New but determined
5 posts
Nov 25, 2015
9:43 AM
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My Excellite X-100 Phillips clearly would not be suitable to use to remove the cover plates on my new Crossover. It's the one I use on my Sp20's and Manji's but without even trying, I can tell it won't fit the cover plate screws/bolts, not sure how it's put together but I'm guessing it's a two piece connector like the Manji uses. What works and is excellent quality. I don't need to take this apart yet- OOB it's perfect- that's a wow, huh, but I'm guessing at some point I'll need to do some adjustments, or at lease round off some sharp edges in the back corners of the cover plates.
Last Edited by New but determined on Nov 25, 2015 9:44 AM
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New but determined
6 posts
Nov 25, 2015
12:57 PM
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My research reveals that this is a problem, that Japanese made JIS ( Japanese Industrial Standard) might work but the Hohner Crossover cover plate screws strip the heads easily. But- RockinRons carries stainless steel replacement sets for under $9. I don't know what the reed plate screws require in the Crossover or if they are just the same as in the Sp20.
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timeistight
1901 posts
Nov 25, 2015
1:41 PM
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It's a Pozidriv; size PZ1, I believe. Wiha makes nice Posidriv screwdrivers.
Last Edited by timeistight on Nov 25, 2015 3:34 PM
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SuperBee
2986 posts
Nov 25, 2015
3:06 PM
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most stripping experiences with crossovers result from use of force resulting from assembling the pieces with poor alignment. Being made of brass they don't stand up to force very well. even a well-fitting screwdriver can chop them out in this circumstance. not just the heads are at risk. if you strip a head, you can cut a slot to take a straight blade, but if you strip the thread, its scrap
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Destin
146 posts
Nov 26, 2015
7:54 AM
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I PURCHASED ONE FROM GREG, HIT HIM UP AT
greg@1623customharmonicas.com
IT WORKS GREAT
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groyster1
2825 posts
Nov 27, 2015
7:11 AM
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my screwdriver set came from home depot....works fine...but don't over torque
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New but determined
16 posts
Dec 01, 2015
4:29 PM
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My friend has one of those screwdriver sets I've seen at Home Depot and the #0 Phillips works on the Crossover cover plate screws perfectly, I don't think I've ever used a Phillips screwdriver that small before.
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Owen Evans
98 posts
Dec 01, 2015
9:15 PM
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The brass screws holding the cover plates are very soft and will strip easily, as will those holding the reed plates. I have used one Wiha Posidriv PZ1 with the reed plates over and over without stripping them. If you get 2 of them you can use one as an anchor and the other as a driver to tightly secure the cover plate screw and base. Once you do strip them they are easily replaced with stainless steel nuts and bolts which are tougher and don't strip. Hope this helps.
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SuperBee
3015 posts
Dec 01, 2015
9:32 PM
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i don't believe the crossover has brass screws in the reed plates. it isn't the bolts which strip, its the brass threads in the reed plates. it helps to keep track of which bolt came from which hole, and also make sure they are going in easy...if they bind, back out and start again. this is not a screwdriver issue though.
the heads are made for posidrive.
you don't need to do up any of these fasteners (reedplate, covers)'tightly'. over-tightening is common and detrimental.
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hvyj
2840 posts
Dec 01, 2015
10:44 PM
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Rockin' Ron sells stainless steel replacement cover screw sets that have straight slots for an ordinary screw driver.
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JInx
1123 posts
Dec 01, 2015
11:52 PM
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+1 too tight is too much, it's a delicate little thing
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Last Edited by JInx on Dec 01, 2015 11:52 PM
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Owen Evans
101 posts
Dec 05, 2015
6:18 PM
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@Superbee - Thanks for the correction of the reed plate screws not being brass but being made for Posidriv. Once the brass is stripped on the plate there are 2 options: (1) Re-tap the plate with a larger tap & change screws or (2) Use an M1.6 x 10 mm. stainless screw & nut. And while on this subject, when the brass cover plate hardware strips; replace them with M2 x 10 mm. stainless screws & nuts. All stainless can be had with Philips, Slot or Hex heads.
