GermanHarpist
1525 posts
Jun 08, 2010
4:54 AM
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To anybody that hasn't tried music editing softwares. Audacity is really as easy as it gets.
I downloaded it yesterday for a jamming session and it worked like a charm.
You can find the link to the download in the forum how-to.
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YT - Music isn't created... it's evolved.
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528hemi
133 posts
Jun 08, 2010
11:36 AM
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Have you tried to load up a MP3 and then try to listen through your headphones while trying to play? You will heat a delay which makes it useless for that. I wish I could figure out how to get rid of the delay. IF you read on thier site it says there will be a delay. Just straight recordnig is fine.
528hemi
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GermanHarpist
1531 posts
Jun 08, 2010
1:36 PM
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Why don't you just play the mp3 with whatever player you use while recording and then just load it into audacity later and syncronise it manually? Haven't tried it, but I'm pretty sure it should work.
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YT - Music isn't created... it's evolved.
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isaacullah
1002 posts
Jun 08, 2010
1:39 PM
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If you have a fast processor you can set the latency down to where you will not notice it. Also, replacing the default windows audio drivers with a "real-time" audio driver like ASIO-4ALL will help you get the latency down even further.
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nacoran
2042 posts
Jun 08, 2010
2:46 PM
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Isaac, you should put together a master list of all the hacks and workarounds you have for recording!
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Nate
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MP
455 posts
Jun 08, 2010
7:43 PM
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oh, i thought you meant i had a lot of audacity.
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Jim Rumbaugh
232 posts
Jun 08, 2010
8:35 PM
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I record and overdub with Audacity.
When over-dub, I listen to the track, but tell Audacity not to play what I am recording. You do not hear the delay. After the recording , I delete a short piece of the new track in the begining to take out the delay. It works fine by my standards.
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GermanHarpist
1533 posts
Jun 09, 2010
1:48 AM
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Thanks Jim, that was what I meant, but you said it better.
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YT - Music isn't created... it's evolved.
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jim
138 posts
Jun 09, 2010
2:39 AM
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YES. Audacity is useless for overdubbing. Unfortunately, it will record with a lag, off-beat, as if you had no sense of rhythm at all.
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sorin
175 posts
Jun 09, 2010
7:25 AM
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Audacity is not useless and doesn't record with a lag....Isaaculah is right , it's your computer , your soundcard and the audio driver that are not capable of recording in real time.I use Audacity very often without any single problem, recording tracks on top of other tracks while I play tracks .
All you need is a discrete soundcard ( doesn't have to be expansive ) that supports Asio drivers , something like this Creative Sound Blaster ebay $20 , you can get one even cheaper than that , just make sure it supports Asio drivers , and make sure you have the right slot in your PC to install it .
Last Edited by on Jun 09, 2010 7:26 AM
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nacoran
2051 posts
Jun 09, 2010
9:26 AM
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Audacity crashes a lot on my computer, but when it works, it works well.
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Nate
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jim
143 posts
Jun 09, 2010
9:39 AM
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don't get me wrong, it's a nice free app. But I never could use it to record multitrack.
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isaacullah
1004 posts
Jun 09, 2010
10:12 AM
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And even if you don't want to/can't install better audio driers, you can easily re-align the tracks after recording them. However, there is a better, but also COMPLETELY FREE true multi-track audio recording/manipulation suite: Ardour. You have to have linux or mac, but it is directly comparable to protools or other full featured enterprise DAW software. Because Ardour works with JACK Audio, you can link any sound sources to any track, and you can also route any individual sound source through any other JACK-enabled bit of software. That means I can use JACK-Rack (multifx DSP software), Hydrogen (a drum-machine), a sooperlooper (looping software), any kind of software synth, etc. all "live" on my computer, and record all to a true multi-track editor. Then I can adjust my mix, and master a final cut. Ardour is the real deal, but it has a MUCH steeper learning curve than does Audacity. Audacity is perfect for what it is and what it does. There is nothing else out there that I know of the can compete with audacity for ease of use/low learning curve and with the amount/quality of the features included.
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jim
144 posts
Jun 09, 2010
10:16 AM
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I am on a hackintosh (osx 10.5.8) Thanks man, I didn't know about Ardour. I'll take a look!
