Danny Starwars
86 posts
Mar 31, 2015
6:40 PM
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All my 'good' harps are Special 20s (I want to branch out a bit), and a friend visiting from the States brought over a Hohner Rocket for me.
One thing I really really like about the Rocket is the rounded ends - good God, why didn't that happen sooner lol? It's much more comfortable on my hands.
But I have mixed feelings about the Rocket's side vents. While the back gaps (wider) add greater projection, I find the side vents seem to make it harder to get a good 'wah' effect when playing acoustically. The Special 20's lack of vents make it easier to get a more dramatic difference between cupped and open.
Any other SP20 players had a play with a Rocket for a while and have some comments? I'm only just getting used to mine.
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Popculture Chameleon
53 posts
Mar 31, 2015
6:57 PM
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I started on the special 20 as well until I got a hold of my first Rocket. I had trouble with the wah effect going acoustic as well. Basically what I did was try and find and experiment with different techniques in creating the wah. Cupping technique is key here if you want to continue however I have found that mimicking the wah wah sound with your lips while playing can work with some decent breath control. I myself don't like playing accustic that much because I loved the amplified sound of the harp- I use a Shacker Mad Dog mic. More than small enough for me to still use the hand cupping technique however rom time to time I still try to find different ways to come up with the same sound. try getting creative and stick with it. I still plan to use my special 20 harps. When I am doing solo gigs and performances I will use the rockets. Its loud tone is perfect for that. If I am practicing with a group Ill use the special 20 so I wont be as loud as a lead guitar or the singer. hope that helps a little best of luck
Last Edited by Popculture Chameleon on Mar 31, 2015 6:58 PM
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groyster1
2760 posts
Mar 31, 2015
7:56 PM
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the rocket is louder because its vented....Ive had many sp20s opened in the back and always like the result....with the price difference would as soon stick to sp20
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indigo
82 posts
Mar 31, 2015
8:32 PM
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I just close off the vents with some blue tack for amped harp.Even used chewing gum sometimes.
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SuperBee
2506 posts
Mar 31, 2015
11:33 PM
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ive played only one Rocket. i liked it. you can put tape inside the cover to close off the vents if you think its a problem. or put sp20 covers on them.
i dunno, i play vented and closed covers and i just don't think its a problem but maybe i'm not paying attention
the rocket uses all 8 screws to hold plates to comb, plus the cover plate screws. the one i played seemed a little more airtight than the average Sp20. comb is a little nicer and i think the harp plays a little easier.
worth the money? maybe, but if the price difference is an issue, maybe not. i think if i was starting a set now, knowing what i know now i'd be content with Sp20s.
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Harmlessonica
108 posts
Apr 01, 2015
4:43 AM
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Danny - with all due respect - I don't think anyone with hands like yours should have any problem with wah effects.
You probably just need to get used to adjusting your normal hand position slightly. Dave Barrett showed various options in one of his videos (even taking advantage of vents), often involving holding the harp close against your cheek. It might not work so well for bearded folk but it's worth experimenting.
You might even find the louder harmonicas have the potential for better wah effects due to the greater contrast between the muted and unmuted sound.
Last Edited by Harmlessonica on Apr 01, 2015 4:44 AM
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isaacullah
2977 posts
Apr 01, 2015
10:41 AM
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I've not played a rocket, but Spec 20 is my main harp these days. that said, I've still got a lot of Marine Bands in my kit. The trouble with hand Wha's is an issue with those MB's for me too. I've solved the problem by sealing off the side vents with this metallic aluminium ducting tape, which I cut a sliver of to cover the vents. Applied correctly, it's un-noticeable. Covering the side-vents also darkens the tone, and improves projection. I like that tone much better than that of a vented harmonica.
EDIT: I believe you can get that aluminium adhesive tape in narrow widths, so you wouldn't have to trim it (this 1/4" width would be perfect). I just had a role of 2" width tape left over after doing some duct work at my house, so that's what I use.
Last Edited by isaacullah on Apr 01, 2015 10:45 AM
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Danny Starwars
87 posts
Apr 01, 2015
7:45 PM
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Annoying; I was hoping not to have to mess about with tape etc.
Harmlessonica - the way I hold a harp, the left vent is uncovered but the skin on my hand is pretty close, but the right vent is open completely. No matter how I move my hands the difference between cupped and open is never as great as the SP20, given that it has no side vents.
And no worries on the noting of the size of my hands lol; we're all friends here :P
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ted burke
161 posts
Apr 02, 2015
12:53 PM
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I think Special 20's have it all over Rockets for ootb playability and tone. The downsides is the relatively short life span compared to the Rocket.
