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ghost of William Clarke

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kudzurunner 4994 posts Sep 28, 2014 4:51 AM	The first time I saw William Clarke perform was the 1987 Bucks County R&B picnic. I had no idea who he was. I remember distinctly that he downed most of a 40-oz bottle of malt liquor just before he played. He was in a dark suit. At some point in the show he laid down on the dusty concrete stage and kicked his feet like a baby. I've always wanted to throw down that flat-on-your-back move, but I've never actually done so until yesterday afternoon, when the Blues Docs were playing in Clarksdale before an audience of six, one of whom was Deak Harp. He had a cameraphone, so I told him, "Check this out." The video quality is pretty grainy, but you'll get the idea. I'm going to do more of this--even longer and more dramatic next time, I think. (I didn't get to the kicking-your-feet part here.) The song is about not getting enough "love" from your wife: Last Edited by kudzurunner on Sep 28, 2014 5:00 AM
NiteCrawler . 310 posts Sep 28, 2014 9:17 AM	Hey Adam,I liked the tune(the short of it)You may want to one up WC,s move and go into "The Curley Shuffle.Talk about showmanship,eh? They,d have to clear out some tables out once you got it going.Just a thought.You could get a commercial from Colt 45 with that one. Last Edited by NiteCrawler . on Sep 28, 2014 9:37 AM
Ted Burke 229 posts Sep 28, 2014 10:14 AM	Looks silly, I'm afraid. But I admire the way you keep the tone and the phrasing together while you're flat on your back. ---------- ---- ted-burke.com tburke4@san.rr.com
kudzurunner 4995 posts Sep 28, 2014 10:42 AM	Silly! Hah. I was thinking about the question of stagecraft during my long run this morning and I realized that we white blues inheritors have a terribly skewed idea of how things worked back in the day. Howlin' Wolf was known for outrageous stagecraft. He'd roll his eyes, crawl on the ground, climb curtains. So was Muddy. He'd shake a can of Coke, slip it into his slacks, then find a woman in the audience, unzip, crack it open, and spray foam onto as people shrieked. Deak reminded me that Big George Brock has been doing the lay-on-your-back thing for a long time. Wolf got his moves from Charley Patton, who beat on his guitar, said "This is how I beat my woman!," and did all kinds of other things that led some competitors to call him a clown. I'm in good company. I'd be interested in hearing from BBQ Bob about stagecraft that he's seen during his years playing with old-school players. I'm well aware that what I'm doing here is very, very mild compared to what went down back then. As for what does or does not look dignified: my god. Has it come down to THAT? Putting on a blues show is about looking dignified?! I sure as hell hope not. It would be possible for some professors in my position to cower in the face of some imagined, imputed disapproving provost. The moment I start doing that, I've lost. I promise, though, that I'll never play harp with my nose, or shove the whole thing in my mouth, like Rick Estrin. Last Edited by kudzurunner on Sep 28, 2014 10:58 AM
The Iceman 2152 posts Sep 28, 2014 11:21 AM	Would have loved to have seen the ol' blues guys acting outrageous. Some of what you described, kudzu, may have, at the time, only worked for that particular audience. To try a crossover may have totally freaked out a different audience. ---------- The Iceman Last Edited by The Iceman on Sep 28, 2014 3:44 PM
eharp 2231 posts Sep 28, 2014 3:27 PM	All the wild gyrations you want to do doesn't touch Rick's harp in mouth schtick.
John95683 190 posts Sep 28, 2014 7:11 PM	Just a joke,kudzu. Didn't you see the smiley face at the end of my post? My god, has it come to that???
kudzurunner 4996 posts Sep 28, 2014 9:04 PM	Be cool, John. I knew it was a joke. Last Edited by kudzurunner on Sep 28, 2014 9:07 PM
slaphappy 35 posts Sep 28, 2014 9:10 PM	I think if you're gonna do it you gotta go all in and kick the the feet and wriggle and writhe and uh yeah all that kind of stuff :) ---------- 4' 4+ 3' 2~~~ -Mike Ziemba Harmonica is Life!
