toneguy86
1 post
Feb 04, 2016
9:16 AM
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All all...new here. Been a player for a lot of years. I found this on a search to figure out why it seems Hohner has discontinued their MS series reed plates...or at least it seems that way. AND why in the hell the reed plates (if you could find them) cost freakin more than a new harp.
Anyway...I'm a bit frustrated. I have been using Blues Harps and Pros mostly, but am intrigued by the Big River, which is a tad cheaper.
So...long story short. I want a decent quality harp (Hohner preferably) that is in that price range of aroound $25 online that give the best tone and bang for the buck. I always thought Big Rivers were cheap cousins...maybe things have changed.
Thanks for any help or ideas...Mark
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Piro39
93 posts
Feb 04, 2016
10:43 AM
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IMHO Hohner has become a very backward thinking company. Their constantly increading prices are absolutely outrages and we keep paying. There are other less expensive options like Suzuki.
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barbequebob
3133 posts
Feb 04, 2016
11:02 AM
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@toneguy86 -- Actually, Hohner has NOT discontinued the MS reed plate series at all, so clearly you are misinformed here. In fact, for the US, here's a link:
Hohner Reed Plates USA and Canada
MS Reed Plates Everywhere Else In the World
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Sincerely,
Barbeque Bob Maglinte
Boston, MA
http://www.barbequebob.com
CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
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Gnarly
1643 posts
Feb 04, 2016
11:05 AM
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Rockin' Ron has the Bluesmaster in D on sale for $33 delivered, and it comes with a one year warranty that includes reed failure.
The Bluesmaster resembles the SP20, so I don't know if that is to your liking--ABS comb comes out to the front, unlike the typical sandwich construction.
Some folks crazy 'bout 'em, others has to leave it be.
Edit: He also seems to have the Big River in A for $25.
Last Edited by Gnarly on Feb 04, 2016 11:06 AM
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toneguy86
3 posts
Feb 04, 2016
12:54 PM
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As far as the reed plates, I did find one site in my search that did say they were discontinued and Kevin's harps has them listed as "out of stock." I'm glad they are available as I have a lot of MS class harps.
What I like about Hohner (and you may be right about be backward company) is the overall tone as compared to say..Huang or Lee Oskars (I really don't like the Oskars...to bright and brassy sounding to my ear). How would you describe Suzukis. I'm just looking for a decent affordable harp. Interchangeable reed plates are nice but not if they cost more than a new harp.
Let me rephrase this then...what are your all's favorite harps (brands and models)? If I am an old (and I am) Hohner user...what else would you recommend.
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barbequebob
3137 posts
Feb 04, 2016
1:03 PM
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@toneguy86 -- Kevin's Harps (which later became Harp House) has been out of business for many years and so I'm not surprised how CLEARLY misinformed you are.
When Kevin's was around, the MS reed plates being sold as replacement plates in the US were the Cross Harp reed plates, which uses a thicker reed plate (do NOT confuse that with thicker reeds, which is something ENTIRELY different) and personally, I feel were better than the stock reed plates used on Blues Harp/Pro Harp/Big River models. Now they sell the original stock plates along with the Cross Harp plates as well as the MS Meisterklasse reed plates, which were essentially the same as the Cross Harp plates, except that the reed plates were nickel plated.
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Sincerely
Barbeque Bob Maglinte
Boston, MA
http://www.barbequebob.com
CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
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A440
513 posts
Feb 04, 2016
1:13 PM
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@toneguy86 - if you like the MS Blues Harp, just shop around for Big Rivers or Blue Midnights on sale and then use the reedplates from them in your Blues Harps. You'll find the Big Rivers and Blue Midnights from time to time in the 20-25$ range.
Yes, Hohner replacements reedplates are over-priced.
Last Edited by A440 on Feb 04, 2016 1:15 PM
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nacoran
8917 posts
Feb 04, 2016
1:29 PM
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BBQ, please don't be so grumpy! You're a great contributor to the forum but I've noticed you have been kind of grumpy lately, especially with new members. Please keep in mind that we are a diverse community and always try to be welcoming to new members. It's what keeps this place running.
Toneguy, good to see you got logged in. I'm partial to Lee Oskars, but I do hear a tone difference between them and the Hohners (depending on the Hohner model). They are tuned closer to ET than the Hohners, which may be what you are hearing.
