note. A beginner questioning a Grandee? - GASP! On the BF there's no problem about that. Just try that in the other place :)
Last Edited by MindTheGap on Mar 11, 2017 1:49 AM
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Fil
299 posts
Apr 21, 2017
9:54 AM
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Here's a FWIW follow up. I made it back to the jam last evening. I'd resolved to take my name off the board, or even bail off the stage if the volume was too high. I got the second set and it went all right. The drummer was good, as in very competent, and didn't hammer his kit. I hung around for the following sets. Set three seemed to incease it's volume quite a bit shortly into the first song, drummer much more animated and loud. It looked like, as has been described, the rest of the group was pushed to stay with the guy. I can't complain about the quality of his play, but my impression was that he was banging the drums as much as playing them. I hope I would have had that resolve to bail had I been up there.
MTG...'fun, edifying' only in an ironic sort of way.
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Phil Pennington
Last Edited by Fil on Apr 21, 2017 9:58 AM
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