kudzurunner 4997 posts Sep 29, 2014 9:12 AM	Here's my second attempt at silly showmanship. This time I actually rolled around on the floor. 3:30 to 4:45. The moment you start doing this stuff, the flashbulbs start popping, everybody starts paying attention. FYI on harp amplification: Premier Twin-8 plus a Pacemaker tube PA amp, with the Pacemaker miked through the house PA. This will be my go-to combo for outdoor gigs where I need to move air.
nacoran 8038 posts Sep 29, 2014 10:02 AM	---------- Nate Facebook Thread Organizer (A list of all sorts of useful threads) First Post- May 8, 2009
barbequebob 2719 posts Sep 29, 2014 11:18 AM	William Clarke got that thing he did from the time he spent being mentored by the great George Harmonica Smith and Kim Wilson also mentions in Kim Field's book, Harmonica, Harpers and Heavy Breathers that in his early years in the LA area, he was on the bandstand with George Smith and George had him lying on his back on the floor doing snychronized dance steps. White musicians seemingly have poopooed the idea of showmanship but for many of those old black bluesmen, especially in front of black audiences back in the day, you HAD to be more than just another musician on the bandstand and the fact is that you ARE an entertainer, but in front of white audiences and too often the prevailing attitudes (especially if they're more "classically" oriented), this was considered to be highly undignified. Many years ago, I had a drummer who when I walked off the bandstand and into the crowd, he would follow me with his snare and he got me to lie down on my back on the floor (which was something at the time I was reluctant to do) and once I did that, he sat on my stomach while I was playing and the crowd went totally nuts. I recall seeing Howlin' Wolf take the mic to his crotch and masturbating the mic on a number of occasions. The first time I saw him, he did an encore of Smokestack Lightning while crawling on all fours and howling just like a wolf, which was something he always did for black audiences (but at the time he did it, he was quite sick and couldn't do anywhere near as much as he once could). Back in the 50's when Ed Sullivan reused to shoot Elvis from the waist down because of the hip shaking was considered really dirty to white auidences back then, jump vocalist Wynonie Harris had been doing that at least a good decade earlier and what Elvis did was quite mild by comparison. Charlie Patton used to throw his guitar into the air decades before Jimi Hendrix ever did for entirely black audiences but wouldn't do that if he were playing for whites. Basically, for many black audiences, you just couldn't get by by just being a total stiff on the bandstand and since the mid 60's for white audiences, it became much more cool for those black blues artists to do the kinds of showmanship they had to have (although in reality, not to the very fullest extent they did for black audiences) and audiences definitely do get off on it. I still do the lying on my back thing at times but you can get some weird things happening to you like this one time I did it, some biker babe grabbed me by the ankles and twirled me around on the dance floor that I was lying down on. When you think about, the value of showmanship is not unlike a pro athlete doing anything to get an edge oer their competition and music, much like por sports, can be quite competitive and I know for a fact that many of those old black bluesmen were HUGELY competitive, which totally goes against the way most white people tend to think. Here's a couple of pictures of my lying on the floor playing: ---------- Sincerely, Barbeque Bob Maglinte Boston, MA http://www.barbequebob.com CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte Last Edited by barbequebob on Sep 29, 2014 11:23 AM
JJ Harper 20 posts Sep 29, 2014 4:35 PM	Nothing about that video reminded me in any way about William Clarke.
