Harmonicatunes
32 posts
May 10, 2015
1:07 AM
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Many of us, myself included, go for low impedance vocal style mics. I use the Audix Fireball V, others use Shure SM58s and 57s, with the "Bulletizer" versions from Greg Heuman at BlowsMeAway.com recent and welcome additions.
When plugging these mics into an amp or effects pedal, they need an impedance convertor. I found this out 5 years ago, 25 years after I should have. If you use one of these mics, and have not tried an impedance convertor, then do it. The improvement is substantial and immediate.
Problem is, most impedance convertors are a bulky attachment on the end of a mic cable, just waiting for someone to bump it and damage the input socket of your amp.
Unless of course you use the Audix T50k impedance convertor, which has a short cable between the two connectors, thus solving the bulky attachment problem.
I am about to recommend a mic to a new student. I was thinking of the Audix Fireball V as a good all rounder, but couldn't find anyone retailing the necessary impedance convertor. I emailed Rockin Ron, a week later it was on his site, for $24.95
You can find it here: http://rockinronsmusicsd.com/index.php?_a=product&product_id=475
So. Get one. Thank me later. Better still, buy me a beer if ever we should meet.
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Tony Eyers
Australia
www.HarmonicaAcademy.com
everyone plays...
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Danny Starwars
150 posts
May 10, 2015
3:52 AM
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Can I ask supremely ignorant questions without being mocked? (At least, not out loud, HA?)
I have a modern Green Bullet and an SM57. Would those be high impedance and low impedance, respectively?
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My YouTube Channel - Any Likes or Comments appreciated. :)
http://tinyurl.com/muchtcc
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marine1896
138 posts
May 10, 2015
4:14 AM
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shure_SM57
oops sorry forgot...
http://www.shure.co.uk/products/microphones/520dx
http://www.greenbulletmics.com/DATING_the_ELEMENTS.html
Last Edited by marine1896 on May 10, 2015 4:35 AM
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Danny Starwars
151 posts
May 10, 2015
4:41 AM
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Thanks for that. So - I get all confuzzled. Both my mics have a jack like a guitar and I use them for amps. Would the SM need an impedance adaptor?
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My YouTube Channel - Any Likes or Comments appreciated. :)
http://tinyurl.com/muchtcc
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marine1896
139 posts
May 10, 2015
4:56 AM
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Hi,
I have never been into SM57 or Green bullets but I did find this...
http://www.modernbluesharmonica.com/board/board_topic/5560960/922048.htm
Hope that helps I have a little idea, but right now I'm trying to haggle some tasty vinyl so I'm back and forth haha.
Last Edited by marine1896 on May 10, 2015 5:03 AM
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marine1896
140 posts
May 10, 2015
5:02 AM
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Actually Danny if you read the OP he tells you exactly what your asking.
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belfast_harper
392 posts
May 10, 2015
5:42 AM
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Although I have a fireball V and think it is a great mic for the money I wouldn't recommend it to someone as a great all rounder mic, it is too clean for my tastes when plugged straight into an amp.
An SM57 is a great allrounder, works well for acoustic & amplified harmonica and can be used for vocals and to mic amps or other instruments.
Last Edited by belfast_harper on May 10, 2015 6:12 AM
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Gipsy
149 posts
May 10, 2015
8:47 AM
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Hi Tony. Good to see you here. I'm a student at the academy.
I've actually gone down a slightly different route after picking up on your article about an ART pre amp.
I have an Audix V 5 as well as a an old shure stick mic bought second hand on eBay. They are both XLR low Z mics. I feed them into the ART using an XLR lead without an impedance matching device, output using instrument 1/4 jack cable to amp, and then twiddle with the input and output knobs. If I want a grittier sound, more input knob and less output knob and vice versa.
More of a potch than an inline impedance matcher, but more room for shaping the sound.
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shakeylee
273 posts
May 10, 2015
9:34 AM
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to answer danny starwars question:
yes,your 57 is low impedance .it could benefit rom an impedance converter .
a modern 520 is normally high impedance. however,not too long ago they made them with both high and low impedance and left it up to the buyer or the retailer to decide how to wire it.
so,it wouldn't hurt to check the impedance of your 520 either!
GOOD LUCK.
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www.shakeylee.com
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Barley Nectar
802 posts
May 10, 2015
9:44 AM
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I feel that Audix missed the mark on the Audix T50k impedance converter. They should have used a right angle 1/4" plug on that transformer...BN
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harmonicanick
2222 posts
May 10, 2015
11:25 AM
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57 can go straight into pa low Z
57 needs a convertor to go into a guitar amp
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Greg Heumann
2996 posts
May 10, 2015
4:15 PM
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It almost isn't a question of whether it could benefit from one. The most common way to hook a low impedance mic to an amp WITHOUT one is to use an unbalanced XLR to 1/4" mono cable. But this is technically completely wrong - doesn't even connect to one of the mic's signal wires - so it references only the other signal wire to ground, which is had way between. You not only get an impedance mismatch, you only get half of the mic's signal. The secret is in the difference between balanced and unbalanced wiring standards. Unless you WANT to only get half of your mic's output, then you MUST use a proper low-Z hookup, which means a BALANCED (XLR to XLR) cable + an impedance matching transformer. (There are also some XLR to 1/4" adapters that don't work for the same reason but they're fairly rare.)