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FastFourier
10 posts
Dec 29, 2017
9:47 PM
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@ New but determined: I'm looking for a screwdriver to take apart a Special 20. You said:
"My Excellite X-100 Phillips clearly would not be suitable to use to remove the cover plates on my new Crossover. It's the one I use on my Sp20's and Manji's ..."
But the Sp20s don't have Phillips head screws, so why would you use the Excellite Phillips? Am I missing something?
For some reason, I haven't been able to find a screwdriver recommendation for the Sp20 on this Forum. Thanks.
Last Edited by FastFourier on Dec 29, 2017 9:53 PM
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SuperBee
5157 posts
Dec 29, 2017
10:42 PM
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Haven’t heard from NbutD for a long time FF.
But sp20 do have Phillips on the Reedplate.
Or they used to. I’m actually not sure they haven’t gone to posidrive now.
I just use a posidrive on them anyway. They just have to be snug. I do find quite a few I would regard as overtight,
Last Edited by SuperBee on Dec 29, 2017 10:45 PM
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FastFourier
13 posts
Dec 30, 2017
7:59 AM
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Here's my recently purchased SP20. It has regular screws on the cover plate.
Last Edited by FastFourier on Dec 30, 2017 8:15 AM
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barbequebob
3458 posts
Dec 30, 2017
8:28 AM
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The reed plate screws require a Pozidriv#1 and Wiha makes the absolute best quality ones, hands down. A Phillips #1 can be used since those are brass screws but be VERY CAREFUL not to over torque it because both the slot that the screwdriver goes into as well as the threads on the screws can get very easily stripped.
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Sincerely,
Barbeque Bob Maglinte
Boston, MA
http://www.barbequebob.com
CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
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MP
3533 posts
Jan 02, 2018
4:02 PM
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Ditto Pozidrive #1 by Wiha. Now Hohner recommends a Pozidrive #0 and I have a Hohner Pozi #0. It's a bit too small.
By the way, Hohner often over-torques their Pozi -Drive screws. Ive noticed stripping on the top male screws.
As a rule I use the bottom female end. That reads kinda sexual doesn't it?
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Reasonably priced Reed Replacement and tech support on Hand Made Series Hohner Diatonic Harmonicas.
'Making the world a better place, one harmonica at a time.
Click MP for more info. Aloha Mark
.
Last Edited by MP on Jan 02, 2018 4:08 PM
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barbequebob
3459 posts
Jan 03, 2018
8:36 AM
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If Hohner is now using a Pozidriv#0, that obviously means the very newest stock is using that as of this moment and who knows how long the stock that's been around in 98% of brick and mortar music stores have had them in their inventory.
MP, I agree with you 100% on using Wiha because they're the hands down best in the business by 1000 country miles just in terms of quality alone and are the least prone to making the slot the screwdriver goes into strip but when the Pozidriv screws are stainless steel, it takes very little torque to strip the crap out of them and brass tends to hold up better in this regard.
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Sincerely,
Barbeque Bob Maglinte
Boston, MA
http://www.barbequebob.com
CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
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SuperBee
5170 posts
Jan 03, 2018
12:50 PM
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I know the thread title is about Crossover but that was a long time ago.
The resurrection is about the sp20
There are no brass screws in a sp20
Some of the older ones have screws which are brass plated, but they’re steel screws.
I’ve never stripped a thread from a special 20 screw and I’ve installed many thousands of screws in them.
The reedplate screws of course thread into brass threads. The screws do sometimes bind in the plates, if this is ignored and they are forced, they will cut the threads out of the plate. Years ago one of my clients drew my attention to an article by Steve Baker, in which he advocated keeping track of the screws and putting the same screw back into the same hole. I was sceptical at first, but the seed had been sewn, and I began the practice of making a routine of how I took the screws out and laid them down so I could put them back in the same hole.