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isaacullah
1005 posts
Jun 09, 2010
10:21 AM
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"Look man, any other multitrack editor records with no lags."
This is because enterprise (ones you pay for) DAW's come with their own proprietary audio drivers that they use instead of the default windows sound drivers (direct show, or other). Because Audacity is a free open source project realted to track recording and manipulation,it is beyond it's scope to also develop, maintain, and release a real-time audio driver that will work on all OS's. So you have to use drivers that are developed by other teams that are OS specific. On Mac, I would probably use JACK. On linux, I certainly do use JACK, but PulseAudio works well with Audacity too. On a PC, your best bet for a free and open source real time audio driver is ASIO-4ALL. Once you install the real-time driver, you then have to edit Audacity's prefs to 1) use that driver, and 2) set the latency down as low as you can go. On my old windows laptop, I was able to get it down to about 30 milliseconds, which was more than adequate. If you set the latency lo, you will here "pops and clicks" in your recorded track. These occur because of buffer under-run (not enough time for the software to write the audio data to the track). You have to increase your latency step-wise until you no longer get the pops and clicks. Also, Audacity has a built-in latency correction feature that, once you know your latency setting, you can set so that it will automatically realign your overdubbed track with the original as soon as you stop recording it. You just enter the amount of time you want to move the track back (ie, your latency setting), and it will do that every time for you, automatically.
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isaacullah
1006 posts
Jun 09, 2010
10:22 AM
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PS. All software is "useless" if you don't take the time to figure out how it works. I'm not directing this at anyone, but merely stating it as a general truism.
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528hemi
137 posts
Jun 09, 2010
11:04 AM
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isaacullah,
I installed ASIO-ALL and do not see the driver in audacity. Is taht becuase my built in soundcard does not support it? or it should still show up as an option?
Thanks 528hemi
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isaacullah
1007 posts
Jun 09, 2010
11:28 AM
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Hmmm... It should show up as an option under the Preferences>>Devices>>playback devices/recording devices. I will have to check this on my windows machine, but that will have to be done later, after I get home from work.
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XHarp
388 posts
Jun 09, 2010
1:06 PM
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Geez Issacullah, first inventing things, then building your own mics, then modifying your own amps, and now all these smarts on recording and software?
You truly are the McGiver of the MBH forum. Have you found a way to clone yourself for free yet?
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"Keep it in your mouth" - XHarp
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528hemi
138 posts
Jun 09, 2010
5:14 PM
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Isaacullah,
I unchecked playthough and set the latency to -200 and now my recording is in sync with the mp3 I loaded.
I am sure the built in sound card is the issue why I cant have the playthrough checked and listen to my playing with the mp3 playing as well. My soundcard is builtin to the board. It is usable now anyhow. Iwill look to get another soundcard if I decide I want to hear and play with software play through. The driver does not show up as an option for me.
528hemi
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isaacullah
1009 posts
Jun 09, 2010
5:27 PM
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Ah... Yes, I read recently that software playthough is still unstable in the current version of Audacity, especially on older sound cards. I would certainly not use that feature on most systems. Interesting that ASIO does not show up as an option after you installed it. I use linux now (for everything), and I have a range of audio drivers to choose from in those settings. I'll read up on ASIO-4ALL compatibility with Audacity and see if there is a special trick one has to do (it's been a while since I mucked about with it on windows).
Just to clear this up for other readers, "software playthrough" is the ability to hear the digital version of your analog input in the monitor (ie. hear yourself play) in addition to hearing the other tracks play as well. Disabling software playthrough will not "mute" the other tracks on record (although you can certainly choose to do that if you want. It's a different setting), but will only not let you hear what you are currently playing into your microphone in the monitors. Usually, you can hear yourself playing anyway, so this is not a big issue. It will be a cool feature when they get the bugs out.
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Last Edited by on Jun 09, 2010 5:31 PM
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isaacullah
1010 posts
Jun 09, 2010
5:38 PM
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I found this statement floating out in the interweb when i did a search for ASIO4ALL and Audacity. Maybe this solution will work for you?