Ted Burke 231 posts Sep 29, 2014 6:32 PM	I don't get it and don't see the appeal. These days it seems one has to decide whether they want to be a great musician or a mediocre clown. Adam, you are a great musician. ---------- ---- ted-burke.com tburke4@san.rr.com
kudzurunner 5002 posts Sep 29, 2014 7:51 PM	Ted, I thought you were a postmodernist. The either/or thing went out the window years ago. Thanks, BBQ, for confirming my hunch. You are an angel on the road. You're never too old, a very wise man once said, to live the life you could have lived. I have to say this delicately so as to remain within the bounds of the forum creed, but I learned many many years ago, during my earliest days as a busker, that some new directions require that you open out of town, because the folks back home have gotten so comfortable with you, they've so internalized what they're SURE you are, that it's profoundly destabilizing when you dare to try something new. Offering the two videos I've offered above is like opening in town. Luckily, I've learned through experience how to interpret the feedback I'm gettting--and I'm psyched, frankly. Sometimes you need to risk making a fool out of yourself--or being called a fool, or a bad clown--in order to grow. I've walked earlier versions of this particular road more than once in my life. The guardian angels are there if you seek them, and they will respond. (I didn't expect color photos, though.) Be bold! Last Edited by kudzurunner on Sep 29, 2014 7:56 PM
Ted Burke 233 posts Sep 29, 2014 8:14 PM	i believe the validity of any theory is in how it works, which makes me a pragmatist more than anything else. i put more stock in william james and john dewey than derrida and foucault. and as a practical matter, the either/or thing might have become intellectually quaint with the the rising influence of continental philosophy on british and american literary criticism, but often times life outside the asylum of academia gives us limited options. Sometimes you choose one thing or the other , making selections based on criteria such as preference, age, what there is to actually choose from, the lot. man in his undistorted state is not, as marx thought, a farmer in the morning, an artist in the morning, an intellectual at dinner and at night, a classical musician. i choose to not be a showman because i cannot play music while i clown around. i have tried and i am no good at it. either i could be a bad clown and an uninteresting musician or i can play the way i want to play with the obligation to try to please an audience that wants more than musicians performing as best they can. either/or. of course, some are good, even brilliant at combing theatrics with musicianship. some. but not the fabled hendrix, who , as a live musician, was consistently, chronically, painfully out of tune and made so many mistakes on the guitar that much of his live recordings are unlistenable. maybe it is only me. adam, you are a great musician and admire your tenacity to keep it fresh. maybe this will click with me sometime down the road, but not yet. ---------- ---- ted-burke.com tburke4@san.rr.com
eharp 2232 posts Sep 29, 2014 8:46 PM	It seems you are looking for validation and finding it in BBQ's photos. The crowd doesn't seem all that excited about the top photo and the bottom one could be Bob just collapsed because of too much moonshine. But, I think, if it feels right, DO IT! However, I believe you should find some vids of the masters doing this and watch closely how they get there and back. You seemed comfortable in the playing, but hitting the floor and standing back up seemed very hesitant. The theatrics need to be rehearsed as much as the music if you are going that route.
MN 344 posts Sep 30, 2014 2:20 AM	I love how Howlin' Wolf enters the stage CRAWLING in this video. :-) ----------
kudzurunner 5003 posts Sep 30, 2014 4:51 AM	eharp: Aha! You're absolutely right. That is THE issue right now. And here's why: I haven't spent one single moment in the woodshed actually practicing the move--moving from a standing position to the ground, and getting back up. Nobody can do something correctly in public if they haven't practiced it many times in private. (Hmm. That doesn't sound quite right, boys.) I've only done this twice, both times in public. And although I'm a fairly spry guy, my back is not great. So I'm still in the stage of primitive accumulation. I'll figure it out. But you're right: finding the right way of getting back onto my feet and--just as importantly--sliding smoothly back into place on the percussion rig is key. MN: Wow! That video was a revelation. Amazing. The way he crawls onstage; the way he basks for a long time in the audience's attentions; the way he sings; the way