Harp is a tough instrument to shop for since you can't test them out first. I've only played one Huang, and it was second hand and terrible. My Lee Oskars are really reliable and suite my style of play (and budget). Seydel makes nice harps, and Suzuki does too.
I've got a Suzuki Manji that plays great and sounds closer to a Marine Band than a L.O., to my ear at least. I like the sound of the Blues Harp but they tear up my lips. Right now, the state of the industry seems to be that you can get quality harps from Hohner, Seydel, Suzuki, and Tombo (Lee Oskar), and maybe Hering? People also like the Bushman Delta Frost. They had supply issues at one point and have been know to ship slowly, but you can buy them through a middleman shop like Rockin Rons and get them quickly.
If you've got some harps with busted reeds you might also look for a repair guy. There are several good repair guys on the forum who can get an old harp playing cheaper and better than a new one. The trick seems to be in shipping costs. Since they have to ship both ways if you send in just one harp the shipping cost eats up a lot of the saving, but if you have a handful of harps it's a good deal.
The Big Rivers are the cheapest of the German made Hohners. Anything cheaper than that will be Chinese. Budget is always an issue, but the Marine Band and the Special 20 are just a little more and are great instruments. (I prefer the plastic combs of the Special 20s myself.) And of course there are more expensive harps.
Try checking out Rockin Rons:
http://www.rockinronsmusicsd.com/harmonicas.html
He has a great selection and delivers harps faster the speed of sound. (He lists Easttop harps too, but no Herings at this point.)
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Nate
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toneguy86
4 posts
Feb 04, 2016
1:48 PM
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BBQ...I am misinformed I guess. That's not new :-) I had a buddy that used to sell stuff through him so that was the first place I went but thanks Nacoran for the tip on Rockin Ron's. I'll go there. I may end up trying on Suzuki or something else just to see.
I'd love to know more about repair stuff. I have boxes of old reed plates and Golden Melodies and SP20s that I just can't bring myself to throw away and it'd be cool to be able to use em again.
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Gnarly
1644 posts
Feb 04, 2016
2:00 PM
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If you have lots of old harps and plenty of time, it's easy (and fun!) to bring them back to life.
Lots of info on the web, bottom line is that you can replace the (probably) single reed that you blew out with one from another harp.
I do it for customers, but if you have the urge and the time, go to town!
Experiment first with the least likely to survive, the Cracker Barrel (or Chinese, Bluesbend et al) harps that you have ferreted away.
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toneguy86
5 posts
Feb 04, 2016
2:21 PM
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Anyone played Bushman Delta Frost harps? They look interesting.
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Gnarly
1645 posts
Feb 04, 2016
2:22 PM
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http://www.amazon.com/Bushman-7-C-Delta-Frost-Key/product-reviews/B000KITSWI
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toneguy86
6 posts
Feb 04, 2016
2:30 PM
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Reviews don't look so good. Suzuki Manji...maybe? I'm hesitant...but it's a key I don't use a ton. Although I do need reed plates for other keys as backup.
Are the .9mm plates the ones. They have thicker ones but only in Bb...or at least that's what I saw.
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The Iceman
2810 posts
Feb 04, 2016
3:48 PM
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Toneguy...what kind of boxes of Golden Melodies do you have? I prefer GM's that are at least 20 years old - have a full set from years ago, but am always on the look out myself...
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The Iceman
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dougharps
1148 posts
Feb 04, 2016
3:50 PM
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IMHO
I like Delta Frosts just fine. They are comparable to a special 20, though I would give the Special 20 an edge in my preferences. DFs are a little raspier sounding, and to my mind, louder. I have a set of Bb, F, C, G, D, and A that I bring to gigs as backups. I have used them successfully during gigs from time to time. I also have a couple high G DF harps that I use for fast playing in D.
After adjusting gaps (which I do on all stock harps) I can play the 6 overblow easily on my DFs. I can OB on the 4 and 5 sometimes. I think that some of that is my need to improve playing OBs those notes, since it is the same with Special 20s. The 6 OB is the one I use most often when playing, because it works well in blues.
Delta Frosts bend easily and are pretty tight, so you don't need to play them hard. I would take a Delta Frost over an MS Hohner Big River or Blues Harp any time! Some indicate that they are like the Suzuki Harpmaster. I haven't played those to make a comparison.