"Your problem is ASIO4ALL. It doesn't work with MANY sound cards. You should look into buying a cheap ASIO card. Many of the Creative Audigy cards have it. You can get a 4-5 year old one for $20-30 bucks on Ebay. It will be completely worth it.
If you don't want to go out of your way to buy an ASIO card, try a program called Audacity. It's a free multitrack program. What you'll want to do is mix down your FL Studio song, open it in Audacity, and record through there. Audacity allows you to record with the Windows standard audio device."
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528hemi
140 posts
Jun 09, 2010
7:30 PM
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Thanks Isaacullah...Like you mentioned the playthrough is cool with headphones if/when it works.
I will check into an external soundcard but at this point I am happy for what it provides without the Play through and again if anyone is having issues set a negative value for the latency until it syncs up. My value was -200 and it is perfect!
The ASIO4all is installed and working as I have other software programs that lets me select the driver with my current soundcard so it is really dependant on how the application is written.
528hemi
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528hemi
141 posts
Jun 09, 2010
7:49 PM
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I found the answer. Basically Audacity does not access the ASIO4ALL driver directly. You need a sound card that supports this driver and then you select the soundcard from the audacity preferences to use that driver/soundcard combination.
In Audacity it will not show up because Audacity does not directly handle the driver options and make it selectable or make the controls available.
However, if you use the system level ASIO4ALL control panel to map ASIO4ALL to the soundcard and select the soundcard in Audacity it does work at the system level. Audacity just does not know it is. The reason for the system level control panel is so you can use ASIO for software that does not directly use ASIO drivers. The other problem with Audacity is that it introduce more latency than Kristal does so it will never be perfect except on a very high end PC.
So it is true that Audacity does not directly support ASIO but you get some help at the system level with ASO4ALL on none ASIO devices.
528hemi
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isaacullah
1011 posts
Jun 09, 2010
8:04 PM
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Ah, yes. that makes a lot of sense. thanks for finding that out. Yeah, I've used Kristal too. It's pretty good as well, and you most certainly CAN use software playthrough with Kristal. This thread should be archived (GH?) so that future arrivals to this forum can have access to the info we've managed to snoop out! :)
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oldwailer
1271 posts
Jun 09, 2010
8:23 PM
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I just downloaded a new Audacity in beta--it works on my Vista operating system. I was bummed when I lost Audacity because of going to Vista--so I was glad to get it back.
However, I'll be damned if I can remember why I ever liked it. Reaper works much better for me--I probably wouldn't have found that out if I hadn't lost Audacity.
Reaper is not free software, but the download you get for free to try it out is fully functional, and you can just go on using it indefinitely if you wish. I paid for it once--then they upgraded and my license is expired now. It still works fine though--I just have to go through a few nag screens now and then.
Reaper only costs $60 to buy a license, which is apparently good until you upgrade to the next major release. Just don't upgrade, and you'll never have to pay again.
With my system I can do endless overdubs and never have a problem with latency--and it works great with the ASIO drivers for my Alesis MultiMix8 mixer.
If you love to patch free things together, like Isaac, (and I totally admire your courage and energy in doing that)--then Audacity might be the way to go--but, for $100 for an Alesis mixer and Reaper software--add a couple of mics and a computer that I had anyway--I have a system that will record up to 8 tracks at the same time, then allow overdubs to clean it up or add additional parts. There is also a full library of EFX that you can add--I've never learned how to do that though. . .
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528hemi
142 posts
Jun 09, 2010
8:51 PM
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Oldwailer,
Thanks for that. I just downloaded reaper to evaluate and within 15 minutes I was recording with play through and using the ASIO drivers...
Zero lag and seems real easy to use. Dont need any new soundcard!!!!
Good bye audacity. :)
528hemi
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isaacullah
1012 posts
Jun 09, 2010
10:05 PM
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If you are going to drop some cash, I would buy
this Lexicon USB mixer. It's only 68 bucks, comes multi-track recording software (don't have to pay for separate software), one XLR low-noise microphone input, two TRS line inputs, a hi-Z 1/4" instrument input and two TRS and RCA line outs, one 1/8" high powered headphone output, and connects to your computer and is powered via USB. All with a well known brand name. Hmmm... Is it christmas yet?
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