he blows harp on the mic--some of the greatest natural tone ever--and then, at 6:00, the way he dramatizes his walk out of town. By the time the video ends, you KNOW why he was great, and why he had the reputation he did. Muddy just looks a little....smaller....after Wolf does his thing. This is a desert island video. I love the way it opens with a series of black interviewees, many of them young (this is 1969 or 70), confessing that they've never heard of him. At that point in history, he was supposed to be outdated; not the hip thing. But that's the point: all that talk, and then he comes on and does what he does and it's still huge, awe-inspiring, and majestic. And somewhat goofy at points, too. Last Edited by kudzurunner on Sep 30, 2014 5:02 AM
NiteCrawler . 312 posts Sep 30, 2014 5:38 AM	@Adam,Thanks for posting the entire tune from the Foxfire,JLHookerish I must say,one of my favs.Speaking of John Lee he had a sideman back in his heyday named Eddie Kirkland who apparently he was the real g-man in alot of his recordings.He was known to do somersaults while playing the guitar and I don,t think theres any from back then but theres one on YT from 77 with Foghat where he does it and he,s no spring chicken thats for sure. I don,t know how to upload otherwise I would.As mentioned in my earlier post you need to bang down a quart of Colt-45 to get your back loosened up before you go into the lay down roll and kick.(it worked for William)@MN Thanks for the Wolf upload,awesome! Respect,NiteCrawler
6SN7 475 posts Sep 30, 2014 5:51 AM	I have always liked the clips of Bill Clarke playing while on the floor. Of course, they are more than just being on the floor and playing. He will play "Taps" while on hs back, simulating sleeping/dying and then start up agian, not unlike James Brown o the tune "Please, Please, Please." I saw Ronnie Earl the other week in a rare bar gig, not his ususal small auditorium gigs. he was on fire as always but doing a lot of "showboating." Not only did he walk around the audience playiong his guitar, he also played behind his back and also played while dancing with a woman. For his encore, he asked the entire audience to come to the bandstand and stand as close to him as possible "to feel the love." Was this all corny? Maybe a bit, to a purist, but Ronnie was enjoying it and the crowd loved it and the music didn't suffer one bit. And of course, 90% of the audience had their iPhones recording his every move, taking video souviniers for the ride home. A smile was brought to anyone's face and the man can still burn and be relevant.
JInx 907 posts Sep 30, 2014 7:10 AM	lol, somehow it all makes sense now. ----------
barbequebob 2722 posts Sep 30, 2014 10:44 AM	@eharp -- The top photo was taken at the 1998 Sunny Slope Blues Festival in Boise, ID, obviously an outdoor gig. The crowd actually did go wild once I did it and there are times you do have to do more than just play well to get across to an audience and some audiences tend to be a bit more uptight than others and that's a fact of life, meaning some audiences just can't let their hair down. Obviously, if there was an actual video being shot, you can better see an audiences actual reaction. Showmanship without good musicianship obviously ain't gonna be worth a damn but if you've got both happening, you;re a force to be reckoned with. If you get to see a video of Muddy Waters at the 1960 Newport Jazz Festival, on Got My Mojo Working, he's dancing several times including a point where he's dancing with James Cotton. In front of a largely white audience, that's shocking for those who expect to see someone sitting down on the bandstand only back in the day, but like it or not, showmanship does get you across. BTW, from both photos, at those gigs, I was 100% totally sober for each of them. The idea of showmanship is also to avoid doing something that I've seen too many technically blessed musicians tend to do, which is playing AT the audience (kinda almost like a sense of unknowingly coming across as snobby) and doing whatever it takes to keep the audience engaged and I've seen so many bands over the years who fail to engage their audiences where it's like a huge wall between them and the audience. I still recall seeing a much younger James Cotton in the early 70's playing the living s**t out of The Creeper and turning a somersault during the performance and not missing a note or ever screwing up the time and the groove and the crowd went absolutely nuts. Some of those older black bluesmen did and some didn't, but much of the time, these bits of showmanship were often not choreographed at all, just all right in the moment, whether it was like Howlin' Wolf crawling on all fours or just walking into the crowd as far as the mic cord will let you (or the range of your wireless, if you had one) as I recall Big Walter Horton doing so many times that I had seen him in the 70's. Bottom line is that just as much as you are a musician, you are also an entertainer at the same time, ESPECIALLY if you're the one fronting the band. However, one big time rule of thumb is that if you're not the one fronting the band, as a sideman, you NEVER do this unless the bandleader gives you the OK to do so. ---------- Sincerely, Barbeque Bob Maglinte Boston, MA http://www.barbequebob.com CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