The harps I usually play in my first string kit are a mix of Deak Harp customized Marine Bands, Crossovers, and Marine Band Deluxes. I also play several Seydel Session Steels, three Seydel 1847s, several Manjis, and a few Suzuki Blues Masters. I have many Lee Oskars from before I switched from them. EDIT: Suzuki Blues Masters are on a par with LOs, in my opinion.
My least favorite harps in order from poor to playable are Huang Silvertone, Pocket Pal, Suzuki Folkmaster, Big River, MS Blues Harp, & Lee Oskars. Lee Oskars are durable, but airy. I gigged with them for years before other harps improved. With adjustment LOs can play the 6 OB without squeals.
Delta Frosts are decent to play, and if you buy the reed plate and comb combination you can put on some old covers (with a little modification) and have one pretty inexpensively. Some of mine are put together that way, some were bought complete. They are gig worthy harps.
YMMV
EDIT: My favorite non-custom harps in no particular order are Hohner MBDs and Crossovers; Seydel 1847s and Session Steels, and Suzuki Manjis. Next would be Special 20s and Delta Frosts.
My choices for best harp brand keep shifting, except for the Deak Harp customs being my favorites. I am sure I would like customs from the customizers on this board, too, if I could justify the expense!
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Doug S.
Last Edited by dougharps on Feb 05, 2016 7:47 AM
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Seven.Oh.Three.
297 posts
Feb 04, 2016
4:02 PM
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I'm surprised no one has asked how old is your harp that needs replacing? If it's newer do you go through harps quickly? I ask because it could be a breath control problem. I'm a oddity in that in 5 years of playing (learning and amusing myself no gigging at all) I've never blown out a harp. So dropping some cash on a harp isn't a big deal to me. But if you're blowing out reeds regularly maybe it's time to work on your breath control....
If these are old harps then you've gotten your money out of them and you could just buy more of the same if you're happy with the tone/playability you get from the MS series. Or try another harp.
Since you asked "what are your all's favorite harps (brands and models)? If I am an old (and I am) Hohner user...what else would you recommend."- I started on the Hohner Blues harp because I figured I wanted to play blues so I'd buy the "blues harp" made sense at the time. I moved on to Marine Bands which I liked but hated the nails. Finally settled on the Marine Band Deluxe and like them a ton. I've tried the Seydel 1847 and wasn't thrilled with it.
7.o.3.
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shakeylee
498 posts
Feb 05, 2016
7:42 AM
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hi toneguy!
i am not a huge hohner user,but i think if you like MS harps,the blue midnight is the best bang for the buck. i get them very,very cheap.
my own preference is suzuki manjis,harpmasters and bushman delta frosts.
i also use hering and huang harmonicas,and sometimes seydel or hohner.
sometimes i make harps with a mixture of parts from several brands.
i find if i go through a box of old harps,i can sometimes make a working one out of two or three broken ones.
if you are anywhere near philly,you are welcome to stop by and hear different brands and models.
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www.shakeylee.com
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digitalshrub
19 posts
Feb 05, 2016
8:03 AM
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Hey toneguy!
Hohner Blues Harps have been my go-to for the last five years or so. I really like wooden combs, and have always enjoyed the tone from the Blues Harps as well. Occasionally I've added a Special 20 to accommodate a missing key from my collection. There's quite a bit of love for SP20s on this forum, though I've never shared the degree of enthusiasm some folks have about them. I like SP20s, but they feel strangely less resilient than the BH to me. I will say, I find the non-recessed plastic on the SP20 to be better adapted to tongue block embouchure.
Since I've been playing with tongue block more frequently, I took care of a couple missing keys in my stash with some brands I had not previously tried: Seydel and Suzuki. A lot gets said about both brands on this forum. I love the Seydels. I got a Blues Session and Session Steel. The coverplates are perhaps a little oversized but I really like the mouthfeel of both models, and the tone is great too. The Session Steel has my vote. Though it's pricier than the Hohner options (Blues Session is comparable, and a better harp for the money than an SP20, IMHO).
The Suzukis I got were both Promasters (one in Low F, one in Paddy Richter tuning). Personally I would not recommend these harps. They're heavy as hell. I don't care for the metal combs either. Tone isn't bad but I can't help feeling like I'm putting a carburetor to my mouth. So metallic.
My next harp will probably be a Seydel 1847 Silver. Lots of great reviews for those, though the price point will make it difficult for me to get more than one key at a time.
