|
beginner forum: for novice and developing blues harp players >
Picking songs to learn
Picking songs to learn
Page:
1
Fil
203 posts
Oct 28, 2016
3:01 PM
|
SuperBee alluded to something in his Blues Harp Collection Book review that I struggle with. Picking songs to learn that turn out to be a bit, or way, beyond my capability. It's related to something I think I commented on a while ago, that the nuances can be tougher than they first seem. I find myself stuck on a spot in a solo that just won't work out, either timing or note transition or.... Patience isn't one of my virtues, I guess. I have to inject some realism into my selections. But learning songs I think is the next big step for me to improve. Seems to be where I discover the techniques and their contexts I need to put time into. When I find a song that seems attainable, what seems to work best is listening to it over and over, playing it in my head, then picking up the harp and going back to using the slowdowner to isolate and slow a piece at a time. I'll tab out pieces that may be especially troublesome, but tabs without the song aren't helpful to me. But I've got to pick the right songs. Anybody else deal with this?
----------
Phil Pennington
Last Edited by Fil on Oct 28, 2016 3:03 PM
|
SuperBee
4223 posts
Oct 29, 2016
1:09 PM
|
One thing I noticed with Dave Barrett lessons on his site was that the instrumentals were progressive. So it seemed to me. Chorus 1 usually quite straightforward. A challenge in chorus 2, often around timing. I'd scan ahead and see chorus 4 had some scary stuff and chorus 5 looked impossible.
But what I found was that often the thing i learned in one chorus equipped me to deal with the challenge in the next
|
SuperBee
4224 posts
Oct 31, 2016
4:21 AM
|
This one is fun to play Fil
http://youtu.be/uIroe37zW1s
|
Killa_Hertz
1854 posts
Oct 31, 2016
5:04 AM
|
I really want to take another look at Daves Site. I REALLY want to be fully proficient TB player. But it feels a bit like starting over, when I was finally gaining some real traction. I think now that I know more his lessons will be easier to deal with.
Sorry OT,
Fil when I learn songs I don't even use the slow downer. (Just because I have no computer) So I do it the old fashioned way. Thats why my rewind button on my car CD player is all but falling off. Lol.
Fil (if you haven't yet) I HIGHLY recommend checking out Adams tradebit videos. Check the previews to see how adam plays it. If it's something your interested in learning and It seems like your speed, then download it. Not all of them do you really NEED the PDF for. So I tend to wait to download that to see if I need it.
They are really fantastic. They can get you going in the right direction. I download them to my phone, That way I always have them with me. I can practice anywhere.
I find they are great to go back to also. I find that even after you have learned it, watching the lesson again after you have progressed a bit in your playing, you hear and get different things out of it.
----------
|
SuperBee
4227 posts
Oct 31, 2016
5:16 AM
|
Gee whiz my posts keep disappearing. Anyway, check out my video of good morning schulmadchen I put in a new thread. Adams lesson for this is pretty cool and in terms of changes it works fine with the muddy waters track on I'm ready (for instance) but once you have that feel for it you can pick up some of what Portnoy does in that track I'm jamming to, which is maybe a little easier in some ways and then again maybe it's a bit more subtle than one might initially think. Anyway it's a fun time to play and will get you breathing and bending on the D harp
|
Killa_Hertz
1855 posts
Oct 31, 2016
5:49 AM
|
You know, that's one I haven't Downloaded yet. I think I will do that Today actually. It's time that I really get down alot of the standards. I'm wanting to start jamming at local Jams, So It's a good idea to learn all these. I've been playing Caledonia along with the Muddy Woodstock LP lately.
This one would be another great one to learn. I feel like I would be much more at ease playing a song that I already have most of the notes for. As apposed to sitting in with someone hoping I can get through a whole song with good improv.
----------
|
Fil
204 posts
Oct 31, 2016
6:55 PM
|
Thanks guys. I'm checking out Tradebits and have seen some of Will Wilde's vids of specific songs. They will help. I've had your sense that a lot of harp solos and breaks progress in their complexity, and went back to listen to some that I like. Good observation. Also, I went back to some of the songs and parts of songs I've learned over the past year and ran thru them. Like KH's comment in another thread, they sound better now, so some skills must be building. They don't kick me off the stage at the jam I get to a couple of times a month...something's working. Have a good gig, SB. Maybe rehearsal is overrated :>). Naw...I gig a few times a summer with a small local acoustic group that doesn't rehearse much. A little blues, more Americana. Pretty rough on the nerves sometimes when you want it to be right. But a ball all the same. KH, find a jam and go for it. Amazing feeling.