Joe_L 2515 posts Sep 30, 2014 11:28 AM	Here's my take on that stuff. There is nothing wrong with showmanship. If you can pull it of and it comes across as part of your personality, go for it. If it doesn't fit your personality, it's going to fall flat and it won't work. I thought it looked a little forced. It didn't flow smoothly at all. It started out looking like an awkward teenager in gym class to a kid having a tantrum. If you're going to to it again, I think you need to find a way for make it look more natural. I've seen video of Cotton doing a somersault. He didn't look like he was a gymnast waiting to execute on a mat. He just did it. Here's another thing, back in the day, you saw this more. Now, it is very rare. In the Bay Area, we still have a thriving scene with Black performers, I can count the number of players on one hand that put on a stage show and still have fingers left over. Sugar Pie Desanto and Little Junior Crudup are probably it. I think the times have done changed. ---------- The Blues Photo Gallery Last Edited by Joe_L on Sep 30, 2014 11:36 AM
kudzurunner 5004 posts Sep 30, 2014 11:43 AM	Practice makes perfect. I've had two performances and no practice. There's the quick-start manual and then there's the guy who doesn't even look at the manual. The ice has been broken. All praises due to the great William Clarke. He made quite an impression on me more than 25 years ago, the very first time I saw him. I've never gotten it out of my head. That is power. I'm as surprised as the next guy by the fact that, having decided not to be anchored to my drummer's chair, I've now decided to move beyond anything I did when I was just a harp player. But life is surprising. Please post videos of Clarke's stagecraft, if they're available. Edited to add: The song is about a guy who doesn't get enough p---y from his wife. Whatever I'm doing is supposed to look like a tantrum. So thanks, Joe! Again, it's good to know I'm on the right track. Last Edited by kudzurunner on Sep 30, 2014 11:45 AM
HarpNinja 3942 posts Sep 30, 2014 11:47 AM	I encourage everyone to check out some of the methods for live show production that Tom Jackson talks about. Brilliant stuff about creating moments in your live show. ---------- Mike My Website My Harmonica Effects Blog
bluemoose 1002 posts Sep 30, 2014 12:28 PM	here you go...things get crazy after 6 minutes or so. MBH Webbrain - a GUI guide to Adam's Youtube vids FerretCat Webbrain - Jason Ricci's vids (by hair colour!) Last Edited by bluemoose on Sep 30, 2014 12:36 PM
The Iceman 2166 posts Sep 30, 2014 3:39 PM	Corky Siegel was another lie on his back player in the hey day of Siegel/Schwall. ---------- The Iceman
kudzurunner 5005 posts Sep 30, 2014 4:24 PM	Here's another short video in which I'm trying something new in the Blues Docs / OMB context: not just getting up from the drumset and playing with the guitar player, but then shushing the guitar and continuing alone. Kim Wilson does an exceptional version of this, playing an uptempo boogie for long moments while the band drops out. Here I'm just testing the waters. It was nice having the Pacemaker amp blasting away along with the Premiere. Last Edited by kudzurunner on Sep 30, 2014 4:29 PM
kudzurunner 5006 posts Sep 30, 2014 4:29 PM	Fantastic, Moose! Jesus, I've never seen him do half that stuff. That's great. Inspiring! Watch out, baby. Here I come.
blueswannabe 510 posts Oct 01, 2014 5:03 AM	Unbelievable clark video!! That guy was a force of nature.
MN 345 posts Oct 01, 2014 7:23 AM	On the flip side ........ anyone have any showmanship "fails" to relate? I was once playing a bar gig with a group and the guitar player decided to do a table-walk. It did not end well. :-o Last Edited by MN on Oct 01, 2014 9:13 AM
R2D2 3 posts Oct 01, 2014 7:31 AM	That William Clarke video made my day!
R2D2 4 posts Oct 01, 2014 7:44 AM	As to the above discussion, there's a fellow harp player named David Caesar in the Charlotte,NC area. He's like James Brown blowin harp. Terrific showman. Whether you think showmanship is cool or hammy, you do not want to follow that act any more than you'd want to follow William Clarke.
