SmokeJS
302 posts
Oct 19, 2014
5:43 AM
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Except for some family connections I'm not much of a Facebook user but noticed there's a posting from Blue Moon Harmonicas for soon to be available custom combs for the Special 20 in aluminum, brass, acrylic and Corian.
My Special 20's are either fully customized Andrew Zajac harmonicas or ones worked on by me and then tweaked by Andrew. In both cases the combs are stock as there seemed to be no other choice. Flat sanding the top of the draw plate is the main way leakiness has been decreased.
While I have little interest in increasing the weight of my harmonicas by using a metal comb I'm wondering if there's likely to be any benefit using custom Special 20 combs other than aesthetics?
Thanks!
EDIT: Please note that what's truly new to me is that these custom combs recess the reedplates just like Hohner's Special 20 comb. That's one of the main reasons I play Special 20's and why I'm interested in learning more about this new product.
Last Edited by SmokeJS on Oct 20, 2014 2:22 AM
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florida-trader
536 posts
Oct 19, 2014
9:12 PM
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SmokeJS – The subject of custom combs is pretty much an endless debate. The simple answer to your question is that the only way to find out is to try one. And since I stand behind every product I sell with a 100% Satisfaction Guarantee, there is zero risk. If you don’t like something you get from me I will not only refund the purchase price plus shipping but I will also reimburse you for the cost of shipping it back to me.
The long answer is this – and I freely admit to a healthy amount of bias. To begin with, personally I don’t claim that all stock combs - Special 20 or other – are defective and need to be replaced. Some are good. Some are less good. A CNC milled comb is, generally speaking, a much higher quality item than an injection molded plastic comb. It will be flatter. It has no empty spaces. The likelihood of getting a good seal with the reed plate can only be improved with a milled comb.
I have also gone to great lengths to make other subtle improvements to the Special 20 comb. My goal from the beginning was to create a mouthpiece that is a cut above what you experience with a stock Special 20 comb. I had prototypes made and sent them to a number of well-known harp players whose opinions I respect. Even with the first draft of the mouthpiece the milled combs received a positive review from all of them. I solicited feedback and suggestions from my panel of experts and incorporated their ideas into the final version of the comb. The same is true for the new Seydel Session Steel comb I will be bringing to market very soon. The result, and again, I admit to being biased, is a mouthpiece that is smoother, more comfortable and better for tongue blocking than the stock comb. It is exactly what I was shooting for.
I appreciate you fanning the flames of interest. We are jumping the gun just a little bit because an announcement of this nature inevitably brings requests to purchase them (which I welcome). I am in the midst of putting the finishing touches on a new website which will, of course, include the new combs I am coming out with. I’m just a few days away from going live, at which time I will post an announcement.
One last thought. I did not invent the custom comb or replacement comb industry. I merely tapped into the demand of the harmonica community for a reliable source of quality affordable combs. I’ve been in business for four years. I have never made exaggerated claims about my products and have always offered a 100% Money Back Guarantee. Every day I receive emails from customers who tell me how installing their new comb has improved their harp. To tell you the truth – I’m blown away by it. Yes, I make quality products but I am amazed that the simple installation of a solid milled comb has such a profound impact on the average harmonica. There must be something to it. It is unlikely that so many people are suffering from delusion.
I would like to invite you to contact me directly and provide me with your address so I can send you a comb of your choice – free of charge. Then you would be in a position to answer your own question. I mean this in the most positive way – as I’m sure your OP was intended as well. I would be interested in your opinion and perhaps there are others who would be too.
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Tom Halchak
www.BlueMoonHarmonicas.com
Last Edited by florida-trader on Oct 19, 2014 9:16 PM
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SuperBee
2240 posts
Oct 20, 2014
2:04 AM
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thats interesting JS. A Zajac produces solid combs for Sp20s
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SmokeJS
304 posts
Oct 20, 2014
2:33 AM
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Tom, your business practices seem impeccable. A Special 20 custom comb that recesses the reedplates should be very well received by serious Special 20 players even if their motivation is more about increasing the flash of their harmonicas with increased comfort and decreased leakiness being other benefits.