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barbequebob
3139 posts
Feb 05, 2016
8:18 AM
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Rockin' Ron's at this moment is the best online harmonica specialist store going. About 10 years ago, the big three online were F&R Farrell (ESPECIALLY when it came to buying chromatics and for a time, the ONLY place where you could get replacement reedplates for Hohner chromatics at a discount), Kevin's Harp (later known as The Lil' Harp House, and Coast To Coast Music. The first two are now long out of business and now Coast To Coast is owned by the same people who now own Harp Depot and by many accounts, they don't have a good reputation.
When you deal with a harmonica specialist store, at least you're dealing with people who KNOW the instrument well wheras buying in brick and mortar stores or online stores that mainly deal with guitars/keyboards/sound systems/drums as a general rule tend to be largely clueless about the instrument.
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Sincerely,
Barbeque Bob Maglinte
Boston, MA
http://www.barbequebob.com
CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
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harpwrench
1062 posts
Feb 05, 2016
9:10 AM
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If your stashed SP20's are in decent shape except the typical blown 4-5 draw, and not the really old ones with nails inside, it might be worth having them repaired. Some guys pretty much destroy a harp by playing them until there are several bad, those aren't good candidates. If you go price shopping on the repair route be aware everyone doing it doesn't do exactly the same stuff. You can check out my services and see if I offer something you can use.
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www.spiersharmonicas.com
Harp repair and upgrade menu
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Goldbrick
1300 posts
Feb 05, 2016
9:58 AM
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I like the raspy sound of the Delta frost- but prices have gone up and I dont think they are worth close to $40
I like the Blue Midnights u can find them on Amazon for $20 on sale often and I change the covers to Blues harp covers ( I have a bunch and like the feel)
I am not a special 20 guy--they just feel flimsy to me
My favorite Hohner is the Marine Band deluxe- they are a bit more expensive so I only have them in my most used keys A.C. D and F
best cheap harp I have played is the Suzuki Folkmaster-- I have a few as truck harps they play fine with a little gapping and I always grab a couple on Amazon when I see them for $10
At the end of the day-- if u suck an expensive harp doesnt make you any better and a good player can make a pocket pal sound great
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toneguy86
7 posts
Feb 05, 2016
12:37 PM
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Thanks for all the suggestions.
Iceman...I have one GM stashed. It's a C. Liked it at the time, but that was awhile ago. As I said...can't bear to throw it out.
Shakeylee...unfortunately I'm in WI. I'll dig through my boxes. Repairing harps is just something I haven't dug into yet.
Goldbrick...that sounds like a plan. Blue Midnights. I need a G and maybe a backup D by next Friday...
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www.bigroadband.com
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toneguy86
8 posts
Feb 05, 2016
1:07 PM
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I gotta say...Rockin Ron's is a great place. Thanks for the tip. Great customer service. I'm going with a Suzuki and a Blue midnight.
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www.bigroadband.com
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shakeylee
499 posts
Feb 05, 2016
7:53 PM
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rockin ron's is awesome !!!
i am pretty sure you will like the suzuki. i like manji and harpmaster.
BTW,sometimes i see blue midnights for cheap enough to just use them as reedplates.i think a blue midnight on a custom comb ,or a sanded blues harp comb,would be a decent harp.
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www.shakeylee.com
Last Edited by shakeylee on Feb 05, 2016 7:54 PM
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shakeylee
500 posts
Feb 05, 2016
8:13 PM
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oh,and by the way,ron's has the reedplates for your MS,sp20 and GM.
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www.shakeylee.com
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toneguy86
11 posts
Feb 10, 2016
9:55 AM
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Update on my harp search...
I ended up getting a Hohner Blue Midnight and a Suzuki Blues Master to replace another harp. I really like the sound and feel of the Suzuki. Nice harp. I'll buy more. I like the Blue Midnight initially. There was one hole on the top end that seemed odd for some reason, but after playing it for awhile, it seemed to smooth out and it works fine. I'll use it for sure. May even break that one out this coming weekend...
Thanks again for all the help at advice. Oh...and Rockin Ron's is the best too...
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www.bigroadband.com
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The Black Pit
46 posts
Feb 11, 2016
4:30 PM
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It's purely personal preference. You'll find what YOU like eventually and probably realize that other's opinions will mean little to the harps that sound and play best to you. That being said, I went to see a damn good local player a few months back. After the gig we BS'd for awhile and he showed me his gear. His harp case consisted of mostly Big Rivers, a Golden Melody and a chromatic. Nothing expensive, yet he found what works for him, and he sounded great.