The Iceman 2170 posts Oct 01, 2014 8:15 AM	showmanship fail... Worked in a top 40 band in the 70's in Detroit. Was called Chuck Singleton and Fusion, Ltd. Black front man singer used to stick a sock down his pants to make him more stage attractive to the women. We had a gig upstairs at a club near the corner of Mich Ave and Telegraph. It was surreal, because if you looked out the window wall onto Telegraph, you could see the top of that huge Reddi Whip advertising can that used to be there. One night he was doing kicks while singing and that sock came flying out of his pants leg into the audience. ---------- The Iceman Last Edited by The Iceman on Oct 01, 2014 8:20 AM
CarlA 608 posts Oct 01, 2014 12:15 PM	@iceman lol.
kudzurunner 5008 posts Oct 01, 2014 5:36 PM	This David Ceaser? He's got some cool moves.
The Iceman 2171 posts Oct 02, 2014 6:51 AM	Wow. Donald Ceasar reminds me of Fred Astair... Fluid moves, but if you focus on his head, it seems to just float in the air, no matter what his body is doing. ---------- The Iceman
Ted Burke 237 posts Oct 02, 2014 7:05 AM	The best harmonica entrance I ever saw was Sugar Blue at the now closed Blind Melon's in San Diego. After the introduction from an off stage mike, the band on stage was cooking some fine funk blues, fast and furious, and from the opposite of the long bar, atop the bar, who walked over toward the small stage. His playing, of course, was without peer, and all eyes followed him make that trip. I can't quite remember how he made from the bar top to the stage, but it was a nice way to start a show that resulted in me putting away my harmonicas for a month and consider trying something else. ---------- ---- ted-burke.com tburke4@san.rr.com
kudzurunner 5013 posts Oct 02, 2014 7:08 AM	How about bar-walking? Please post videos of blues harmonica guys bar-walking.
Bb 349 posts Oct 02, 2014 7:49 AM	I've seen Mikey Junior (look him up) do a thing where he finds a woman in the crowd and plays with his harp buried in her crotch. THAT was badass! and the crowd did go wild. -Bob ---------- http://www.facebook.com/home.php?ref=home#!/pages/Bourbon-Bleach/161722307208585
JustFuya 569 posts Oct 02, 2014 10:07 AM	I used to work with a drummer that back flipped before settling in for the last set. We always drank and frankly it scared me. But he never failed to pull it off. Real crowd pleaser. @Adam - It seems to me that your lay down in the second video was painfully contrived; like you prepared a bed on stage and then went to the floor. Knowing what was coming, I expected you to back away from the crowd, sit on the stage and then fluidly move with the music above ground. You could do the same thing in reverse for the dismount. Much easier on the back and everyone can see. At the other end of the spectrum you have KISS which was always more show than music. Last Edited by JustFuya on Oct 02, 2014 2:42 PM
barbequebob 2725 posts Oct 02, 2014 10:41 AM	I've seen Rod Piazza bar walk a number of times over the years and back in 1984, he was the very first harp player I ever saw using a wireless on a gig ever and he was using a Samson VR-2, which he still uses today and that thing sucks batteries dry at every gig. ---------- Sincerely, Barbeque Bob Maglinte Boston, MA http://www.barbequebob.com CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
FBInsMan 3 posts Oct 02, 2014 11:03 AM	Isn't this one of the all time musical questions. Is the audience there to be entertained by the Music alone, or is the musician there to provide entertainment with the music. In my own mind I break it down like this: Pure Entertainment/Pure Musicianship/Showmanship/or the Mix. For Sheer entertainment I think of Alice Cooper/ Lady Gaga or Gwar. (If you don't know who Gwar is they are a metal band made up of aliens that shoot semen on the crowd during the "show") In all three of these cases the entertainment and show are highlighted over the musicianship. Pure Musicianship. The kind of "show/concert" you go to and close your eyes and you won't miss anything that happens on stage. Music stressed over everything else (no "show"). The extreme spectrum of this would be the symphony orchestra. Showmanship is usually a great musician that puts on a show "supposedly unrehearsed" Artists that fall in to this category are The Aforementioned William Clark, Hendrix, Elvis, Jerry Lee Lewis, etc.etc etc. Where the first idea is to stress the music but somehow during the performance the Musician becomes possessed by the music and starts the "showmanship" dancing, gyrating pelvis, falling on the floor, crying, Smashing up their instruments. The last would be where the band are great musicians but put "show" to the music. examples being The Greatful Dead, Phish, Pink Floyd. Adam, I love it I think you can go with this as much as you want. You sure have the musicianship down. I would agree with eharp about the up and down part. It seems to me your a little too "well this is where I get down on the ground part and this is where I get up" I think you should act more if it's a possession and that the music is taking you down. One knee at a time and then your hand goes down to keep you from falling all the way down sort of thing. I still think it's great though have fun with it. Anyway just some random thoughts from the FNG on the forum. Cheers