Your offer to let me test drive one is very generous and if I was in the US rather than Canada I'd take you up on it.
Please note I added an edit to my original post to make it clear your new combs will recess the reedplates just like the stock comb.
Last Edited by SmokeJS on Oct 20, 2014 2:43 AM
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florida-trader
537 posts
Oct 20, 2014
7:18 AM
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Superbee. I have been making a flat SP20 comb for years and they have served me well. However without the recessed comb you essentially convert a Special 20 into a “Tin Sandwich” design where the mouthpiece is formed by the reed plates sandwiched around the comb. This creates some minor issues that need to be dealt with that you don’t have to worry about with the installation of custom combs on other harps (like a Marine Band or Blues Harp or Golden Melody) that already have the tin sandwich design. First of all, the design of the stock Special 20 comb is such that your lips or tongue never touch the reed plates. The plates have very sharp edges which need to be knocked down if you install a flat comb. Second, Special 20 reed plates have no grooves to receive the front edge of the covers. I have used some creative methods to cut grooves in Special 20 plates with varying degrees of success. Third, the covers are not designed to sit down in a groove (because there are none on the SP20 comb). You have to slightly modify the front of the covers by bending them down (I use a sheet metal seamer) so if you do cut a groove the front edge of the reed plate, the cover will actually sit down into the bottom of the groove. If you don’t cut a groove in the reed plates then it is still a good idea to bend the front edge of the covers a little to help create a better seal with the reed plates. All of this is a bit of a hassle for someone who doesn’t do a lot of harp tech stuff. It is not that difficult for those of us who do but even with my best efforts, ocassionally I still find it necessary to install a gasket under the front edge of the covers to make an airtight seal. And when you are all done with this project, in essence, what you have done is reverse engineer a Special 20 into a Marine Band. Still, many many people are willing to do this if it means having the opportunity to enjoy the benefit of a flatter comb.
If there is one that I have demonstrated since I went into business it is a willingness to tackle difficult projects. People have been asking me for years to build milled recessed combs for the Special 20. Trust me when I tell you that it was no small undertaking. You have to design it using 3D software. You have to have access to high end equipment capable of machining the part. You have to produce them in sufficient quantities to leverage the economies of scale. You have to have a vehicle to market them once you have produced them. And it helps if you have an established customer base and a favorable reputation in this little niche market we affectionately refer to as “The Harmonica Community”. In addition, I am fortunate enough to have developed relationships with people like Richard Sleigh, Todd Parrott, Pat Missin, Greg Jones, Harvey Berman (all of whom evaluated my prototypes) and several others (who examined pictures) who helped me fine tune the design. It really and truly is a community effort. The community asked for it and expert representatives of the community had a hand in designing it. And of course, in the final analysis, the community (the market) will decide whether or not we have done a good job. The proof will be whether or not they are willing to part with their hard earned money in exchange for one (or two or twenty). I suspect that as they enter the market, there will be reviews posted by their new owners.
For the sake of clarity, here are a few pictures. And by the way, please note that these combs can be used on the new Hohner Rocket as well.
I am in the midst of taking delivery on a large batch of combs – not just the Special 20’s. They have to be “finished” as in polished and in the case of the aluminum combs – anodized – before I can make them available. We are only talking about mere days. But here are some of the “models” of which I will be taking pictures to post on my website. Pardon the poor quality. These were just taken with my phone and no special lighting.
And SmokeJS – I ship to Canada. My offer still stands. Look me up – please. I think it would be fun for your to be able to answer your own question.
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Tom Halchak
www.BlueMoonHarmonicas.com
Last Edited by florida-trader on Oct 20, 2014 7:21 AM
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SmokeJS
305 posts
Oct 20, 2014
7:37 AM
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Great looking combs. Didn't want to take advantage of your generosity but I'd enjoy the process very much. Will contact you directly.
One question buyers might have from the photos is about coverplate support. In my case, I leave the post on the original comb. Note that some Special 20's I own have the coverplates opened, and others where I want a really brown muted sound, are left closed. So the question is will there be posts on your combs and will there be a difference if the coverplates are opened?