I’ve continued to do this as I found I do indeed have far less trouble with binding threads since following this practice.
If a thread does bind, don’t force it. Back it out and try again. Usually they will go in easily but you must get them started right.
The cover plate screws in a special 20 are steel screws with slotted heads. Again, brass plated. They use a flat nut. I’ve never had a problem with these other than rust. They can rust very quickly. Some folk are in the habit of washing their sp20 harps without disassembly. You can do this but I think much better to take them apart so the grit is actually removed and the parts dry properly. If left to soak, the cover plate bolts will rust.
Use whatever flat blade screwdriver works on the cover plate bolts. I have a pair of wiha drivers I use on most harps.
If you don’t over-torque the Reedplate screws I doubt there’ll be any problem with the heads.
The story is the same for Crossover reedplates but the expensive cover plate bolts are a different story. I’ve seen heaps of these with rounded-out heads. Yes, use a posidrive. Wiha #1 is good.
Butdon’t overtighten them.
And importantly, probably the main thing is to ensure they fit together well. I mean make sure the harp is correctly assembled so that the cover plate bolts can fit through the cover, reedplate and comb from both sides, allowing the male and female parts to mate straight on to each other. 90%+ of the problems ive seen with these bolts are due to incorrect assembly of the sandwich, where the cover plate bolts are forced into a non-perpendicular mating. If they don’t fit together easily, you need to go back and slack off the Reedplate screws and realign the Reedplates on the comb then snug them up. If you need to test the fit by trying a collar nut in each corner on both sides, so be it.
It can be tricky but it’s worth doing properly. When the cover plate bolts can go together easily there is unlikely to be any problem with the threads or heads, unless you’re a total drongo about over-tightening.
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MP
3534 posts
Jan 03, 2018
3:08 PM
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Thanks Bob! I've learned a lot from you over the years.
Bee writes-
"The reedplate screws of course thread into brass threads. The screws do sometimes bind in the plates, if this is ignored and they are forced, they will cut the threads out of the plate. Years ago one of my clients drew my attention to an article by Steve Baker, in which he advocated keeping track of the screws and putting the same screw back into the same hole. I was sceptical at first, but the seed had been sewn, and I began the practice of making a routine of how I took the screws out and laid them down so I could put them back in the same hole.
I’ve continued to do this as I found I do indeed have far less trouble with binding threads since following this practice.
If a thread does bind, don’t force it. Back it out and try again. Usually they will go in easily but you must get them started right."
Yes! I do the same thing . All screws in exact order from holes they came out of.
Also-
"The cover plate screws in a special 20 are steel screws with slotted heads. Again, brass plated. They use a flat nut. I’ve never had a problem with these other than rust. They can rust very quickly. Some folk are in the habit of washing their sp20 harps without disassembly. You can do this but I think much better to take them apart so the grit is actually removed and the parts dry properly. If left to soak, the cover plate bolts will rust."
Ditto on that! I keep bottles of screws and nuts for all models. If I drop a reed plate screw from a pre- Progressive SP/20 and can't find it in the carpet or under the coffee table I have a bottle full of 'em. I like the new Hohner reed plate screws. I hope they don't change them again.
Series where they used wider un-plated
----------
Reasonably priced Reed Replacement and tech support on Hand Made Series Hohner Diatonic Harmonicas.
'Making the world a better place, one harmonica at a time.
Click MP for more info. Aloha Mark
.
Last Edited by MP on Jan 03, 2018 3:10 PM
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groyster1
3061 posts
Jan 04, 2018
11:05 AM
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the screwdriver set Ive used came from home depot.....inexpensive with different bit sizes.....the key is to NEVER overtorque the screws.....this set has worked very well for me
Last Edited by groyster1 on Jan 04, 2018 11:07 AM
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