STME58 1121 posts Oct 06, 2014 12:35 AM	I am currently reading “Clawing at the Limits of Cool”, by Farah Jasmine Griffin and Salim Washington. I was reminded of this thread when I came across the following passage: “Walking the bar was a practice that was designed to “take house”, or bring in an enthusiastic response from the audience. The saxophonist would not only walk atop the bar while honking and growling through his horn, he would sometimes lie on his back and gyrate his legs while screaming.” This was something Coltrane was required by his employer to do early in his career. The author states he was embarrassed about it but also says, “…it is entirely possible that walking the bar set Coltrane’s chops and expressive palette for the kind of emotional delivery that became his signature.” Last Edited by STME58 on Oct 06, 2014 12:38 AM
kudzurunner 5019 posts Oct 06, 2014 5:10 AM	RJ Smith has a book called The Great Black Way: L.A. in the 1940s and the Lost African-American Renaissance, in which he talks about Big Jay McNeely and his so-called "honking R&B" sax style. I think BBQ Bob has already made the point that a lot of this showmanship comes from that particular area of the musical spectrum: tenor sax men. McNeely took it further than most, and Smith argues the surprising but sensible point that the ultimate origin of his style was Pentecostalism: the Azusa Street Revival of the early 1900s, which brought black southerners and white southerners to L.A. and forged a movement that involved speaking in tongues. Smith connects McNeely and the other chicken-shack honkers with that--and with the tumbling and at the time incomprehensible flurries of notes pouring forth from the beboppers. It's all a version of speaking in tongues, he argues: glossolalia. If you watch the following video, you'll see a somewhat older McNeely reprising his moves with a second sax man. Skip ahead to 1:45 or so and watch what happens. McNeely ends up laying on his back. That's the move I was reprising, in some sense. I completely agree with JustFuya: my own second-ever attempt at moving from a standing position to cold concrete was painfully contrived--and painful! I wish I had the padded landing-mat McNeely has here, and his decades of experience. Baby steps are always awkward. Edited to add: Here's an example of the sort of wild screaming that led Smith to argue for this sort of sax playing as a musical version of speaking in tongues. Check out :38 onward: Take a look at this next video! No ground-rolling, but some major incursion into the audience after 3:30. McNeely was a dynamic performer, a true showman. When a harp player walks into the audience, he's calling on the ghost of McNeely: Last Edited by kudzurunner on Oct 06, 2014 5:27 AM
STME58 1122 posts Oct 06, 2014 9:53 AM	My family attended a Pentecostal church when I was growing up in the 70's and 80's. The McNeely videos, especially the first one, evoke my experiences of the revival meeting. I doubt many of the attendees at the church were aware of the connection Adam mentioned, or that they would take kindly to having it mentioned. From my perspective now, I find it very interesting.
Philosofy 617 posts Oct 25, 2014 1:20 PM	At SPAH this year there was a young harp player/beatboxer, and when he was performing on stage, he started to break dance, with the harp in his mouth. There were several old timers with their mouths agape, and others were laughing hysterically. Two nights later, I was in a jam circle at about 2 am. The guy who played right before me was Mike Caldwell, one of the best country harp players out there (search Youtube for his Orange Blossom Special), and he laid down a blistering solo. As I was getting ready to follow this incredible playing, someone had to rub it in by asking "How are you going to top that???". I knew I couldn't, so, instead of matching Mike's speed, I just played really slow. But halfway through my solo, I ran out of ideas. I just didn't know where to go, but something in my head whispered "Go Backwards." So I did a back roll, spun on the floor, and just breathed in and out of the harp while doing a 52 year old man's impression of break dancing. That's my contribution to stage antics.