Thanks
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RSleigh
4 posts
Oct 20, 2014
8:23 AM
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I got one of Tom's new special 20 combs in black corian. Tom has been making my black corian combs for Marine Bands now for a couple years, so when he sent me a sample of a prototype of the special 20 a while ago made out of aluminum, I tried it out & made a bunch of suggestions on how to make it feel better to my lips. Mainly to bring the front lip closer to the cover plates & decrease overall size.
The special 20 comb he just sent me addressed all my nit picking & I can't think of anything more I would want to see changed. And it does not have those sprues that you have to cut out of the way to use my draw scraper to tune reeds...
I have not played special 20s for years cause i prefer the overall feel of Marine Bands set up the way I do them.... but I decided to have an open mind and just set up a harp and see what it felt like.
I made a special 20 in key of D with Tom's comb and used special 20 cover plates - i did add vents on the high end sides, just a slit made with a dremel abrasive cutting disk...
Played it at a gig last friday and I liked the way it felt. Plenty of "glide" and overall smoothness to the hands and lips.
And it sounded fine to me. The special 20 stock comb feels like plastic ...well it IS plastic. This comb feels more like a warm polished gem stone.
and the shape of the holes is great for tongue blocking...
Am I ready to convert from Marine Bands? - Not for the keys below D, but i am tempted to use these for keys above Db ...
I did sand the draw reed plate to make sure it was dead flat - I highly recommend doing that no matter what kind of comb you have...
Anyhow, I think Tom did his homework and even though you can't sand the surfaces that the reed plates contact, it does not seem to matter cause the tolerances on these things are very tight...
If you dig special 20s and don't want to screw around with putting in grooves in the reed plates, this is a great upgrade...
Richard Sleigh
http://www.rsleigh.com
http://www.hotrodharmonicas.com
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florida-trader
538 posts
Oct 20, 2014
8:46 AM
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SmokeJS – about the covers. On the complete Special 20’s that I will offer I plan to open the backs of the covers and add a brace in the center. One nice thing about the Special 20 reed plates on a custom comb is that the plates have a little square notch at the back center to accommodate the center post that is built into the stock plastic comb. My combs don’t have that post. The notch in the reed plates create a perfect spot to drill a small hole in the comb, without having to drill additional holes in the reed plates, to install a brace. It is a little bit of serendipity. I will offer my customers the option of leaving the covers stock or have them opened with a brace installed. Good question. Thanks for asking.
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Tom Halchak
www.BlueMoonHarmonicas.com
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A440
228 posts
Oct 20, 2014
8:57 AM
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These look great Tom!
I'll be ordering one for my Rocket. I hate the huge holes Hohner put on the stock comb.
Last Edited by A440 on Oct 20, 2014 8:59 AM
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HarpNinja
3970 posts
Oct 20, 2014
9:07 AM
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Tom,
How does the comb impact the overall size of the SP20 and Rocket? Does the harp have the same dimensions or does it get thicker/thinner?
The only thing I don't like about the Rocket is that it feels thicker in my mouth than the SP20.
Combs look great!
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Mike
My Website
My Harmonica Effects Blog
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florida-trader
539 posts
Oct 20, 2014
9:20 AM
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The thickness of the comb is identical to the SP20 comb. If you look closely at the pictures you will see that the rim around the edge of the comb is slightly thicker on my comb. On the stock comb it is .0050" and on mine is is .0070". A very small difference but I wanted a little extra meat with which to contour the mouthpiece.
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Tom Halchak
www.BlueMoonHarmonicas.com
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SuperBee
2241 posts
Oct 20, 2014
3:14 PM
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ah yes, i was just wrong-footed by the OP which emphasised no alternative to stock combs...i thought of all the Sp20s ive fitted with solid combs, hetrick bamboo and most recently those made by Andrew.
but this is a different deal i see Tom! very good...although recessed plates offer no attraction to me at this time
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joshnat
225 posts
Oct 21, 2014
3:42 PM
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Tom, the combs look fantastic! Any idea when they'll be orderable on your site?
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florida-trader
541 posts
Oct 21, 2014
6:54 PM
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joshnat - I've been working on a new website. It might be live as soon as tomorrow. I'll let everyone know. Thanks for the kind words.