----------
Phil Pennington
|
SuperBee
4230 posts
Oct 31, 2016
8:08 PM
|
I was thinking about this stuff this morning as I walked in to work. I had a toot on a D harp while I walked, as an idea for a break occurred. But I was trying to figure what it is about solos. I figure in a 12 bar, each measure is 8.3% of the chorus. I was thinking about L'Walter's break in I'm Just Your Fool. The 2 measures over the IV chord are not totally straightforward for me. They required me to specifically work on them as a little exercise, kind of like a loop. It took me a few sessions before I could play it fluently. But the rest of that break is fairly repetitive and straightforward. I'd say if you can manage the lick in bars 1&2, you've got 3&4 and 7&8 down. Not that they are identical but the variations are not demanding. They're natural options and provide some insight into the possibilities of working one basic lick a few different ways.
So that's 50% of the chorus.
Then bars 5&6 required me to practice. It helped to slow it down and have a look at what David McKelvy thought was happening there. Then, when I thought I could play it, try to integrate it back in the song, realise that through slowing it down id lost the sense of rhythm of the overall song, so made myself aware of that, and then I've got 2/3rds of the break happening. Measure 9 is really just the same lick as bar 8 transposed to the V chord, or 3rd position if you like, so that's pretty easy.
At that point it felt to me I could finish the chorus out because I was heading to the turnaround. The turnaround is very close to one Walter used in Ah'w Baby and I just shift to automatic for that. I don't know if it's actually what he played but it's what I play and it 'works' harmonically and rhythmically so I let it flow at that point.
Maybe that turnaround is not exactly what he did in aw'h baby and maybe it's not exactly what he did in the intro to IJYF, but it's very close. Close enough for me.
In Billy Boy Arnold's teaching video, where he just kind of talks 'about' things and doesn't really 'teach' much, one thing he does demonstrate is a few turnaround licks typical of sonny boy 1 and shows how little Walter might do it.
I take from that that it's ok to turnaround a song in your own way, as long as it's a good way. Jerry McCain didn't even play a turnaround and that's ok too. So that's how I rationalise my approach to it. Of course, if you haven't been preprogrammed at some point you do need to learn some turnarounds so this is actually a really good one to learn.
I've drifted off my point some so to come back to that, this is the case in many songs that an instrumental might be constructed around just 1, 2 or 3 basic ideas. 1 idea, maybe in 2 halves, repeated in bars 1-4, a different idea or a different take on the 1st idea in bars 5-6, back to the first idea in 7-8, and then bars 9-12 range from simple repetition of the first idea, to something completely different. It's taken me a while to really get this in my bones, but the idea is simple enough.
Studying some little Walter has really been helping me.
I discovered this: in the past I've wanted to emulate his instrumental work. In hindsight I think that was not such a good idea. It's his songs which have maybe an intro and one or two solo choruses which I have found really instructive. Because I get bogged down in the instrumentals. Too much to learn.
I think 'Blues With A Feeling' is a great example. It's got great bones to start with, will teach timing, the bars 9-12 are just classic and not really that difficult, and the little flourish in bar 4 is instructive and quite doable with s little practice.
And it could be used in any number of slow blues, once you have the idea of how it works. I felt like I'd known it all my life and I've only been playing it about 8 weeks.
Ha, and then listen to what Butterfield did with it. That's another level. Is it better? I don't know but it's the start of a new era in blues harp. Maybe.
|
Fil
205 posts
Nov 01, 2016
9:09 AM
|
There is a whole lot of insight in this last post of yours. It has me thinking differently in some ways about this learning process. That's good. I listen to a lot of blues...always from the iPod on my long walks (running and rowing days are over) and long drives. More "analytical" listening as you seem to do I think will help me with this hurdle. As well as being satisfied with my "own way, as long as it's a good way." Thanks.
Edit....I've spent time working on instrumentals and have greater parts of a few of them down. My thought has been that it's an efficient way to get a lot of harp down. Lately, along the lines of what you've written, I'm not so sure either. It can seem more like a slog to the end after a certain point. Not fun.
----------
Phil Pennington
Last Edited by Fil on Nov 01, 2016 9:26 AM
|
Post a Message
|