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***************************************************
/Greg
BlowsMeAway Productions
See my Customer Mics album on Facebook
Bluestate on iTunes
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Komuso
575 posts
May 10, 2015
7:28 PM
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Doesn't a digital effects unit do the same thing?
For example, I'm mainly using a stock Strnad mic for rack harp at the moment, which afaik is medium impedance @ ~3k ohm
(I'm using the rough definitions of impedance:
1. Low Impedance (less than 600?)
2. Medium Impedance (600? - 10,000?)
3. High Impedance (greater than 10,000?)
from http://www.mediacollege.com/audio/microphones/impedance.html )
The specs of the zoom G3 show it's output impedance is either low or high, depending whether you choose a line or XLR out (specs are below snipped from manual)
From the G3 I'm using the line out into a steinberg UR-44 audio interface Line in.
I've noticed even if I just use the G3 in bypass tuner mode (which bypasses FX but is still apparently boosting the input) I get a much hotter signal than plugging the mic direct into the UR-44.
G3 specs (the ? is Ohm as the copy paste screwed it up):
Input Standard monaural phone jack
Rated input level -20dBm
Input impedance 1M ?
ACTIVE/PASSIVE (switch selectable)
Output R Standard monaural phone jack
Maximum output level:
Line: +5 dBm (with output load impedance of 10 k ? or more)
L/MONO/PHONES Standard stereo phone jack (line/headphones)
Maximum output level:
Line: +5 dBm (with output load impedance of 10 k ? or more)
Headphones: 20 mW + 20 mW (into 32 ? load)
BALANCED OUTPUT XLR connector
Output impedance
100 ? (HOT-GND, COLD-GND), 200 ? (HOT-COLD)
PRE/POST (switch selectable)
GND LIFT (switch selectable)
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Paul Cohen aka Komuso Tokugawa
HarpNinja - Learn Harmonica Faster
Bringing the Boogie to the Bitstream
Last Edited by Komuso on May 10, 2015 7:35 PM
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Harmonicatunes
33 posts
May 10, 2015
7:47 PM
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Hi Greg. Thanks for putting us straight here. And for all the great products that you make.
I've recommended the Audix T50k impedance convertor, for the reasons outlined above. But that's just my view.
Which one do you recommend?
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Tony Eyers
Australia
www.HarmonicaAcademy.com
everyone plays...
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Danny Starwars
152 posts
May 10, 2015
8:43 PM
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@shakeylee - Thanks man!
@marine1896 - You're totally right. It was 4am and I wasn't paying enough attention.
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My YouTube Channel - Any Likes or Comments appreciated. :)
http://tinyurl.com/muchtcc
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BigBlindRay
247 posts
May 10, 2015
10:06 PM
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Has anyone tried the Neutrik NP2C-T10AA?
http://www.neutrik.com/en/audio/plugs-and-jacks/c-series/np2c-t10aa
This looks like a great option for a custom cable job.
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- BigBlindRay
BigBlindRay website
Like me on Facebook
Listen to my music here
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Harmonicatunes
34 posts
May 11, 2015
12:08 AM
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Hi Ray!
Looks very cool. A custom cable with this at one end and an XLR connector at the other would do the job.
Assuming that the transformer is decent
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Tony Eyers
Australia
www.HarmonicaAcademy.com
everyone plays...
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Shredder
402 posts
May 12, 2015
8:15 AM
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Whirlwind impedance matching transformer. Great tone. I had the Audix transformer before and did an A/B with them. The whirlwind had better tone.
I play heavy Blues, Classic rock, Country, Alternative and Swamp pop music with my working band. I use the Audix Fireball most of the time. I've been complimented numerous times on the quality of my tone and sound. For me the Audix is the all around best fit for what I'm required to do. That said, I also use one of Greg's Ultimate 57's when I need a gritty/dirty harp sound. The problem I hear with most competent harp players is they all sound the same. Yeah their dirty and in your face but there all the same tone for the most part,C/M- C/R- Ceramic elements distorted sound. I find with the Fireball I have the ability to get a dirty sound and then fall into a clean sharp sound with the Fireball. With the 57 I'm stuck with a distorted sound to my ears. I can make it sound cleaner with playing technique but it's still got that dirty edge to it. I tried to sneek it "57" in one time while playing a clean pretty song and the front man ask what was that distorted sound coming from my amp? Greg stated I had one of the older sought after elements in my 57 when he modified it for me so I know it's a good mic. Just my 2 cents and what works for me. Mostly what I'm trying to say is be diverse in your sound and tone. I'm a harp player and still I can't listen to bullet styled playing all night long or thru a whole CD. Like Adam said before , don't be afraid to move up to the 2nd floor with your harmonica playing.