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Tom Halchak
www.BlueMoonHarmonicas.com
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chromaticblues
1609 posts
Oct 22, 2014
8:15 AM
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I play SP 20's and I have to say this is the best comb idea I've seen by anyone for any harp harp!
Very nice work!!
OK here's the big question.
How much will they cost?
Would you lower the cost a little for an order of say 6 at a time?
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florida-trader
542 posts
Oct 22, 2014
10:25 AM
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Thanks for the kind words chromaticblues. The new Special 20 combs will be $49.95 each for Corian, Fancy Acrylic or Aluminum and $64.95 each for Brass. I've been busy building a new website which I am hoping it will go live very shortly - as in maybe today. Everything will be listed with pictures, etc. Anyone who has an interest in making quantity purchases is welcome to email me directly.
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Tom Halchak
www.BlueMoonHarmonicas.com
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Meaux Jeaux
3 posts
Oct 26, 2014
8:22 PM
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I am waiting to hear from you Tom, you have my email address, thanks, Pete in Lakeland.
Best Regards
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florida-trader
543 posts
Oct 27, 2014
8:02 PM
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My new website is live. We switched to a new server. There may be some glitches. For example, my info@bluemoonharmonicas.com email is down at the moment but I'm sure we will get it fixed in short order. If you notice anything wrong I would appreciate a heads up. All the new Special 20 combs are listed complete with pictures except for anodized aluminum. I will have those next week. I am also offering Complete Special 20's as well.
There are quite a few listings with no images available. That's because I haven't taken delivery of those combs yet. I will have them very shortly and when I do I will take some pictures and add them to the site. If I have a picture posted it is in stock and I can ship immediately. If there is no picture I won't be able to ship for about 10 days. At this point I make over 180 different combs so it takes a while to replenish my inventory - especially when I am adding new designs and materials.
I have quite a few harps to list including some Suzuki Manjis and ProMasters. I still have a few of the low tuned MS Cross Harps available. They are very good harps. And I have several pre-war Marine Bands and Old Standbys that I have restored.
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Tom Halchak
www.BlueMoonHarmonicas.com
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mastercaster
88 posts
Oct 29, 2014
11:06 PM
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sexy looking combs ..
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SmokeJS
308 posts
Nov 10, 2014
9:48 AM
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True to his word Tom sent me a blue acrylic Special 20 comb that's recesssed like the stock combs. As I come to know the comb better I'll post more updates.
The comb, and a set of open backed covers, arrived in a very well protected package.
The comb was in a Special 20 stock plastic case. It was a bit tricky to open the case and remove the comb as the comb is slightly larger than stock but not a problem for me as I use a single case to hold all my harps.
The comb is absolutely gorgeous.
Tom included two brass posts as posts are not built into the comb as they are on the stock version. Tom and I went back and forth a bit about whether or not I wanted posts. I hope I was able to clarify that a comb without the posts wasn't really an option for me as otherwise the covers would be unsupported at the back.
The covers were expertly opened.
Next up will be installation.
Last Edited by SmokeJS on Nov 10, 2014 9:51 AM
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SmokeJS
309 posts
Nov 14, 2014
9:00 AM
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The blue acrylic custom comb is now loaded up with Special 20 C reedplates. The top of the botton reedplate was previously flat sanded using 320 paper. The reeds have been gapped and tuned by me with one of Andrew's servicings on top of that.
The end result with open cover plates makes for a great looking instrument.
The extra edge all around the top of the comb isn't much but I'm aware it's there. Hoping Tom can clarify why this change in dimension.
I'm going to have to play this harmonica for some time before I can pass judgement on the comb size and whether or not the combs flatness makes it significantky superior to the stock comb. Fortunately I have another C which has had the same attention except of course for the comb.
Last Edited by SmokeJS on Nov 14, 2014 9:22 AM
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florida-trader
553 posts
Nov 14, 2014
12:28 PM
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Some of you read this are going to think, “Wow – these guys have too much time on their hands”, but because you asked and in the interest of being accurate here goes.