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Gnarly
1650 posts
Feb 11, 2016
4:36 PM
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@TONEGUY86 Glad you bought a Suzuki--I am the official repair guy, one year warranty includes reeds going south so play that one as much as you like--800-854-1594, my extension is 4410. I am, however, only there Tue-Thurs and Daron is in San Antonio at a convention (we assume he is also doing pub research for the upcoming SPAH, to be held there in August).
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Crawforde
66 posts
Feb 11, 2016
5:10 PM
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The Suzuki Bluesmaster used to be my favorite diatonic harp. Smooth comfortable and easy to play, it was my first non-Hohner and I loved it.
Enjoy!
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mlefree
567 posts
Feb 12, 2016
4:04 AM
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Two things I've learned about buying harmonicas.
Like a lot of other things in life, you get what you pay for. It's tough enough learning to play a fine instrument.
This is especially true when you are starting out. You don't want the quality of your instruments holding you back. You want to eliminate the harmonica as the limiting factor in your playing progress.
Toneguy, if you like Blues Harps, you really should try one premium harmonica like a Marine Band Deluxe or a Seydel (either brass or steel reeds; they make great harmonicas). Suzuki makes terrific harmonicas, usually easy to okay right out of the box.
Which brings me to my second point. You are comparing apples and oranges until any OTOB harp is set up for your style of playing. Which is to say that all serious harmonica players should learn to set their own reed gaps.
If you buy a Manji, MB Deluxe or Seydel and learn to set their gaps, you will enter an entirely different harmonica world than you have been inhabiting so far.
Good Luck and keep with it!
Michelle
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Last Edited by mlefree on Feb 12, 2016 4:04 AM
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toneguy86
22 posts
Feb 15, 2016
8:08 AM
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Gnarly...thanks so much. Love that harp. It just saw it's first gig Sat. night. Let's just say I'm sold on Suzuki...
mlefree...got that big time. I talked to two other great players Satureday who I respect who have their own take and techniques for setting gaps on their harps...and for totally different reasons. My one buddy (a guy that got me started as a harp player actually) also uses Hohner Meisterklasse pretty much exclusively, except for a nice Seydel Low F. Got me thinking about trying a nicer harp just to see the difference.
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www.bigroadband.com
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mlefree
575 posts
Feb 15, 2016
10:07 AM
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If you have the good fortune to try a Suzuki, DO NOT lose that receipt!
Michelle
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SilverWing Leather - Custom leather creations for musicians and other eccentrics.
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MrTom
1 post
Feb 15, 2016
1:59 PM
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Hello.. I'm new here as well. I've been playing since the 1970's. I love hohner harps and I have some Special 20's.. I bought them a while back when they were about $20.00. Now they are close to $50.00. A lot of people seem to not like cheaper harps.. but I've always had good luck with them. I play a Jambone brand in this original song:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uM4i89H6Jag
Last Edited by MrTom on Feb 15, 2016 4:27 PM
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hvyj
2965 posts
Feb 15, 2016
6:10 PM
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Besides gapping, which is pretty easy to learn how to do, the problem with most OOB harps is inconsistentcy in how flat the combs are. Decent after market combs usually dramatically improve performance, especially if you also sand the plates.
MS Meisterklasse have terribly airy combs OOB. Replacing them with aluminum combs from Blue Moon dramatically improves playability even without sanding the plates. The only OOB harps I have on which I haven't replaced the combs are my sets of Suzuki Hammonds and Firebreaths and original Hohner Meisterklasse. Of course, if someone wants to flatten the OOB combs and has the capability of doing so, that would also solve the problem.
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nacoran
8938 posts
Feb 16, 2016
11:07 AM
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Hi MrTom. Welcome to the forum. I've never played a Jambone, but I've Hohner Piedmonts and had a couple that played really well. One was actually my go to D harp for a while. It was a lot of hit and miss though. (I was broke and the free case was a nice feature and it filled out some keys until I had the budget to get better ones.)
I do remember someone, a long while back, commenting that, out of the cheap harps, Jambone seemed to be something that you could fix up a bit and with some gapping they worked pretty well.
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Nate
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