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SuperBee
2509 posts
Apr 02, 2015
3:17 PM
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Hi Ted, I'm interested in how you have concluded the Sp20 has a shorter lifespan than the Rocket. This seems counter-intuitive to me, given they use not only the same reeds but also the same reed plates.
My sample size is 1 rocket and no idea how many sp20s. I'm rarely playing the same harp for long and I don't play gigs regularly anymore. I lose track of which harps I'm playing as especially in keys C and A I have so many I actually am not sure how many. I'm not sure how long it's been since one wore out. Actually I am not sure whether they do really wear out. I guess they would eventually but I'm more inclined to the notion that players break them. I think it's more often about traumatic events rather than hours of use. But it's just an idea I have; untested. But I believe that when a reed is aggressively played in a bend at the edge of the practical range, it is stressed and develops a weak spot (a crease, or kink). Depending on the degree of stress there are only so many such events a reed can withstand before it becomes too weak to play normally. By this stage it may have even fractured. I think this is why I see so many broken 5 draw, 4 draw, 6 draw and 9 blow reeds, and so few broken 2 draw and 3 draw reeds, which really get played just as often if not more, and loudly, but probably not so often hit sharply and bent to the limit.
Last Edited by SuperBee on Apr 02, 2015 3:46 PM
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isaacullah
2980 posts
Apr 02, 2015
3:56 PM
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FYI, I just checked the hohner parts shop website to see if they are selling Rocket combs yet. No dice. Spec 20 combs go for $12, though, so hopes are hi that they may eventually start selling Rocket combs for a reasonable price (better than the very expensive X-over and MB deluxe combs, anyway). IMO, if you could get some Rocket combs to transfer all your Spec 20 parts to, thems would make for KILLER harmonicas...
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A440
344 posts
Apr 04, 2015
11:50 AM
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The reeds and reedplates are identical on the Rocket and the new (Progressive) SP20. Between the combs, I prefer the SP20 due to hole size and geometry. I find I am not as accurate/clean with the Rocket comb. The open back covers project nicely on the Rocket, but I'm not a fan of the side vents. I don't think the price difference is worth it. So I'll stick with SP20s, and if I want to spend more, I will take a XO or MBD over the Rocket.
I see no reason why a Rocket would last longer. If anything, I would expect it to die earlier because the comb and covers force more air over the reeds, pushing them harder and stressing them more than a SP20 would.
I'm still nostalgic about the old SP20 covers with the accordian man logo and the words Marine Band. So when I buy a new one, I swap the cover with my old one. I've got a full set of SP20s that look very cool on the table, all with those "classic" covers, even if 2 or 3 have the progressive reedplate/comb under the hood.
Last Edited by A440 on Apr 04, 2015 12:00 PM
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ted burke
162 posts
Apr 04, 2015
3:07 PM
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It's my impression that SP20s are famous for going sour after six months or so of continuous playing. That's been my experience over the decades. I have had my rocket for about that length of time, have played it hard and often since I purchased it from Ron, and it still sounds like the day it came out of the box.
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Ted Burke
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SuperBee
2517 posts
Apr 05, 2015
4:36 PM
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It's interesting that you've had that experience Ted. I've only had somewhat brief experience of most sp20s I've seen, and I don't keep track of how much I play my own. Usually I gravitate to my solid comb types with vented covers.
I'm inclined toward the expectation expressed by A440, but things don't always work out the way one might expect, and an observation that contradicts intuition is often a prompt for discovery
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ted burke
164 posts
Apr 06, 2015
7:01 AM
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I haven't actually played SP20s extensively for about seven years now since I began playing Hohner Crossovers and some models Suzuki and Seydel harmonicas. I wouldn't be surprised if they have more longevity than they used to. Of course your mileage may very, harp to harp. As is, I much prefer the sweet tone and rich expressiveness of the SP20 however long it stays in shape over the Rocket, which does not quite "give" in the bending as much I would like.
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Ted Burke
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isaacullah
2982 posts
Apr 06, 2015
7:56 AM
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In 12 years of daily harp playing, I have only broken one special 20 reed. This as opposed to several marine band and seydel reeds. In fact, my first real harmonica was a D spec 20. Still have it and play it, 12 years later.
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mlefree
284 posts
Apr 07, 2015
4:02 AM
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My experience with Special 20s echoes that of isaacullah. Still my go-to harps, though since I repair my own and have dozens of donor harps I have not tried the Progressive model nor do I plan to.
Michelle
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