dougharps 758 posts Oct 25, 2014 5:30 PM	I think that to make dramatic exhibitions like this work with the crowd you have to have conveyed a stage persona consistent with the music moving you in that way. You have to make it believable that you HAVE to express the spirit of the music in this way. So you have to have built a foundation in playing your songs before the dramatics, a foundation that supports the notion that you are so moved that the music has taken you. To convey this, you are going to have to really feel it and let it happen as a natural result of the music you are playing. So you can plan that you will do this during a performance, but you have to put yourself and the crowd in a place that when you do it, it is real. Method acting... but you have to have the crowd with you before you do it. ---------- Doug S.
eharp 2244 posts Oct 25, 2014 9:26 PM	Bar walking? I was at a Rod Piazza show; sitting at a small front row seat by myself. End of the first set, the band had left the stage and Rod was going it alone. He jumped off the stage and walked thru the 1st couple rows of tables when he stops in front of mine. He looks at the empty seat, which my feet were on, then at me. He's still playing. He looks at the seat and then at me again. I realize he wants the chair so I take my feet off. He jumps onto it. He's still playing. He looks at the stuff I had on the table then at me. I have a small camera w/ tripod on it, a couple of glasses and a partial plate of nachos. He looks at the stuff then at me. he's still playing. He looks at the table then at me again and I realize he wants to stand on the table so I quickly clear the table. Rod is getting ready to step onto the table and I know 2 things he does not: 1) The table is far from level. There are numerous napkins folded up under a leg to TRY to keep it from wobbling. 2) The top isn't exactly secured to the legs. But I can't tell him. He's still playing. He steps onto the table and I brace 2 of the legs with my feet and grab the top to keep the whole thing from collapsing. As he stepped onto the table, the chair falls over. (2 broken glasses.)He looks at me and gives the standard head nod that men do which signifies: 1) Hello 2) Thanks 3) My escape route fell over so you need to move and I will climb down using your chair. He's still playing. I'm in a pickle because I am virtually attached to the table so he doesn't fall. But I stand while getting a better grip on the table to keep it from toppling. Now my seat is available but I am slightly hunched over the table between Rod and his escape. He's still playing. at this point I see a rescue coming. Rod's roadie/merch salesman/towel carrier is running over. All 5'5", 125lb of smoking 60 year old is trotting over. But how hard is it to stand a chair up, right? Well, he had other ideas, I guess as he grabbed hold of the table, too. His idea? "We can do this! Let's lift it on 3!" And he's still playing. Well, I know that he sure aint gonna lift his 1/2, especially when the top is likely to come off (Probably not evenly), nor have we rehearsed this move with safety net and spotters and a Rod stand in. But I am able to move my chair with my feet so Rod has a way down from this predicament that I am 100% sure that he doesn't know he is in. And he's still playing. Anyway, between puffs on his smoke, the brains of this act begins counting, "One." I shake my head "No." "Two." I shake my head "No." As he says either "Three" or "My boss is about to get seriously hurt", I let go of the table with one hand. And the table starts to come apart. Probably due to the weight and the roadie lifting his end and Me holding down my end. And he STOPS playing. But with my free hand, I had reached up and grabbed Rod's arm. I guided, directed or pulled him toward the chair. He stepped/stumbled/fell off the table, which was more of a slide at this point, onto the chair. And the chair tipped over (There goes my nachos) and Rod continues to step/stumble/fall to the floor. I had a good grip of his arm (Yes. I may have left a serious bruise.), but he was standing. And he begins playing. As he moves back towards the stage, he turned and gave me the head nod which means: 1) Thanks 2) Sorry about your nachos 3) DAMN! That was close. The roadie lets go of his end of the table and we now have a nice pile of kindling where my table was. As he picked up the first chair, he looks at me and says, "We coulda done it." I felt bad for him because he sounded so dejected. ("I coulda been a contender," ran thru my mind.) The moral of the story? Like doing the Curly shuffle, before attempting stage tricks, do a little recon and practice. BTW- When Rod took the stage for the second set, he threw me a t-shirt over the rubble that use to be my front row table. I felt like the kid in the Mean Joe Green/Coke commercial.

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