Mike
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1847
2332 posts
May 12, 2015
9:15 AM
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barley that is a great idea audix did miss the mark on that
shredder i have two fireballs one to mic the amp
it works great for that. i also like somewhat diverse sounds
it would be hard to listen to a whole album recorded with a green bullet
moderation is the key. i have several crystal mics they can get clean to overdriven
the neutrik transformer looks ideal...... how much are those
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Greg Heumann
2997 posts
May 12, 2015
9:28 AM
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@Ray - that's a cool product I didn't know about. It still needs to be wired to an XLR connector or cable plus XLR connector at the other end, and at about $25 for that connector alone, we're talking a pretty expensive IMT to use it. I have ordered a couple to check them out, but 10:1 is awfully low for an IMT. Most are 50:1.
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***************************************************
/Greg
BlowsMeAway Productions
See my Customer Mics album on Facebook
Bluestate on iTunes
Last Edited by Greg Heumann on May 12, 2015 9:29 AM
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1847
2335 posts
May 12, 2015
9:30 AM
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gotta love the spam filter
lets see if this takes here is a link
REDCO
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isaacullah
3006 posts
May 12, 2015
10:36 AM
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I use this "pigtailed" one: http://hosatech.com/product/mit-156/. I did replace the thin cable and 1/8" plug with a thicker cable and a right-angle plug. Makes a huge difference in the way the "pigtail" hangs off your amp. With the right-angle plug, it's much less possible to knock the plug and damage the jack (especially if the amp fell over or something), and it just looks more professional (IMHO). Easy to do with 5 minutes on the soldering iron.
EDIT: Note that I probably should have chosen their other IMT: http://hosatech.com/product/mit-176/. The version I have only has a ratio of 1:4, but the other one is 1:250. That said, it still makes a very noticeable difference for me, and it also allows me to plug direct into a camcorder (with adapter) and get loud enough without totally over-driving the camera's audio input.
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YouTube! Soundcloud!
Last Edited by isaacullah on May 12, 2015 10:44 AM
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timeistight
1769 posts
May 12, 2015
12:20 PM
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RapcoHorizon make cables with the Neutrik IMT at one end:
http://www.rapcohorizon.com/p-67-n-microphone-cable.aspx
I got a short one on sale at Tom Lee a couple of years ago; works great!
Last Edited by timeistight on May 12, 2015 12:51 PM
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1847
2336 posts
May 12, 2015
1:35 PM
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rapco makes great cables
they gave me one with a screw on connector once
i'll never forget them great people.
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dougharps
914 posts
May 13, 2015
8:28 AM
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I use a Shure A95UF or A95U depending on whether I am going low z mic to high z effects/amp, or high z mic to low z PA. The 1/4" female adapter allows a high z guitar cable or patch cord pigtail to the amp from the transformer. With the A95U you can plug your high z mic in the 1/4" and run a low z cable to the board. This means you don't ever have a transformer sticking out of the amp or PA that could accidentally damage the jack if you bump it.
I also have an double sided screw on connector that will connect the high z mic directly to the A95U transformer instead of using the 1/4" female adapter, but it makes the mic assembly pretty long and unwieldy.
I have used these successfully for many years.
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Doug S.
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Stokes Bay Slim
63 posts
May 13, 2015
1:38 PM
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ShureA85F
A85F
Line Matching Transformer
The Shure A85F is a low-to-high impedance microphone-matching transformer used to connect a balanced low-impedance microphone output to an unbalanced high impedance input on a mixer/recorder.
from
$20.00
pardon my ignorance on this subject but would this do the trick for putting an SM57 or SM58 into a guitar amp? If so it is a relatively inexpensive option. Sorry I don't know how to post an image of this but it is on the Shure website of course.
Last Edited by Stokes Bay Slim on May 13, 2015 1:51 PM
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Greg Heumann
3000 posts
May 14, 2015
8:51 AM
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@Stokes: Yes, but there are a bunch of different Shure units in the A95 line and not all will have the connectors you need. They're also a little longer/heavier than others.
This is what BlowsMeAway Productions is FOR!! I am an amplified harp player who has been learning about amplified harp for YEARS. I sell the Whirlwind Little IMP IMT for $19. Suggestion: Support the harp community and buy it from me?
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***************************************************
/Greg
BlowsMeAway Productions
See my Customer Mics album on Facebook
Bluestate on iTunes
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Stokes Bay Slim
64 posts
May 15, 2015
11:44 AM
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Thankyou Greg for your answer and suggestion.
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