To begin with, the rim on the stock Special 20 comb is taller (higher or thicker – however you wish to look at it) at the front where it forms the mouthpiece that it is one the other three sides of the comb – as illustrated below. At the front of the harmonica, a stock Special 20 comb measures .362” thick.
The sides and back of the comb measure .322” or about a 40/1000th of an inch difference.
When we designed the Blue Moon comb, we made the decision to keep the height of the rim uniform throughout the entire comb. Hence, the Blue Moon comb clocks in at exactly the same .362” thickness at the front of the harmonica and maintains that thickness on the sides and back. The biggest reason for a uniform height is it is easier to flat sand the rim if it is the same all the way around.
Moving on to the thickness of the rim.
The stock Special 20 comb has a rim that is about .050” to .051” thick. This is consistent all the way around the comb.
The Blue Moon comb has a rim that is .072” thick which is .021” to .022” thicker that the stock comb – or if you add the front and back and the two sides together, it is about .044” wider and about .044” longer than the stock comb. This accounts for the snug fit in the standard Special 20 box.
When I designed the Special 20 comb I wanted to make something more than just a CNC milled duplicate of the injection molded plastic stock comb. Aside from the generally accepted benefits of milled combs vs. molded combs (flatness and no hollow spaces) I wanted to create a mouthpiece that was something special. I was aiming something that was rounder, smoother and more comfortable to play. I wanted to accommodate both the Lip Pursers and the Tongue Blockers. And I needed a little more material to work with - hence the extra .022” thickness. Judging by the early feedback I have received I am greatly encouraged.
Last Edited by florida-trader on Nov 14, 2014 6:13 PM
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Todd Parrott
1260 posts
Nov 14, 2014
1:37 PM
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I have 3 of them, and I really like them. They are very comfortable to play. One word of advice - because of the translucency of certain materials, when you look through the back side of the covers, it appears that there is a crack of light between the cover plate and the front of the comb, when it's actually just the light shining through the translucent material. I wasted a bunch of time trying to bend the front edge of the covers down when this was not necessary.
The seaweed blue and green swirl color looks incredible in person.
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bigd
551 posts
Nov 14, 2014
6:19 PM
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They look super!! The only slight slight disadvantage I had with some of my previous replacement Golden Melody combs (no longer as relevant as many were ripped off) was they were slightly thinner than the generic Hohner combs which I have become profoundly used....Fla. trader is a super guy to do business with!
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bigd
552 posts
Nov 14, 2014
6:22 PM
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Oops! "profoundly used to in my mouth over these decades of playing"
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kham
9 posts
Nov 14, 2014
10:42 PM
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The brass combs certainly make for a heavier harmonica. Good in case you need an extra set of knuckles at the wrong blues joint.
Brass also has a much brighter sound to it. I don't think that is up for debate in this endless combs versus covers versus tone debate is it?
The only problem I see is if you drop a brass comb harmonica you will most certainly put a good dent into the covers with the added weight. My one brass harp has a couple of significant dings in it from a couple of slight falls.
Nice lookin' combs by the way Tom!
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florida-trader
555 posts
Nov 16, 2014
6:21 PM
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Completely unsolicited but a very pleasant surprise.
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Tom Halchak
www.BlueMoonHarmonicas.com
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SmokeJS
310 posts
Nov 28, 2014
7:51 AM
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Been comparing the blue acrylic comb to a stock one for a couple of weeks now so here's my take. 1) The combs are fabulous looking. 2) The combs are air tighter but given my flat reed plate sanding work I'm not sure just how much tighter and would have trouble quantifying it. 3) The slight size difference around the edge is noticeable but certainly not enough to push me away from the custom comb but given what I'm used to I'd probably choose stock dimensions if given the choice. 4) The combs are not inexpensive. With the nice work Tom does opening up the covers, and what is likely quality first steps towards building a complete custom harp, I think his sales of retrofitted Special 20's might be the better deal for someone like me. So unless there was a huge discount on buying a number of custom combs I think replacing harps with Tom's makes sense if there are keys that are needed or an existing harp needs to be replaced.
FYI: Tom sent me this comb at no charge to me to try out. I think that's a strong indication of his business practices.
Last Edited by SmokeJS on Nov 28, 2014 7:52 AM
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